Hard drive problem...maybe mobo problem?

[AiponGkooja]

Updated story on page 2

I was on my computer and I guess my foot was bumping the wall plug a lot. Well, eventually it came far enough out that it cut off the power to my computer for a second, and then came back on when I moved my foot (I sat up because it scared the crap out of me). I looked down, noticed the plug was about halfway out of the wall, so I pushed it back in. This caused the power to the computer to cut out and come back on suddenly a second time.

But anyway, the end of the story, I now turn my computer on and it says something like "System disk error, please insert a boot disk a press enter."

Tried that, and Windows started loading. It loaded a bunch of drivers and then asked me if I wanted it to fresh install Windows or use the Windows recovery device or cancel the installation, so I chose cancel.

Instead I rebooted and went into the BIOS and it has no harddrive detected. I can probably find someone to let me open up their computer to see if the drive still works, or I could just put the Windows XP cd back in and let it do its installation.

Anyway, was wondering if this sounds like my harddrive got killed or erased, or if it might be my motherboard or something else, based on what seems to have caused it.

I tried moving the SATA cable to the other 3 ports on the motherboard, and it still doesn't boot from it or have it detected in the BIOS. I also tried a different power cable from my power supply to the harddrive, and that did nothing.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, as I kind of need my computer for school right now. For the time being though, I will see if I can stick it in someone else's computer just to see if it's still alive and/or has anything on it. I will post the results when I get back, but please offer suggestions in the meantime.

Thank you very much,
Aip

 

[AiponGkooja]

Bump

Would really like some opinions on this please.

Thanks

 

[Saga]

It's been a very long time since I have run any PC without a UPS, but I know for a fact that cutting power and then resuming power to a HDD quickly can essentially perform a low level format.

 

[MobiusPizza]

Well the best you can hope for is to use the WindowsXP recovery console and try doing a chkdsk /r
Or better download BartPE and burn it to a CD as a bootable console
It has chkdsk, fdisk and all sorts of diagonosis kit

 

[birdpup]

The current problem could be with any of the hardware components with the hard drive being the most likely since it is the most delicate with power fluctuations.

I do not think the Windows install will work if the hard drive is not detected. The drive may have been detected earlier when the install program was started but may not be detected now. All this would take is multiple reboots until that one time the drive is detected by the bios.

You may eventually need to perform a recovery installation to replace any damaged system files.

For now, I recommend removing any external devices from the system, leaving only the psu, cpu, memory, video card and perform a test on the memory with memtest for at least one complete pass. Two or three passess would be better.

Then install the hard drive and check to see if the bios detects the drive. If the drive is not detected, reboot the computer until the hard drive is detected in the bios.

When the drive is detected in the bios, test the drive with the manufacturer's diagnostic utility and see if any errors are reported.

If any errors are reported, well, some would say RMA the drive if it is under warranty and others would say it is your fault the drive died and you cannot ethically RMA it. This is your decision.

If no errors are reported, you can then attempt:
1) recover any lost data
2) recovery repair the operating system
3) delete and create new partitions, format the filesystem, and perform a clean install of the operating system.

My real suggestion Immediately purchase an IDE drive at a local store (OfficeMax, OfficeDepot, Staples, ...), install this new drive, disconnect your old drive, quickly install Windows on this new drive, and get your attention back to your classes. You can attempt a file recovery later during a weekend break, Thanksgiving break, or even after the semester. New hard drives can easily be found for under $100. How much are you spending on your classes in comparison? I would then figure out a way to firmly connect that plug with the outlet and consider purchasing a battery backup with undervoltage protection.

Data Recovery Programs
1) R-Studio
2) Runtime's GetDataBack
3) Ontrack's Easy Recovery Pro
4) Quetek
5) File Scavenger
6) HDD Regenerator
7) TestDisk

Rescue Disks
UBCD4Win
BartPE
Knoppix

Hard Drive Related Products
Norton Ghost
Partition Table Doctor and Super Fdisk
DIY DataRecovery and iRecover
Acronis
Future Systems Solutions
Partition Recovery

Hard Drive Manufacturer Diagnostic Utilities
Seagate
Western Digital
Maxtor
Fujitsu
Hitachi

Google
Unix 'dd' command
Linux 'dd' command
Partition Recovery
Data Recovery
drive partition strategy
drive partition primary extended
drive partition
drive partition partitions partitioning
repair install xp

If bios does not recognize hard drive, then reboot and try again until that one time the drive is recognized. If this does not work, put drive in another system and hope the bios of the other system detects the drive.

