Has power corrupted Obama? Change, indeed!

[ayabe]

I read this and the only thing I can think of is simpleton. To each their own I guess.

Well then perhaps you should up the ante, please provide some evidence that slicing someone's nutsack is:

1. Not torture

2. Necessary for the protection of the United States.

Otherwise, you're the one pushing the simpleton's argument of fear and bedwetting.

 

[IGBT]

he was rotten in the crib.

 

[blackangst1]

Well then perhaps you should up the ante, please provide some evidence that slicing someone's nutsack is:

1. Not torture

2. Necessary for the protection of the United States.

Otherwise, you're the one pushing the simpleton's argument of fear and bedwetting.

Sure, as soon as you provide proof it was anyone but the local field office's decision.

 

[bamacre]

I am an idealistic dreamer who dreams of a better day brought to me by a true and sincere third party, but alas there is no change. The religion of the OLD GODS is too strong and we are destined to bounce between left pillar and right post forever.

The more things don't change the more they remain the same.

Oh Great Universe, you are an eternity of tears. Ron Paul, why have you abandoned me?

All I ever wanted was change, to change the Republicans back into fiscal responsibility, but alas and alack, there is no change.

Damnit, why does bamacre have to keep pointing out that I was so incredibly wrong about the "tidal wave of change that is coming?"

It wouldn't be so bad if he were quoting Rush or O'Reilly, but that son of a bitch is using Huffington and Greenwald. How the hell am I supposed to deal with that? Why can't he be like the other right-wing nutjobs and talk about birth certificates and death panels? Why can't he be pro-war? Hate gays? Those people are so easy to handle, I look good, and the Democrats look good, next to those clowns. But this son of a bitch has to come in here and make me look like a damn fool. Screw you, bamacre, screw you!


See how easy that is, Moonie? :biggrin:

 

[DuffmanOhYeah]

I just stumbled across an excellent article on this:


My best hope at this point is that the Obama presidency will wake the population up to the fact that our government only very loosely resembles what is taught in civics classes.

Whoever wrote that article was lazy at best, or at worst outright disingenuous.

1. To say that the government bureaucracy is laden with "Bush-Cheney" supporters is laughable. Federal workers skew overwhelmingly Democratic.

2. Any "Bush-Cheney" appointments are political appointees, the vast majority of whom are dismissed by the incoming administration.

 

[lupi]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What an absurd thing to say lupi, Obama was never part of chicago machine politics and was instead a community organizers working from the fringe. And his main tool was consensus building.

Yeah it's absurd, absurd that those he mentored from and continue to associate with are firmly planted hip deep in the political mud that emanates from that cesspool and wouldn't be heavily influenced by them; influenced enough to continue using them as close advisors in his current role.

 

[TheSkinsFan]

Well then perhaps you should up the ante, please provide some evidence that slicing someone's nutsack is:

1. Not torture

2. Necessary for the protection of the United States.

Otherwise, you're the one pushing the simpleton's argument of fear and bedwetting.

/tangent

You should probably wait for the full text of the CIA report to be released before you go running around stating that US agents sliced anyones nuts. Just sayin'...

 

[blackangst1]

/tangent

You should probably wait for the full text of the CIA report to be released before you go running around stating that US agents sliced anyones nuts. Just sayin'...

But a source *I* trust printed it!!!!1111oneoneone

 

[shira]

It is cute that people thought anything would be different though. Cute in the same way that a child believes Scruffy is "wrestling" with the neighbor's Labrador. That special innocence of an immature mind.

Depends what you mean by "different." Politics is going to pretty much be the same, regardless of who's in office. But the political agenda of the Obama Administration is clearly different from Bush's.

Think we'd have a major health care initiative under Bush?

Think Sotomayor would be a Supreme Court justice now, or that other left-of-center justices will be nominated throughout the federal judiciary, if Bush were still in office?

Think that Don't Ask Don't Tell would end under Bush?

Think the Bush tax cuts for the rich would be allowed to expire?

I could go on and on. Of course there are major differences; it's just the methods that stay the same.

 

[blackangst1]

Depends what you mean by "different." Politics is going to pretty much be the same, regardless of who's in office. But the political agenda of the Obama Administration is clearly different from Bush's.

Think we'd have a major health care initiative under Bush?

Think Sotomayor would be a Supreme Court justice now, or that other left-of-center justices will be nominated throughout the federal judiciary, if Bush were still in office?

Think that Don't Ask Don't Tell would end under Bush?

Think the Bush tax cuts for the rich would be allowed to expire?

I could go on and on. Of course there are major differences; it's just the methods that stay the same.

Fair points; however, opinions whether they should or shouldnt.

1. probably not, but its about time.
2. Loaded question, really.
3. Probably not, and it shouldnt.
4. Probably not, and they shouldnt.

 

[Modelworks]

I think Obama had good intentions going in but didn't fully realize the mess he was in for when in office. The one thing I dislike about him is he appears to have no backbone. If someone goes against him on something he is more likely to back down and take their viewpoint than to stand up and fight it.

 

[ayabe]

Sure, as soon as you provide proof it was anyone but the local field office's decision.

OK so it did happen then right? Seems to contrast with your later statement.

Another cowardly dodge, nice one.

