Hard Drive health CAUTION in Crystal Disc

[taltamir]

use windows 7 to do a full format.
windows vista and above write all 0s to a drive on a full format, destroying any data they contain beyond recovery.

 

[memory]

How do you do a full format with Windows 7? Are you talking about using the Windows disc? Anytime I have formatted with the Windows 7 disc to format the drive, it did not give me an option. And it only took like 5 seconds to format it.

I thought Windows Vista and above done a quick format with no choice.

 

[taltamir]

No, i mean put in a new HDD, install windows on it, then select the old HDD From "computer", right click on it, select format, and uncheck quick format.

#1 rule of installing windows, only have 1 HDD plugged in, that HDD is the one on which you are installing windows. Windows likely mess up the location of its boot files otherwise.

 

[memory]

Don't I have to uninstall Windows from the bad drive first before I can install it on another drive?

I was thinking of using Dban to format the drive. Is that necessary? I don't want the drive to get into the wrong hands.

I know about only having one hard drive plugged in. I learned that the hard way just recently.

 

[taltamir]

DBAN will be equally effective as my suggestion at destroying all data on the drive.

You CAN'T uninstall windows, and MS doesn't count activations the way other companies do. Formatting your old drive is as close as you can get to uninstalling windows. And no, you will have no problem installing windows on a new drive just because you haven't formatted the old one yet.

If you activated too many times you will have to call MS for activation... they ask you "how many machines is it installed on?" and you answer with something like "one, I reinstalled windows while repairing my computer" (which is the truth). And they then activate it.

 

[memory]

So I can do a full format and the data is gone forever? You are saying I couldn't use a data recovery program and find the files on that drive? I might have to test this out.

The way I understood about full format is it just checks the surface for bad sectors or something like that.

Unless formatting a drive within Windows is different than formatting with the Windows disc.

http://www.sevenforums.com/installation-setup/4391-windows-7-format.html

Google Windows 7 full format for many other topics on this.

 

[taltamir]

So I can do a full format and the data is gone forever? You are saying I couldn't use a data recovery program and find the files on that drive?

yes

The way I understood about full format is it just checks the surface for bad sectors or something like that.

that was with windows XP and earlier, starting with windows vista a full format writes 0s to entire drive... but since it can't be your main drive, you might as well just use DBAN, it will be easier for you.

 

[memory]

I might have to test that out on a different drive.

About the Windows activation process, help me understand this. Once I install Windows and activate it, Microsoft knows that, right? Meaning I can call them up and give them the product key and they can tell me if it has been activated, correct?

So if I install the same Windows on a different drive without formatting the other drive, how will I be able to activate it on the new drive when it is still activated on the other drive? Am I being stupid on this?

 

[taltamir]

look, you are overthinking it.
there is nothing to test, there is no issues to get over.

1. use DBAN to zero the drive.
2. send it to the manufacturer for warranty replacement or throw it in the trash if out of warranty.
3. Buy new drive
4. Install windows on new drive and activate it.

Once I install Windows and activate it, Microsoft knows that, right? Meaning I can call them up and give them the product key and they can tell me if it has been activated, correct?

They know, yes.

So if I install the same Windows on a different drive without formatting the other drive, how will I be able to activate it on the new drive when it is still activated on the other drive?

Because MS aren't idiots, they know people sometimes need to reinstall windows for various reasons. It will just work when you try to activate it... Its all computerized, if and only if their computers see that there have been multiple activation attempts on this then they will ask you to call to activate, and when you call they will ask you how many computers its installed on.
The answer is 1, because you reinstalled windows. An old broken HDD on its way to the dumpster is not a computer.
If their computers see that there have been thousands of activations all over the world, then they know that the key has been leaked online and is used to pirate it. In which case they try to get you to buy a new, legitimate key.

I have done internet and phone activation hundreds of times already while fixing people's computers. Its never an issue.

You think they need some sort of "deactivation" process like apple iTunes or EA video games... but that is not necessary because MS isn't trying to screw their customers like apple or EA are.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Use Data Lifeguard to write zeros to the entire drive before sending it in. You can't unactivate Win7.

You will have to use the double-install trick to re-install Win7, if it's an upgrade copy and you don't have an existing OS on the drive. Win7 should re-activate on the same hardware no problem.

 

[memory]

Use Data Lifeguard to write zeros to the entire drive before sending it in. You can't unactivate Win7.

You will have to use the double-install trick to re-install Win7, if it's an upgrade copy and you don't have an existing OS on the drive. Win7 should re-activate on the same hardware no problem.

I didn't have to use double install method when I first installed this Windows and yes it is an upgrade version. Inserted the disc, chose the custom option, formatted the drive and installed Windows with no problems. Should I have been able to do that with the upgrade version?

Why couldn't I do that again on the new drive?

 

[VirtualLarry]

I didn't have to use double install method when I first installed this Windows and yes it is an upgrade version. Inserted the disc, chose the custom option, formatted the drive and installed Windows with no problems. Should I have been able to do that with the upgrade version?

Why couldn't I do that again on the new drive?

But when you did that the first time, chose Custom and then formatted and installed, you had a prior OS on the HD, right? Win7 setup detects that when you boot the disc, and that's why it allows you to use your upgrade key and activate.

If you try that with a totally clean fresh HD, or a zero-wiped HD, it will not let you use the upgrade key to activate.

 

[memory]

Yes I did. I guess I was under the impression that I had to take the upgrade path instead of the custom path with the upgrade version of Windows.

So when I go to install the upgrade version on the new drive, I have to install it, don't activate(could I try to activate it), then go through the installation process again, then activate it. Is that right?