Memory Tests
memtest86
memtest86+

Notebook Hard Drive to Desktop Adapter
geeks.com

MBR, Partition Table, and Boot Record Tools
MBR Wizard and MBR Util

Windows Recovery Instal
Microsoft Support: How to perform an in-place upgrade (reinstallation) of Windows XP
Michael Stevens: How to Perform a Windows XP Repair Install

=============================================================
To set up XP now, press <Enter>
F8=I agree

=============================================================
Windows XP Professional Setup
=============================

If one of the following Windows XP installations is damaged, Setup can try to repair it.
Use the UP and DOWN ARROW keys to select an installation.
* To repair the selected Windows XP installation, press R.
* To ocntinue installing a fresh copy of Windows XP without repairing, press ESC.

Partition List
C:\Windows "Microsoft Windows XP Professional"

F3=Quit R=Repair ESC=Don't Repair
=============================================================

The correct action for a Repair is to select R for Repair.

 

[AiponGkooja]

Well, I still haven't been able to find another computer to test it on, but I'm still looking into that.

Also, it seems like the Maxtor's site says that their diagnostic tool doesn't work for nForce4 chipset?

Btw:
A8N-SLI Deluxe (BIOS 1013 recently)
AMD Athlon 64 3500+
Maxtor DiamondMax10 300gb 16mb Buffer


Also, I don't know if this is significant, but I just plugged it into one of my RAID slots for the hell of it, and it seems to detect the drive there. I can't create a RAID array or anything since I only have 1 drive, but it actually lists the drive, so could that mean anything good?

Still haven't been able to get the BIOS to detect it, but still working on it.

Any more suggestions or thoughts are appreciated.

Thanks,
Aip

 

[The Boston Dangler]

Originally posted by: birdpup
The current problem could be with any of the hardware components with the hard drive being the most likely since it is the most delicate with power fluctuations.

I do not think the Windows install will work if the hard drive is not detected. The drive may have been detected earlier when the install program was started but may not be detected now. All this would take is multiple reboots until that one time the drive is detected by the bios.

You may eventually need to perform a recovery installation to replace any damaged system files.

For now, I recommend removing any external devices from the system, leaving only the psu, cpu, memory, video card and perform a test on the memory with memtest for at least one complete pass. Two or three passess would be better.

Then install the hard drive and check to see if the bios detects the drive. If the drive is not detected, reboot the computer until the hard drive is detected in the bios.

When the drive is detected in the bios, test the drive with the manufacturer's diagnostic utility and see if any errors are reported.

If any errors are reported, well, some would say RMA the drive if it is under warranty and others would say it is your fault the drive died and you cannot ethically RMA it. This is your decision.

If no errors are reported, you can then attempt:
1) recover any lost data
2) recovery repair the operating system
3) delete and create new partitions, format the filesystem, and perform a clean install of the operating system.

My real suggestion Immediately purchase an IDE drive at a local store (OfficeMax, OfficeDepot, Staples, ...), install this new drive, disconnect your old drive, quickly install Windows on this new drive, and get your attention back to your classes. You can attempt a file recovery later during a weekend break, Thanksgiving break, or even after the semester. New hard drives can easily be found for under $100. How much are you spending on your classes in comparison? I would then figure out a way to firmly connect that plug with the outlet and consider purchasing a battery backup with undervoltage protection.

