Haswell i3-4150 vs FX 8320/e for budget gaming rig?

[AtenRa]

This Cinebench cheats garbage has been repeatedly debunked. http://www.realworldtech.com/forum/?threadid=135978&curpostid=136051

The only "evidence" that ever existed for it was CPUID strings found in a hex editor after someone decompiled the binaries. Because having a string value to identify between AMD / Intel chips MUST BE cheating. It certainly couldn't be so that the program knows what name to display or any other number of reasons why you'd want to identify the user's processor in a processor benchmark program...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzLxCo5qofo

From maxon themselves, Cinema 4D is Intel optimized to the bone

 

[ShintaiDK]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzLxCo5qofo

From maxon themselves, Cinema 4D is Intel optimized to the bone

But thats not related to Cinebench.

Cinema 4D uses AVX/AVX2/FMA as well.

 

[TheELF]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzLxCo5qofo

From maxon themselves, Cinema 4D is Intel optimized to the bone

Sooooooo......what you say is the intel compiler which is used by almost every software company in the world gives a lot more performance to intel,and that's the reason why people should buy amd????
Cinebench just became much more relevant as an benchmark since almost every software you run will use similar code.

He says in the video that they work with intel because intel has a lot of tools that let programmers really monitor and analyse performance and threads so they can make better software.Where are amd's tools to do the same?
It's not intel's fault that amd focuses only on mantle.

 

[tential]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzLxCo5qofo

From maxon themselves, Cinema 4D is Intel optimized to the bone

Doesn't that make me want an intel processor even more? Because people generally optimize for the most sold processor. Not only are intel processors faster, people will optimize for them more too.

If I had an AMD processor I wouldn't get nearly the same perf I get in Dolphin (small example I know), because people own intel processors so they optimize for it. Barely anyone owns the AMD processors so much less dev time is spent on them.
Haswell is amazing in that emulator because that's what people have.

Not everyone is trying to launch a crusade. Some of us just want the best product available.

 

[Enigmoid]

If a single benchmark changes from considerably faster on one brand to considerably faster on other brand you know that there is something fishy about it.

Why the first version run slower on the second brand? Why it suddenly works faster? What changed? Why it changed? Which brand is actually faster?

Basic summary of the article

-ICC creates the fastest code by anywhere from 20-60%
-Base ICC gives much bigger benefits to PII or BD than SB
-Intel optimized ICC generates much better code for PII and SB and poor code for BD. Likely because PII is much closer to SB in execution (no modules). The difference between PII and SB is not statistically significant
-ICC feature optimized sometimes works better on BD than intel optimized and sometimes the same. BD and SB are competitive now. Generally BD is better on these settings than intel default. SB is significantly worse.

I'm not seeing any indication that ICC is biased anywhere on these tests. It appears that ICC doesn't do well with module based architectures. It produces the best code however.

 

[AtenRa]

But thats not related to Cinebench.

Cinema 4D uses AVX/AVX2/FMA as well.

Cinebench is using Cinema 4D.

 

[AtenRa]

Sooooooo......what you say is the intel compiler which is used by almost every software company in the world gives a lot more performance to intel,and that's the reason why people should buy amd????
Cinebench just became much more relevant as an benchmark since almost every software you run will use similar code.

He says in the video that they work with intel because intel has a lot of tools that let programmers really monitor and analyse performance and threads so they can make better software.Where are amd's tools to do the same?
It's not intel's fault that amd focuses only on mantle.

Intel tools are optimized for Intel mArchitecture. They are specifically created to help leverage Intel mArchitecture designs. By using all those Intel optimized tools, Cinema 4D is Intel mArchitecture optimized. Making Cinebench an Intel heavily optimized Benchmark.

 

[mrmt]

He says in the video that they work with intel because intel has a lot of tools that let programmers really monitor and analyse performance and threads so they can make better software.Where are amd's tools to do the same?
It's not intel's fault that amd focuses only on mantle.

When you acquire a processor, you are not acquiring a simple piece of silicon, but generating a relationship with the IHV that sold you, access to its software ecosystem, support, warranty, etc. It doesn't matter whether it is possible to extract more performance from AMD processors because nobody, not even AMD itself, seems to be committed to spend money in developing these optimizations for AMD processors, while we can count on the entire PC ecosystem to spend money to optimize for Intel processors (because this is where the money is).

This whole benchmark whining is consequence of a much more fundamental problem for AMD : The more they differentiate themselves from comparable Intel processors for a given market bracket, the more its processors will suffer from lack of optimizations because AMD itself cannot afford it and software developers won't bother with optimizing for 10-15% of the x86 market.

 

[AtenRa]

Doesn't that make me want an intel processor even more? Because people generally optimize for the most sold processor. Not only are intel processors faster, people will optimize for them more too.

