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Have you guys seen this "dreadlocks girl" from SanFran U?

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Protip: white people with dreadlocks get judged too.

Is the problem that black people with dreadlocks get judged, or is the problem that different cultures borrow from each other sometimes?
 
Protip: white people with dreadlocks get judged too.

Is the problem that black people with dreadlocks get judged, or is the problem that different cultures borrow from each other sometimes?

Yes, this is the big disconnect here. According to the girl's definition, the identity that's appropriated is when it's considered high-fashion, cool, or funny when other races wear it.

So here's a poll: anyone here who thinks that white guy with dreadlocks in the video looked high-fashion, cool, or funny, please raise your hand.

And there you go, the proof we need to determine that no cultural appropriation is happening in this video.
 
It was a rhetorical question.

People are going to borrow from each other's cultures all the time - nothing can stop that. Nor should it.

What needs to stop is people being judged because of their skin. That is the real problem.

Accusing people of cultural appropriation does not and will never solve the real issue - that people are judged by the colour of the skin.

Also bear in mind, cultural appropriation has now been defined by the liberals to include yoga. JStorm, who is being negatively affected by yoga? How is it cultural appropriation?
 
Fashion publications and other media are those responsible for praising certain features on women who are mostly white while not acknowledging (thinking its negative) minority women with those same features. White is already the standard of beauty. If you say its not, you are lying.

White is the standard for many things, mainly because there are more white people than anything else at the moment. From emoji's on phones to cards at Hallmark.

Historically, black women (black people, in general) have been mocked for their features, full lips, wide hips, big butts, and kinky or curly hair....all have been seen as negatives. But, I can pick up an issue of Teen vogue and see some bullshit article about how white girls are inspiring people to have fuller lips and bigger butts.

Historically people have been mocked for about everything you can think of. People with a 'southern twang'? Mocked for being stupid without any facts to back it up. But I see you're dwelling on the past, using 'historically'.

If all you took away from my statement was that white women are always praised for their looks...you're intentionally being obtuse. That's not what I said. I was speaking to a specific issue that is very real.

I understand the point of the video and what you're saying. I was replying to another who claimed that white women are praised for big lips and asses where black women have "disgusting comments" made about them. My response was that good and bad comments are made of each. I personally love big lips and ass on whatever color.

As Amandla explained in her video..its linked in the first page of this thread...which you obviously have not watched is that "Appropriation occurs when a style leads to racist generalizations or stereotypes where it originated but is deemed as high-fashion, cool or funny when the privileged take it for themselves". I think you're smart enough to comprehend that statement. Let me know if you still want to be obtuse.

As I said, I understand the point of it. I just think it is hypocritical viewpoint to have. Black women having blonde hair? A-ok, white women with dreads, equal to blackface. Seriously? C'mon now.


Skin bleaching is very dangerous for the skin. Many people do it because darker skin is seen as a negative in many countries. In Asia, there are so many cosmetic brands selling lightening cream. White skin is something Asians are very adamant about. It has become so pervasive in Asian culture that many of the models you will see in the media in Asian often have white skin. The pursuit of white beauty has also lead to a booming cosmetic surgery industry in Asia where women are often going under the knife to get features that are associated with white people.

Skin bleaching creams are also readily available across Africa, The Caribbean, and Brazil. People are bleaching their skin because lighter skin is deemed as beautiful and darker skin is not. I find it hilarious that you brought this up as an example of cultural appropriation when its actually a very sad example of how desperate people are to be more white/beautiful/attractive. Once again, the fashion industry and other media outlets are feeding into unhealthy images of what is beautiful and what is not. People are willing to put things that probably have carcinogens on their face just to be "better" looking.

....and there's also the fact that many brown skinned people who grace the covers of popular or high fashion publications often have their images photoshopped to give them lighter skin. You can find PLENTY of examples of that.

I brought it up because it is hypocritical. Nigeria has the highest percentage of women using bleach, at 77%. I have been there on multiple occasions as saw it first hand.

My whole point and how I feel, is that people have the freedom to wear whatever the hell they want when not intentionally making fun of a culture. Even then they do, but should expect backlash. In the video she wasn't doing anything disrespectful.

I understand the plight of different hairstyles. My wife currently has long braids down to her ass with about 7 dirty blonde strands mixed in. She was worried her boss wouldn't let her have it for work, but she didn't say anything. She was worried it would be to ghetto for work. My wife catches shit all the time for "acting white". Because she drives a Mercedes, carries a coach purse, drinks Starbucks, wears Northface, has a Masters and speaks properly. And it pisses me off. Because to some people black people are supposed to be a certain way, and if not then they're being a traitor. In my experience it usually comes from the black side, not always. Black people will call others too dark, too light, too this, too that. There are songs about having the right or wrong skin tone. I know where it stems from, but we aren't there anymore. I catch it from time to time for what I wear too. Every race catches shit from different things they do/are. That's just facts.