Data Recovery Programs
1) R-Studio
2) Runtime's GetDataBack
3) Ontrack's Easy Recovery Pro
4) Quetek
5) File Scavenger
6) HDD Regenerator
7) TestDisk

Rescue Disks
UBCD4Win
BartPE
Knoppix

Hard Drive Related Products
Norton Ghost
Partition Table Doctor and Super Fdisk
DIY DataRecovery and iRecover
Acronis
Future Systems Solutions
Partition Recovery

Hard Drive Manufacturer Diagnostic Utilities
Seagate
Western Digital
Maxtor
Fujitsu
Hitachi

Google
Unix 'dd' command
Linux 'dd' command
Partition Recovery
Data Recovery
drive partition strategy
drive partition primary extended
drive partition
drive partition partitions partitioning
repair install xp

If bios does not recognize hard drive, then reboot and try again until that one time the drive is recognized. If this does not work, put drive in another system and hope the bios of the other system detects the drive.

Memory Tests
memtest86
memtest86+

Notebook Hard Drive to Desktop Adapter
geeks.com

MBR, Partition Table, and Boot Record Tools
MBR Wizard and MBR Util

Windows Recovery Instal
Microsoft Support: How to perform an in-place upgrade (reinstallation) of Windows XP
Michael Stevens: How to Perform a Windows XP Repair Install

=============================================================
To set up XP now, press <Enter>
F8=I agree

=============================================================
Windows XP Professional Setup
=============================

If one of the following Windows XP installations is damaged, Setup can try to repair it.
Use the UP and DOWN ARROW keys to select an installation.
* To repair the selected Windows XP installation, press R.
* To ocntinue installing a fresh copy of Windows XP without repairing, press ESC.

Partition List
C:\Windows "Microsoft Windows XP Professional"

F3=Quit R=Repair ESC=Don't Repair
=============================================================

The correct action for a Repair is to select R for Repair.

That's one Helluva post!

 

[birdpup]

Originally posted by: AiponGkooja
...
Also, it seems like the Maxtor's site says that their diagnostic tool doesn't work for nForce4 chipset?
...

Also, I don't know if this is significant, but I just plugged it into one of my RAID slots for the hell of it, and it seems to detect the drive there. I can't create a RAID array or anything since I only have 1 drive, but it actually lists the drive, so could that mean anything good?

Still haven't been able to get the BIOS to detect it, but still working on it.

The Maxtor diagnostic tool is not supported for RAID configurations, but should work fine in a typical IDE configuration. I had not noticed that before.

This non-support of Maxtor drives in a RAID configuration is problematic since the RAID array is the only configuration your drive is recognizable.

I have not worked with RAID configurations yet, but if your drive is detected while in a RAID array, can it not be used in that manner to copy your data from it? I would recommend replacing this drive since it will probably fail quickly even if you do manage to get it working again. RMA the drive or purchase a replacement, use the RAID array to copy your files to the new drive (maybe partition D: ) and you can install your new system from there.

 

[AiponGkooja]

Any other suggestions on things that I can do without spending more money on fixes that might not work? (did that with my video card and it pissed me off a little) I can't even be sure that buying a new harddrive would work, since it may also have detection problems.

As it is, I can use the school computers to do any NECESSARY work; it's just mildly inconvenient.

Isn't it safe to say that the harddrive isn't dead, since the raid controller detects it?

After reading at some other places I thought I should mention some other things to see if anyone recognizes a common problem or something:

Recently updated BIOS to 1013 on my A8N-SLI Deluxe. (ineffective fix for graphics card problem)
Recently updated chipset drivers to v6.66 (ineffective fix for graphics card problem)
New power supply - Enermax Whisper II 535W (ineffective fix for graphics card problem)
I tried new SATA cables and different SATA ports on the mobo
I checked to make sure that the drive gets power, and it does (spins up fine on boot)
Tried clearing CMOS, didn't do anything.
Maxtor diag tools say they don't work with nForce4 chipset, among others


Thanks again for any more suggestions,
Aip

 

[johnnqq]

birdpup's post should be stickied.

 

[birdpup]

The above post was part of the following thread since I was not finished developing the final output at that time. I took what I had already developed and then applied more information specifically related to the question.
Hard Drive, Partition, Data Recovery and Diagnostic Resources

Consideration for being stickied is taking place here.
Should this be a sticky?

Thank you.

