hdtv snobs... i dont understand this.

[hans007]

now every here and now you read an article or forum thread etc about 720p vs 480p vs 1080i etc etc.

anyhow, i dont get the people who basically sit there and go 480p is not HD it is crap crap crap crap etc. then they say 720p is a huge difference. I don't know i've seen the photos of 720p xbox360 vs 480p and you'd have to have a 60inch plasma and reallyr eally really look hard to notice.


so i'm thinking does anyone here really notice the difference. i suppose i cant really compare as my tv is a 480p/1080i mitsubishi crt projection. but the thing that gets me is how the hdtv snob types say that 1080i is HD and 480p is not when 1080i looks exactly like 480p (my tv supports both and i've tried this with my xbox 360 and normal xbox).

anyhow, seeing as dvds are 480p and digital cable is 480p i dont understand what all the fuss is about with this EDTV bashing.

oh well sorry just a little rant, was just reading on some site how some gamecube's have 480p support and there were about a million comments saying it still sucks because it is not 720p.

 

[rbV5]

It depends on a lot of factors, but 480p vs 720p is similar to gaming at 640x480 vs 1280x1024. Most of the time thats going to be noticable on a decent display, just like watching the Superbowl in 720p vs SD 480p broadcast...its noticable.

 

[sindows]

I'm not a HD snob but keep watching HD programming for a long period of time and then switch back to SD. I'm sure you'll notice the difference once your eyes get used to the higher resolution. Same thing with games, once I keep playing at 1280x1024, I can't go back to say 800x600 because it looks so much worse.

 

[jamesbond007]

It's all about the e-penis!

 

[stelleg151]

Originally posted by: rbV5
It depends on a lot of factors, but 480p vs 720p is similar to gaming at 640x480 vs 1280x1024. Most of the time thats going to be noticable on a decent display, just like watching the Superbowl in 720p vs SD 480p broadcast...its noticable.

I feel like there are different versions of 480p. 480p, for quicktime trailers is widescreen, so that comparison doesnt really work(the width must be 16/9).

That aside, I have seen SD tv on an HDtv set and it does look like crap. But watching quicktime trailers in 480p is a different story entirely. I think SD must be either crappified 480p, or 480i, and also it also must have far less pixels since it isnt widescreen.

Anyways, I feel like there are different forms of 480*, and I agree that the widescreen 480p looks fine to me, but I am sure that sitting in front of a 50" lcd, the difference would be clear.

 

[Sonikku]

For the record, DVD is actually mastered in 480i. If you're displaying it in 480p, your player is simply taking a 480i source and scaling it up to 480p. The source itself is not progressive.

 

[xtknight]

I can hardly notice anything watching Jay Leno or Conan 'O Brien in 480p vs. 720p.

 

[mwmorph]

I notice a big difference between 1080i and 480i and a smaller difference between 480i and 480p. Maybe you sit realyl far away from your tv, or maybe your tv jast sucks but there is a huge difference on my 53" on 480i and 1080i. 480i looks pixelated even at 10 feet away. 1080i looks great.

 

[Cheesetogo]

I notice a huge difference between 480p tv and 720p hd, but for some reason I have trouble telling 480p dvd from 720p. Also whats strange is that 640x480 in a computer game looks like crap to me, but 1280x960 seems much better.

 

[imported_ST]

First please refer to http://www.atsc.org/standards/a_53d.pdf (page 38) for ATSC HDTV formats (480p/720p/1080p).

Secondarily, what is the native source you are projecting? If it is DVD material it is 480i and the projection quality to higher formats (720p/1080p) is COMPLETELY dependent on your deinterlacer / scaler. Now on the other hand, if you are viewing native 480p/720p/1080p material, there is a noticeable difference if your set is capable of displaying it natively (pixel mapped 1:1). Any set incapable of displaying the higher format natively will be downscaled and the difference will be neglibile. This is the reason why newer 1080p native panels are so popular this coming year; it allows viewing of 1080p source material in its full resolution.

 

[dguy6789]

Some clarification of hdtv standards.

The names are specific and absolute, there is no various types of 480p and whatnot.

480i=640X480 with interlacing
480P=640X480 with progressive scan
720P=1280X720 with progressive scan
1080i=1920X1080 with interlacing
1080P=1920X1080 with progressive scan.

 

[Human582]

How 480p is encoded makes a big difference. H.264 480P is going to look a lot better than MPEG2 480p.

 

[Tom]

Originally posted by: dguy6789
Some clarification of hdtv standards.