Bottom line for me is, if a white person wants to wear dreads? Fine. I don't like it myself, but it's their choice. If a black person wants to have blonde hair? Fine. Straight hair? Fine. People need to loosen up, it's just fucking hair. Yes I see the 'big picture' of the debate. We don't live in the past though. If I had been the girl in the video I would have said go fuck yourself and been on my way.
 

http://blackgirllonghair.com/2012/0...ck-women-spend-more-time-money-on-their-hair/

You must not know many black women because you should not have needed a source.



Did I say that? No. It could be 10% of blacks. That's still millions of people.

Ok, so now your argument is that some of a large population think black people are ugly. If that is true that is sad. Your statement was of "they" which denotes a majority view. How many do you feel hate themselves because of their racial features? Also source.

Oh, so they don't hate natural hair, they just prefer not to have it.

You're playing semantics now. That's boring.

Lol I'm the one playing semantics. When a girl with strait hair curls her hair, its not because she hates anything, its because she wants to curl her hair at that time. God you are dumb.


Only black people are made fun of for eating fried chicken. Why is that? If it's because of their higher than average fried chicken consumption, please provide evidence for this claim.

HAHA you still dont get it. You said that racism is all about looks. I gave you an example of a racist statement that has nothing to do with looks and you want me to defend why its not racist. HAHAHAHA.



You have this insane fear and reverence for the word "racist" as if hearing it is the worst thing a person could endure.

WTF. What are you talking about. I have used the word many many times to describe people. Even my own family. I also think racism is a spectrum which means its not the worst or best of anything. There are worse things out there than being a racist. I would much rather a nation of racist than rapists or murderers.

You are amazing.
 
I gotta say. ANYONE and i mean ANYONE that gives another shit over fried chicken is going to hell.

really! fried chicken is a gift from god. A crunchy, yummy gift from God.


ok..

as for the dreads? wear what the fuck you want. NO culture owns anything. fuck those that say they do. fucking racist assholes.
 
i would just like to thank everyone in this thread for such an amusing topic. i just read through most of it and had A LOT of lulz!
 
I gotta say. ANYONE and i mean ANYONE that gives another shit over fried chicken is going to hell.

really! fried chicken is a gift from god. A crunchy, yummy gift from God.


ok..

as for the dreads? wear what the fuck you want. NO culture owns anything. fuck those that say they do. fucking racist assholes.

I ate fried chicken last night!
 
I've tried to explain the issue but people here refuse to see. I'll try again with a simple sentence.

Some people are angry that when they wear their cultural identity it has a negative effect on their inclusion in the broader culture but when those same cultural identities are used by people in power they don't face those same stereotypes.

Does this make sense? Or are we going to keep brining up things like yoga as if we understand the issue?

Great summary on the mechanism of outrage. I'm still working through both perspectives, but I know there is alot going on with this issue.
 
Great summary on the mechanism of outrage. I'm still working through both perspectives, but I know there is alot going on with this issue.

Then the issue has nothing to do with cultural appropriation. Racist people will find any excuse to be racist. If style x is identified as black and a white person wears that style, a racist will view it differently.

Being upset that there are white rappers is stupid. In the video that storm posted that is brought up as an issue by one of the women. She felt it diluted black culture. It does and that is fucking great. As I said before, that is what we want. You want cultures to spread positive influence.

When people are offended by a person from another culture doing something they view as inherent to a different culture they are being fucking stupid. As I said to storm, if you want to view a style as being for blacks only, well then welcome to segregation. The blacks get x and the whites get y. Not going to work out for the group that only makes up 12 of the population though.

We need to move away from an us vs them mentality. Cant do that if we say some things are for blacks only.
 
real you completely miss her point.

You say that, and then give me nothing to understand what I am missing. Why are you commenting and giving me nothing to go on? How do you justify posting your comment?

Take my posts. I explain how I understood the video. I then build my argument based on that understanding and also ask if you agree. You say you don't, but then give nothing as to explain why. Don't just say I am wrong, explain why I am wrong.

I'm not on the side of defending racism. I'm not asking you to invest a bunch of time explaining something that will be missed because the other person is a racist. Don't judge me by the actions of others.
 
If you are being intentionally obtuse then its pointless for me to keep saying the same thing over and over again.
 