 

[birdpup]

Originally posted by: AiponGkooja
Any other suggestions on things that I can do without spending more money on fixes that might not work? (did that with my video card and it pissed me off a little) I can't even be sure that buying a new harddrive would work, since it may also have detection problems.

As it is, I can use the school computers to do any NECESSARY work; it's just mildly inconvenient.

Isn't it safe to say that the harddrive isn't dead, since the raid controller detects it?

After reading at some other places I thought I should mention some other things to see if anyone recognizes a common problem or something:

Recently updated BIOS to 1013 on my A8N-SLI Deluxe. (ineffective fix for graphics card problem)
Recently updated chipset drivers to v6.66 (ineffective fix for graphics card problem)
New power supply - Enermax Whisper II 535W (ineffective fix for graphics card problem)
I tried new SATA cables and different SATA ports on the mobo
I checked to make sure that the drive gets power, and it does (spins up fine on boot)
Tried clearing CMOS, didn't do anything.
Maxtor diag tools say they don't work with nForce4 chipset, among others

It is not safe to say the hard drive is not damaged, even after receiving no errors from a diagnostic test, the drive could still fail shortly thereafter.

I am not familiar with RAID controllers so I do not know what information such recognition provides.

It is very interesting to find that Maxtor diagnostic tools do not work on the nForce4 chipset. I purchased a Maxtor 250GB, 16MB cache, Sata drive to go with my new system and I now have little faith in case of problems with this hard drive.

With that in mind. I still recommend purchasing a new hard drive. The current hard drive will forever be unreliable even if it works properly. This is because hard drives are very sensitive to abrupt power failures due to the spinning platters and read/write heads that need to be properly returned to a rest position before powering the system down.

Maybe someone else has better information?

EDIT:
I just remembered a third party diagnostic software I have seen others recommend.
[*]Hard Drive Manufacturer Diagnostic Utilities

• Everest Diagnostic Software (not confined to any one hard drive manufacturer)

 

[CraKaJaX]

Originally posted by: The Boston Dangler

Originally posted by: birdpup
The current problem could be with any of the hardware components with the hard drive being the most likely since it is the most delicate with power fluctuations.

I do not think the Windows install will work if the hard drive is not detected. The drive may have been detected earlier when the install program was started but may not be detected now. All this would take is multiple reboots until that one time the drive is detected by the bios.

You may eventually need to perform a recovery installation to replace any damaged system files.

For now, I recommend removing any external devices from the system, leaving only the psu, cpu, memory, video card and perform a test on the memory with memtest for at least one complete pass. Two or three passess would be better.

Then install the hard drive and check to see if the bios detects the drive. If the drive is not detected, reboot the computer until the hard drive is detected in the bios.

When the drive is detected in the bios, test the drive with the manufacturer's diagnostic utility and see if any errors are reported.

If any errors are reported, well, some would say RMA the drive if it is under warranty and others would say it is your fault the drive died and you cannot ethically RMA it. This is your decision.

If no errors are reported, you can then attempt:
1) recover any lost data
2) recovery repair the operating system
3) delete and create new partitions, format the filesystem, and perform a clean install of the operating system.

My real suggestion Immediately purchase an IDE drive at a local store (OfficeMax, OfficeDepot, Staples, ...), install this new drive, disconnect your old drive, quickly install Windows on this new drive, and get your attention back to your classes. You can attempt a file recovery later during a weekend break, Thanksgiving break, or even after the semester. New hard drives can easily be found for under $100. How much are you spending on your classes in comparison? I would then figure out a way to firmly connect that plug with the outlet and consider purchasing a battery backup with undervoltage protection.

Data Recovery Programs
1) R-Studio
2) Runtime's GetDataBack
3) Ontrack's Easy Recovery Pro
4) Quetek
5) File Scavenger
6) HDD Regenerator
7) TestDisk

Rescue Disks
UBCD4Win
BartPE
Knoppix

Hard Drive Related Products
Norton Ghost
Partition Table Doctor and Super Fdisk
DIY DataRecovery and iRecover
Acronis
Future Systems Solutions
Partition Recovery

Hard Drive Manufacturer Diagnostic Utilities
Seagate
Western Digital
Maxtor
Fujitsu
Hitachi

Google
Unix 'dd' command
Linux 'dd' command
Partition Recovery
Data Recovery
drive partition strategy
drive partition primary extended
drive partition
drive partition partitions partitioning
repair install xp

If bios does not recognize hard drive, then reboot and try again until that one time the drive is recognized. If this does not work, put drive in another system and hope the bios of the other system detects the drive.