If you are using Cinema 4D then yes by all means go with Intel because it is heavily optimized for Intel mArchitecture.

If I had an AMD processor I wouldn't get nearly the same perf I get in Dolphin (small example I know), because people own intel processors so they optimize for it. Barely anyone owns the AMD processors so much less dev time is spent on them.
Haswell is amazing in that emulator because that's what people have.

Not everyone is trying to launch a crusade. Some of us just want the best product available.

There are countless programs that are not heavily and specifically optimized for Intel. Pov-Ray for example is not optimized for Intel only, same with x264 etc etc.

 

[TheELF]

If you are using Cinema 4D then yes by all means go with Intel because it is heavily optimized for Intel mArchitecture.

Cinema 4d is the only program using intel compiler?
I bet 99% of professional software is made with this.

 

[AtenRa]

Cinema 4d is the only program using intel compiler?
I bet 99% of professional software is made with this.

Its not only the compiler, Cinema 4D is using the majority of Intel tools that are specifically created to extract the highest performance from the Intel mArchitectures. Especially vTune performance analyzer.

 

[BSim500]

"Being surprised" that a market share of 85% attracts predominant compiling for that market (especially for +95% major professional apps) is like "being surprised" that water is wet... I don't recall anywhere near as much "sour grapes" sulking over "evil Intel compilers" when AMD Athlon 64's were beating Intel P4's in Intel compiled benchmarks of the day. People should be lobbying AMD for better compiler support & faster cores - not whining because Intel isn't voluntarily slowing down their own chips on their own compiler out of some fake "equality" drive to "match" it to AMD's (lack of) compiler optimization support.

 

[AtenRa]

double post

 

[Erenhardt]

I don't recall anywhere near as much "sour grapes" sulking over "evil Intel compilers" when AMD Athlon 64's were beating Intel P4's in Intel compiled benchmarks of the day.

Good you brough this up!

You can grab 15$ from intel if you have bought P4.
http://www.extremetech.com/computin...ners-over-amd-athlon-benchmarking-shenanigans

 

[tential]

Good you brough this up!

You can grab 15$ from intel if you have bought P4.
http://www.extremetech.com/computin...ners-over-amd-athlon-benchmarking-shenanigans

I think back in the P4 days though we knew something fishy was going on with Intel. A LOT of fishy things happened back then from them as they tried to hold onto selling the P4 vs AMD.
There were even rumors started that AMD funded terrorism(not from intel itself).

 

[Abwx]

But thats not related to Cinebench.

Cinema 4D uses AVX/AVX2/FMA as well.

Doesnt look like it s the case, Cinbench 11.5 use SSE2 and likely that R15 doesnt go over SSE3, on the other hand, according to a member here, Povray make use of AVX.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Cinebench is using Cinema 4D.

Cinebench isnt using AVX etc. So they are not the same.

 

[Abwx]

Cinebench isnt using AVX etc. So they are not the same.

They are the same, Cinebench is a rendering done with Maxxon s Cinema 4D rendering engine, other brands like 3DS Max may do usage of more advanced instructions like AVX/FMA if we are to look at the successive uarches scores in 3DS Max benches, yes there s also benches made with this soft but there s not a single metric like Cinebench where the user has no control over the bench settings.

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/924-9/rendu-3d-mental-ray-v-ray.html

 

[crashtech]

Abwx is just here to generate clicks for hardware.fr. There's no other rational explanation. And to think I have clicked on the links, time and time again. No more.

 

[tential]

Abwx is just here to generate clicks for hardware.fr. There's no other rational explanation. And to think I have clicked on the links, time and time again. No more.

If a user is too lazy to embed an image than I'm not going to clink on their link.

 

[crashtech]

They are not images. They're articles about hardware, in French.

 

[tential]

They are not images. They're articles about hardware, in French.

I mean he could paraphrase the article and embed the corresponding images right? Then link the site for reference. That's why I would do anyway.

 

[ShintaiDK]

They are the same, Cinebench is a rendering done with Maxxon s Cinema 4D rendering engine, other brands like 3DS Max may do usage of more advanced instructions like AVX/FMA if we are to look at the successive uarches scores in 3DS Max benches, yes there s also benches made with this soft but there s not a single metric like Cinebench where the user has no control over the bench settings.

Your conspiracy theory is still wrong. Cinebench runs the exact same instructions and the compiler with the best performance for AMD is also used. There is no magic pixie dust waiting to be "unlocked" for AMD.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Abwx is just here to generate clicks for hardware.fr. There's no other rational explanation. And to think I have clicked on the links, time and time again. No more.

It is extremely odd, thats for sure. And most of the time its garbage links.

 

[Abwx]

They are not images. They're articles about hardware, in French.

I linked to the two benches, i guess that it wasnt difficult to...guess, as to generate clicks on hardware.fr, well i didnt thought about it, quite original conspiracy theory.