You say that, and then give me nothing to understand what I am missing. Why are you commenting and giving me nothing to go on? How do you justify posting your comment?

Take my posts. I explain how I understood the video. I then build my argument based on that understanding and also ask if you agree. You say you don't, but then give nothing as to explain why. Don't just say I am wrong, explain why I am wrong.

I'm not on the side of defending racism. I'm not asking you to invest a bunch of time explaining something that will be missed because the other person is a racist. Don't judge me by the actions of others.

I've seen the video as well, and I've read your interpretation of it which is stated in your post 291. It isn't really an accurate interpretation of the video. You basically see the argument being made as: black people have been subjected to racism, and hence they are allowed to have things of their own. When white people appropriate those things, they are taking away something which belongs to the black community (you call it "watering down" - a term not used in the video).

What the video actually says is the problem is not white people adopting styles which originated in the black community per se. It's that these things are viewed negatively when seen on black people, but when a white person adopts it, it is seen as positive. The example shehateme gave was thick lips - a trait which has been disparaged in conjunction with black people, but when a white model like Kylie Jenner gets her lips pumped up through an artificial procedure, people think its cool, fashionable, sexy, whatever. That is the point being made in the video. The implication being that if these traits were not viewed negatively when associated with blacks, there wouldn't be a problem with white people imitating them. It's only because they are viewed negatively in conjunction with one ethnic group but positively in conjunction with another that is a problem.

To be clear, though I do understand this argument, I do not necessarily agree with it. One problem is that it isn't the fault of the white person wearing the dreadlocks or thickening their lips. Those people aren't being racist. They are imitating, which in most cases is a form of flattery. People adopt styles they like. They must have liked it when they saw it among black people or they probably wouldn't have adopted it for themselves, so these particular white people are not the ones who have disparaged the trait among blacks. The problem is the double standard, but the double standard is not the fault of the specific white people who are adopting these things. They should be criticizing the double standard, not the white people wearing the dreadlocks or corn rows. So I think it's a valid point that is perhaps being misdirected.

I'm also not sure of the extent of the double standard or whether it really applies evenly across all these different traits. So with the lips example, I would point out that artificially inflated lips look no more like naturally thick lips than breast implants look like natural breasts. It looks totally different. If you took a black woman who had naturally thin lips then injected them to make them thicker, the lips would look more like Kylie Jenner's, not like the lips of other black women with naturally thick lips. Artificial lips are meant to look pillowy and inviting - in other words, sexy. It isn't really a form of cultural appropriation like with corn rows. Kylie Jenner probably got her lips injected to look sexy, not to look black. Either way, it doesn't look the same. Corn rows, which this same model has also worn, is probably a better example.

I guess what I'm saying is that I understand the double standard argument. I'm just not sure it applies across the board. It may have something to do with the particulars of the trait in question. Ever seen a white person with an afro? I recall seeing some back in the 70's when the style was popular among blacks. While I was never a fan of afros, it looked particularly ridiculous on white people and I can't recall anyone thinking it looked better on whites than blacks.

What people think is cool or attractive is more complicated than just racial politics.
 
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If you are being intentionally obtuse then its pointless for me to keep saying the same thing over and over again.

I am not. Again, do not judge me from the actions of others. If you think my explanation of the video is wrong, then explain why. The reason I give my summary of her views is to have them challenged if they are wrong. I freely gave you what you would need to correct me if you choose to do so. You seem to believe I am wrong but are only willing to say I am wrong.

How can I tell if you have a valid reason that could lead to better understanding on my part, vs you just saying something without evidence or reason?
 
Its one thing not to agree with the argument and another to not understand what the argument is after so much. lol. Thanks for making another attempt.
 
The argument is based on a lie. No one has provided evidence beyond anecdotes about pop stars that "black hair" hurts black people in terms of job interviews or whatever else, while helping white people. Until someone provides any kind of reasonable evidence supporting that claim, I'll believe that it's just something that insecure people have invented in their mind to justify their own failures in life.

I mean, who gives a fuck about the 18 year old daughter of a tranny and a Kardashian? She looks like she's in her mid 30s in her Wikipedia picture. I think her lips look fucking absurd and I find it extremely doubtful that claims of her beauty go beyond her own celebrity connections. A lot of talentless gossip mag types have a "successful" clothesline or cosmetic branch for a while until it's realized to be a sham and collapses. I can Google "kylie jenner lips" and get results from such esteemed websites as TMZ, Seventeen, and Jezebel. Who is actually jealous of that? Be jealous of her money and name, not her god damned face.
 
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