 

[taltamir]

By using the custom option instead of the upgrade one you didn't perform an OS upgrade, you did a clean install...
its just that it wouldn't ALLOW you to do a clean install without first detecting an old OS, because your license is an upgrade license.

So when I go to install the upgrade version on the new drive, I have to install it, don't activate(could I try to activate it), then go through the installation process again, then activate it. Is that right?

No, You need to:
1. Install an older version of windows... for example, winXP.
2. Install the upgrade version win7. (use custom so its not an OS upgrade but a clean install)

 

[VirtualLarry]

So when I go to install the upgrade version on the new drive, I have to install it, don't activate(could I try to activate it), then go through the installation process again, then activate it. Is that right?

Correct.

 

[memory]

Would it hurt to try and activate it before I install it the second time? On the second time around, I need to choose the upgrade path, right?

I am doing the advance replacement through WD where they ship me a new hard drive first, then I ship them mine. The hard drive I am sending them is a WD Caviar Black 500gb, the one they are sending me is the Caviar Black 750gb. Looks like I am getting a bigger drive for no extra costs. Even though, he does not need that much space, it is still pretty nice.

I wonder why they didn't send me the same size drive? Surely they wouldn't be out of stock.

 

[taltamir]

I wonder why they didn't send me the same size drive? Surely they wouldn't be out of stock.

the specific model you originally bought is no longer being manufactured.
If they just gave you a different 500GB one, even a faster and newer one, you might complain "hey, this isn't what I sent back"... but such an obvious upgrade as they are giving out will prevent that.

its pretty standard practice.

Correct.

Are you sure? AFAIK:
1. You need to first install an older version, not same version.
2. An upgrade version means he can't install it (not that he can't activate it) without first having an older version...
So how could he install it the first time? if he manages to get it to install the first time, why reinstall? just activate... if he installed and it activated there is no reason to reinstall.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Are you sure? AFAIK:
1. You need to first install an older version, not same version.
2. An upgrade version means he can't install it (not that he can't activate it) without first having an older version...
So how could he install it the first time? if he manages to get it to install the first time, why reinstall? just activate... if he installed and it activated there is no reason to reinstall.

You obviously haven't done it. Win7 (upgrade retail, probably full retail is the same), will let you install, regardless of whether or not you had a prior OS installed. You just choose not to install a product key during installation, and then it installs in a 30-day trial mode. (have 30 days to install product key and activate).

If you have an "upgrade" product key, then it will not activate when you install onto a clean HD. It gives you some obscure error, which, if you look it up, says that you can only use an upgrade key with an upgrade install. You need to have an OS on the HD before you install, if you want to use an upgrade key. However, it doesn't have to be a prior OS, it can be Win7 (since upgrading from Win7 to Win7 is supported).

So just install the OS on a clean HD, without entering the upgrade product key, then when Win7 is installed, do the install again, this time it will let you enter and activate the upgrade key.

Edit: Whether this is all within the terms of the EULA depends on whether or not you owned a legal license to a previous OS. Not whether or not it was actually installed previously.

Regardless, if you buy a legally-produced retail copy, it's not copyright infringement, even if you didn't own a prior license. Microsoft could technically invalidate your license for violating the EULA, but that's unlikely. I'm sure that they're just happy your paying for a copy, rather than using a totally bootleg copy.

 

[taltamir]

http://www.winsupersite.com/article/windows-7/clean-install-windows-7-with-upgrade-media.aspx

 

[memory]

According to that site, I could try and activate it the first time around. If it doesn't work, I will do the double install method.

I am impressed with WD's support. They sent me a bigger drive and they shipped it 2nd day air, not cheap.

Another question, this hard drive is for my dad's build. The 750gb drive will be way more than enough space, heck even the 500gb would be way more than enough. I already had the hard drives so I figured I would use them. He would be hard pressed to use 100gb's. With so much empty space, would that be hard on the drive?

 

[taltamir]

other way around, the less you use, the better. Well, sorta... Reliability from best to worst based on usage: light usage > heavy usages > medium usage.
That is in terms of daily writes and reads. In terms of space used / free space, theoretically its better to use less space, I have no concrete info here except that the WD AV drives do wear leveling and general knowledge about how drives work, AFAIK its just no a big deal for HDDs (is a bigger deal for SSDs where you want to use as little as possible)

And its not actually worth it to sell it to buy a smaller one (shipping and resale losses will probably cost more then the price difference between it and the cheapest drive they still make)

 

[memory]

I wasn't figuring on buying a smaller one. I just wandered if that would affect how long the drive would last.

Thanks for clearing that up.

Taltamir, how do you know what those values mean for the SMART data? I have some older drives that are not being used and they show caution as well. One shows a raw value of 1 for reallocated sectors, another shows A, and another shows 19.

 

[taltamir]

its a hex value... use this:
http://www.statman.info/conversions/hexadecimal.html

1 = 1
19 = 25
A = 10

 

[memory]

I just got the replacement drive today. I went to register the new drive and it says the warranty expires in 4 months. What gives, it should have a 5 year warranty. I installed the drive as a secondary drive just to check the health and according to crystaldiskinfo, it has not been used at all. The heath is perfectly fine.

Why don't I have a 5 year warranty on this new drive? I guess I need to contact WD about this. Maybe once they get the bad drive, the warranty will change.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I just got the replacement drive today. I went to register the new drive and it says the warranty expires in 4 months. What gives, it should have a 5 year warranty. I installed the drive as a secondary drive just to check the health and according to crystaldiskinfo, it has not been used at all. The heath is perfectly fine.

Why don't I have a 5 year warranty on this new drive? I guess I need to contact WD about this. Maybe once they get the bad drive, the warranty will change.

The replacement drive should have the remainder of the warranty on the original drive, or 30 days, whichever is greater.

What was the warranty on the original drive?