Memory Tests
memtest86
memtest86+

Notebook Hard Drive to Desktop Adapter
geeks.com

MBR, Partition Table, and Boot Record Tools
MBR Wizard and MBR Util

Windows Recovery Instal
Microsoft Support: How to perform an in-place upgrade (reinstallation) of Windows XP
Michael Stevens: How to Perform a Windows XP Repair Install

=============================================================
To set up XP now, press <Enter>
F8=I agree

=============================================================
Windows XP Professional Setup
=============================

If one of the following Windows XP installations is damaged, Setup can try to repair it.
Use the UP and DOWN ARROW keys to select an installation.
* To repair the selected Windows XP installation, press R.
* To ocntinue installing a fresh copy of Windows XP without repairing, press ESC.

Partition List
C:\Windows "Microsoft Windows XP Professional"

F3=Quit R=Repair ESC=Don't Repair
=============================================================

The correct action for a Repair is to select R for Repair.

That's one Helluva post!

I'll be sure to add this to my favs :thumbsup:

 

[AiponGkooja]

Well, to update, so far nothing seems to be working.

I will probably be buying another harddrive, but I was wondering, since my old one seems to show up when connected to the RAID connection, if I can use that to copy data over?

I'm not sure how RAID works really, so do I need an identical harddrive to do this, or would any second drive work? Also, can I just set them up as RAID 1 when one already has data on it and the other has nothing, to just copy everything over at once? Or will it format both drives or something like that?

Thanks again,
Aip

 

[AiponGkooja]

Update: I just found out that I could make a JBOD array of a single harddrive, which I guess nobody else knew either? I set that up, and it detects it and TRIES to boot, but then it BSOD's and restarts (if I disable the automatic restart it says stuff about Windows maybe being corrupted and to check for viruses etc).

Anyway, was wondering if there's a way to actually boot into command prompt with Windows XP, because from what I've seen it doesn't look like it...

So does any of this seem like a good thing? Or just more bad news and another reason to just buy a new harddrive? :laugh:

Thanks,
Aip

Edit: I just tried the Windows recovery console with my XP cd, since it is actually detecting my harddrive in the RAID setup, but for some reason my keyboard stops responding as soon as it wants me to pick an option (ENTER to continue windows installation, R to enter the recovery console, and F3 to exit setup). It does this EVERY time...and that doesn't really make sense to me at all...

 

[AiponGkooja]

Anybody? Just want to know if I'm making progress or if I'm proving to myself that my drive is FUBAR, because I at least got a LITTLE farther towards accessing data, heh.

 

[birdpup]

I do not know how the RAID array affects recovery of drive stability so I cannot answer there. You could run the manufacturer diagnostic utility to test the drive and see if you receive any error codes. I still would not trust this drive, though.

 

[AiponGkooja]

Update I guess. I got a new hdd finally, but it doesn't work in my regular SATA ports either, and when I try to install Windows with the new hdd plugged into a RAID port (as a single drive JBOD) my keyboard still stops working as soon as the options pop up on the screen (enter = install windows, r = repair windows, f3 = exit).

Is this most likely a motherboard problem now? I have a 3 year warranty on it, but that would be somewhat annoying...still in school which is more important right now...

 

[Jiggz]

You can connect a single hdd to the RAID connectors if you wish and not configure it as an array. But if you can use an independent HDD controller it is preferred. So for starter connect the hdd to another hdd controller port. See if it is detected by the bios. Keep trying all hdd connector until it is detected. Then boot with XP CD. When asked if you want a fresh install or recovery console. Try recovery console first. At the prompt. type "fixmbr" and hit enter. Next type, "fixboot" and hit enter again. If everything seems OK (no erroe message), try rebooting. If it does not boot still, boot with the XP cd again. This time do a Repair Installation. After a repair installation everything will be the same except for the XP updates you did or service packs which are not part of the XP CD.