 

[ayabe]

/tangent

You should probably wait for the full text of the CIA report to be released before you go running around stating that US agents sliced anyones nuts. Just sayin'...

Why so I can get more gory details? I know it hurts your pride, but we tortured people and despite more evidence being presented on a daily basis, you all just keep digging in.

Just sayin....

 

[OCGuy]

Well let's see for starters:


5. Get us out of Iraq and Afghanistan - like he said he would.

Uhh....links to where he said he would get out of Afghanistan?

Actually he promised to continue that one.

 

[shira]

Fair points; however, opinions whether they should or shouldnt.

1. probably not, but its about time.
2. Loaded question, really.
3. Probably not, and it shouldnt.
4. Probably not, and they shouldnt.

Well, now you're getting into the details of the differences. That's half of the other ATPN threads, where you and I and everyone else here make our partisan-hack posts. If Obama were the same, we'd all be twiddling our thumbs agreeing with one another - and bored sh!tless.

 

[Craig234]

Did you even read the article or the OP? Bamacre didn't say that Obama was as bad as Bush and yes, the article points at his hypocrisy.

Did you?

That's the only point he made in the short OP, I'll repeat his commentary in full:

"If one were to say, here or elsewhere, that the Obama administration has been worse than the previous one, they'd catch a lot of slack for it. And rightfully so. But Obama has at least 3 and probably 7 more years in office, and it seems like he's trying very hard to make that statement true. "

Nowhere did the links say anything about Obama being worse than Bush overall - the OP was the one who raised that claim, and implied the links said the same.

The fact that he said he's worse if he continues the same policies doesn't change his point that he's worse.

That's a major misrepresentaiton of the links' authors' views as I explained in my post, where they do not say or agree - they disagree - that Obama is worse overall.

 

[blackangst1]

OK so it did happen then right? Seems to contrast with your later statement.

Another cowardly dodge, nice one.

How the hell would I know? Do you? Touche on the dodge Nice one yourself

 

[Moonbeam]

Damnit, why does bamacre have to keep pointing out that I was so incredibly wrong about the "tidal wave of change that is coming?"

It wouldn't be so bad if he were quoting Rush or O'Reilly, but that son of a bitch is using Huffington and Greenwald. How the hell am I supposed to deal with that? Why can't he be like the other right-wing nutjobs and talk about birth certificates and death panels? Why can't he be pro-war? Hate gays? Those people are so easy to handle, I look good, and the Democrats look good, next to those clowns. But this son of a bitch has to come in here and make me look like a damn fool. Screw you, bamacre, screw you!


See how easy that is, Moonie? :biggrin:

What? To sound nuts? How was that a challenge?

You didn't think the tidal wave got here already did you?

 

[kylebisme]

He claims that the message of these commentators is Obama being a hypocrite.

Both point out examples of Obama going back on his campaign promises. Perhaps you don't like the term "hypocrite", but it applies all the same.

He claims that their articles support Obama being *worse than Bush*.

Rather, Bamacre just suggested Obama might wind up being worse than Bush in the long run.

So once again it's Bush's fault Obama's presidency isn't going well?

It takes some really poor comprehension ability to take the article as suggesting that.

A more serious student of US history can point out many examples where the legislative branch has completely frustrated the agenda of the then President.

A serious student of reality point out many examples where both the legislative or executive branch has pursued agenda contrary to the population.

To say that the government bureaucracy is laden with "Bush-Cheney" supporters is laughable.

Here are a few notable examples:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Gates
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Mueller
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_B._Alexander

 

[Budmantom]

Uhh....links to where he said he would get out of Afghanistan?

Actually he promised to continue that one.

Barry is willing to lose Afghanistan at all costs, he will do whatever it takes.

It's kind of funny, Barry can "fix" health-care, auto-industry, banking, TARP, stimulus and Wallstreet in about 15 minutes but has no idea what he's doing in Afghanistan, no matter how great of an answer he had during the election he doesn't have a clue now. He's in over his head even with those big Dumbo ears.

 

[jman19]

Disappointing? Yep, so far his presidency has been. But so far it isn't looking like a Bush style disaster. Obama walked in to shit, so I was willing to give him some time but I don't see a quick turn around coming soon.

 

[bfdd]

Disappointing? Yep, so far his presidency has been. But so far it isn't looking like a Bush style disaster. Obama walked in to shit, so I was willing to give him some time but I don't see a quick turn around coming soon.

Yeah cause Bush totally didn't get a welcoming kick to the balls in his first year....

 

[lupi]

Barry is willing to lose Afghanistan at all costs, he will do whatever it takes.

It's kind of funny, Barry can "fix" health-care, auto-industry, banking, TARP, stimulus and Wallstreet in about 15 minutes but has no idea what he's doing in Afghanistan, no matter how great of an answer he had during the election he doesn't have a clue now. He's in over his head even with those big Dumbo ears.

that's quit funny, and sadly true.

 

[BudAshes]

Yeah cause Bush totally didn't get a welcoming kick to the balls in his first year....

He got a free 8 year pass for it.

 

[GrGr]

Obama isn't, and never was about change. I have pointed that out repeatedly. He kissed every butt in Washington (and elsewhere) to get the presidency. He is beholden to a lot of people and definitely not about to change anything 'important'. Here's a post I made in 2008 saying this exact thing.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?p=25987680&highlight=obama+change#post25987680