The names are specific and absolute, there is no various types of 480p and whatnot.

480i=640X480 with interlacing
480P=640X480 with progressive scan
720P=1280X720 with progressive scan
1080i=1920X1080 with interlacing
1080P=1920X1080 with progressive scan.

I have a question about 1080i on an LCD TV. I have a 32in Olevia and what I wonder about is how interlacing works on an LCD, because there is not even a hint of flickering, like I can see on a CRT monitor or regular TV, when they are dsiplaying an interlaced picture.

Is it really possible to see a difference in the picture between 1080i and 1080p, on an LCD screen ?

 

[JonnyBlaze]

lcds always display a progressive image. they accept interlaced formats but then convert it to its native resolution. you wont ever notice flicker.
yes, there is a big difference between 1080i & 1080p.

 

[rbV5]

Originally posted by: dguy6789
Some clarification of hdtv standards.

The names are specific and absolute, there is no various types of 480p and whatnot.

480i=640X480 with interlacing
480P=640X480 with progressive scan
720P=1280X720 with progressive scan
1080i=1920X1080 with interlacing
1080P=1920X1080 with progressive scan.

Actually, there are 18 described ATSC formats compared to a single NTSC format. Check this chart for reference. Link

 

[rbV5]

Originally posted by: Human582
How 480p is encoded makes a big difference. H.264 480P is going to look a lot better than MPEG2 480p.

It could look better or worse, H264 and MPEG2 are compression formats and don't speak to picture quality at all. A more accurate statement would be that encoded H264 could look ~ MPEG2 using the same source footage at a much smaller filesize.

 

[jiffylube1024]

Originally posted by: Cheesetogo
I notice a huge difference between 480p tv and 720p hd, but for some reason I have trouble telling 480p dvd from 720p. Also whats strange is that 640x480 in a computer game looks like crap to me, but 1280x960 seems much better.

Probably because DVD is only 720X480 (16:9) or 852X480 (2.35:1) to begin with. DVD upconversion is a nice feature to accomodate laggy upconverters on fixed pixel displays (eg DLP's, etc) but it can't increase the resolution that DVD is stored in.

 

[Wreckage]

The PS3 is supposed to run at 1080p. This should look pretty impressive on a nice Sony or Sharp LCD display.

 

[dguy6789]

Originally posted by: rbV5

Originally posted by: dguy6789
Some clarification of hdtv standards.

The names are specific and absolute, there is no various types of 480p and whatnot.

480i=640X480 with interlacing
480P=640X480 with progressive scan
720P=1280X720 with progressive scan
1080i=1920X1080 with interlacing
1080P=1920X1080 with progressive scan.

Actually, there are 18 described ATSC formats compared to a single NTSC format. Check this chart for reference. Link

Well it looks like the only difference between all of those and what I mentioned is that they mention framerate while mine does not. The discussion in this thread appears to need no framerate related information, so the information I provided should prove to be more than satisfactory.

 

[Aonghasan]

All I have to say is.. if 480p looks exactly like 1080i on your TV, your eyes need to be checked, or your TV sucks or is broken.

Huge difference I have seen between 480p and 1080i on Hitachi, Toshiba, and sony TV's. Now I have seen alot of Mitsubishi TV's and they do not impress me @ all. A buddie had a 70 or 73" diamond line HDTV and the picture looked bad and the guns popped and leaked all over the the inside of the TV 2x, and now the tv is gone and all he has left is store credit. I was recently in Magnolia Hi-fi, and the Samsungs, Sony's and Mitsubishi's were all side by side. The Mitsubishi's picture was grainy while the others were crystal clear.

 

[imported_ST]

Originally posted by: Wreckage
The PS3 is supposed to run at 1080p. This should look pretty impressive on a nice Sony or Sharp LCD display.

Too bad, NO present Sony OR Sharp LCD supports 1080p native 1:1 pixel mapping input (without some hacks).

 

[SynthDude2001]

I don't call 480p "crap", but it definitely looks inferior to 720p/1080i

 

[PrayForDeath]

Originally posted by: xtknight
I can hardly notice anything watching Jay Leno or Conan 'O Brien in 480p vs. 720p.

480p
720p

Night and day to me.

 

[Ronin]

Originally posted by: SynthDude2001
I don't call 480p "crap", but it definitely looks inferior to 720p/1080i

No doubt. There's a distinquishable difference between 480 and the rest. I can't wait until HD programming becomes the standard, rather than the randomness it is now.

 

[PrayForDeath]

sorry dp