 

[AiponGkooja]

Well, the problem is that it doesn't work in any of the regular SATA ports, and is only detected with the RAID ports. However, when I try to do anything with the Windows CD, my keyboard stops responding as soon as it asks me to pick an option. Sound like a motherboard problem or not?

 

[Jiggz]

There could be a problem with the mobo. But you can still use the RAID ports. But before you can start installing XP you need to install the drivers for the RAID Controller. Press F6 when prompted by XP CD installation. Make sure you have the RAID driver on a floppy. If it still does not work, your next move is to try the hdd to another mobo.

 

[AiponGkooja]

Originally posted by: Jiggz
There could be a problem with the mobo. But you can still use the RAID ports. But before you can start installing XP you need to install the drivers for the RAID Controller. Press F6 when prompted by XP CD installation. Make sure you have the RAID driver on a floppy. If it still does not work, your next move is to try the hdd to another mobo.

Well, I tried that, but for some reason, when it says to hit F6 to install third party RAID drivers, I hit F6 (sometimes once, sometimes many many times), and it just continues to go through installation... I did notice on the bottom bar though, before it switches to the END options (install, repair, exit), it says SOMETHING about a keyboard. It flashes by REALLY fast though, and I can't make out anything but the word keyboard.

As always, any other suggestions are always welcome.

Thanks,
Aip

 

[Jiggz]

Can you try the hdd to another mobo?

 

[AiponGkooja]

Which one, the new one? Doesn't the fact that the new one didn't work say that it might not be the harddrives that are the problem?

I've only found one person who even has SATA ports, but he's using all of them and doesn't want to risk messing up his RAID arrays... *shrug*

 

[AiponGkooja]

Well, not much has changed, and ASUS support kinda sucks, so can anyone help me with a good troubleshooting process from the ground up so that I can see what exactly the problem is. What I'm looking for is a nice order of things that I should try so that I can eliminate each part from being a possible problem. As said in this thread already, I THINK it is a problem with my motherboard, but I can't really be sure about that.

Here's some system specs and other information to help with anyone who wants to help provide a troubleshooting guide:

ASUS A8N-SLI Deluxe (BIOS 1013)
AMD Athlon 64 3500+ (stock)
Enermax WhisperII 535W power supply
2x1gb OCZ PC3200 2-3-2-5 (stock)
Chaintech 6600gt (BFG 7800gtx available but not installed yet)
Creative X-Fi XtremeMusic Edition sound card
Maxtor DiamoindMax10 300gb SATA hdd (has lots of data on it that I still kind of want)
Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 SATA 250gb hdd (new, empty)
USB keyboard & mouse
Samsung 1.44mb floppy drive
NEC DVD Burner ND-3520A
Rosewill Combo Drive Model C523216B

To summarize the screwed up problems:
BIOS does not detect any hdd plugged into the "regular SATA" ports (the black ones). However, the RAID drivers DO seem to detect drives plugged into these "regular SATA" ports.

BIOS DOES detect any hdd plugged into the "RAID specific" ports (the red ones). Doing this I can set either one or both to single-drive JBOD arrays. System will not boot into Windows from my old hdd though (BSOD/restart during regular Windows boot-up, and crash/restart during SafeMode boot-up).

When using XP-Pro cd to boot, F6 is unresponsive when it prompts to "hit F6 to install third-party RAID/SATA drivers." F2 does respond when it prompts to "hit F2 to run automated recovery console." Entire keyboard is unresponsive when it gets to the point where it asks to hit ENTER to continue, R to repair, and F3 to exit setup (at this point I have to hit the reset button). Setup also occasionally tells me that it does not detect any mass storage devices and prompts to insert the hard drive manufacturer's setup floppy (which I don't have).

Memtest ran to about 1200% with no errors.

I haven't tried any recovery software yet since I can't get into Windows on either the old drive or a fresh install on the new drive. Also, again, I'm not so sure it's the hdd's that are the problem.


I guess that's about it... bleh...

Thanks all,
Aip