Happiest cities to live in 2025

[Heartbreaker]

Denmark seems to score near the top on three categories - happiness, economic equality....and negative attitudes about inward migration. An awkward combo, from my perspective.

...

[I mean, the first two going together fits pretty well with what I tend to believe, but the last part seems like an awkward suggestion that it's a zero-sum-game. You either have domestic equality or you have openness to migrants - both the US and UK have more of the latter but very little of the former]

The US and UK have openness to migrants?? You must get your news from a different planet.

 

[ondma]

Denmark seems to score near the top on three categories - happiness, economic equality....and negative attitudes about inward migration. An awkward combo, from my perspective.

Denmark’s tough stance on migrants plays well at home. In Brussels, it could be a different story.

Mette Frederiksen must convince her European Social Democrats colleagues her domestic track record is a good fit for a top job in Brussels.

www.politico.eu

Denmark: Unprecedented measures to signal to migrants they are not welcome

Denmark used to have a reputation throughout the world as a liberal haven known for welcoming foreigners. However, this image has changed drastically in the past few years, as a series of new policies have made the Nordic nation rather unattractive for migrants and even for many refugees.

www.infomigrants.net

[I mean, the first two going together fits pretty well with what I tend to believe, but the last part seems like an awkward suggestion that it's a zero-sum-game. You either have domestic equality or you have openness to migrants - both the US and UK have more of the latter but very little of the former]

I dont necessarily see domestic equality and a tough immigration policy as contradictory, especially if the immigration policy is enforced openly and lawfully. In the US, as we inevitably seem to do on nearly every issue, immigration policy and enforcement has swung from too far in one direction to way, way too far in the other. Immigration got way out of hand in the Biden years, and was one of the big reasons Trump was elected. And Biden/Harris also handled the (isolated?) incidents of serious crimes by illegals in the most horrible way, with no human or political savvy. I mean, can you possibly have a worse response to crime from illegals than to say "Illegals have a lower crime rate than American Citizens." What an absolutely dismissive, tone deaf response to families hurting due to loss of a loved one. Of course now though, the pendulum has swing way, way too far in the other direction, with masked, gestapo like ICE agents basically kidnapping people from their homes, their workplace, and off the streets, and disappearing them to third world hellhole prisons without any semblance of due process.

 

[pmv]

The US and UK have openness to migrants?? You must get your news from a different planet.

Yup. Migration to the UK is pretty high. Seems to me that goes hand-in-hand with the liberalisation of the economy. There's certainly a _lot_ of ill-feeling and a major political backlash to it (which I find puzzling, given that so much of it is absolutely necessary, e.g. care-workers to look after our aging population), but it's been higher since Brexit than it was before.

The last government, for all their fervent anti-migrant rhetoric, actually made it easier for people to come here (almost as if they found it convenient to create an issue they could then stir up anger about).

Net migration report (accessible)

www.gov.uk

 

[biostud]

I dont necessarily see domestic equality and a tough immigration policy as contradictory, especially if the immigration policy is enforced openly and lawfully. In the US, as we inevitably seem to do on nearly every issue, immigration policy and enforcement has swung from too far in one direction to way, way too far in the other. Immigration got way out of hand in the Biden years, and was one of the big reasons Trump was elected. And Biden/Harris also handled the (isolated?) incidents of serious crimes by illegals in the most horrible way, with no human or political savvy. I mean, can you possibly have a worse response to crime from illegals than to say "Illegals have a lower crime rate than American Citizens." What an absolutely dismissive, tone deaf response to families hurting due to loss of a loved one. Of course now though, the pendulum has swing way, way too far in the other direction, with masked, gestapo like ICE agents basically kidnapping people from their homes, their workplace, and off the streets, and disappearing them to third world hellhole prisons without any semblance of due process.

The problem for politicians is to put it very bluntly: It is very difficult to make non-discriminate laws which excludes immigrants and refugees from Africa and the Middle-East, while attracting skilled workers from the rest of the world.

All EU citizens can move to Denmark if they want.

 

[pmv]

The US and UK have openness to migrants?? You must get your news from a different planet.

I mean, more than 40% of the population of this city (London) were born outside the UK. The figure is, apparently, 18% for Copenhagen.

The main issue is probably simply that Britain colonised (and exploited) such a vast area of the world. People come here because "we" went there. But we also have a more 'deregulated' and 'liberalised' economy, which makes it easier for incomers to find work, but also probably increases labour competition and increases inequality. Same I suspect applies to the US - it's relatively easy to go there, but it's dog-eat-dog once you arrive.

 

[fskimospy]

I mean, more than 40% of the population of this city (London) were born outside the UK. The figure is, apparently, 18% for Copenhagen.

The main issue is probably simply that Britain colonised (and exploited) such a vast area of the world. People come here because "we" went there. But we also have a more 'deregulated' and 'liberalised' economy, which makes it easier for incomers to find work, but also probably increases labour competition and increases inequality. Same I suspect applies to the US - it's relatively easy to go there, but it's dog-eat-dog once you arrive.

I think that was basically true until the last five months or so in the US. Now I would not recommend ANYONE come here. Like I wouldn't come on a tourist visa, a work visa, nothing, as it's simply not safe. It's not even safe for US citizens anymore but it's REALLY not safe for anyone who isn't.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Yup. Migration to the UK is pretty high. Seems to me that goes hand-in-hand with the liberalisation of the economy. There's certainly a _lot_ of ill-feeling and a major political backlash to it (which I find puzzling, given that so much of it is absolutely necessary, e.g. care-workers to look after our aging population), but it's been higher since Brexit than it was before.

Given that Brexit was driven by immigration fears, as is Trump, that is rounding up immigrants and sending them concentration camps. It's funny to single out UK and USA as Open to immigrants.

 

[ondma]

The problem for politicians is to put it very bluntly: It is very difficult to make non-discriminate laws which excludes immigrants and refugees from Africa and the Middle-East, while attracting skilled workers from the rest of the world.

All EU citizens can move to Denmark if they want.

I understand. You can set up some kind of rule that a immigrant must have employment and/or financial support lined up ahead of time before they are allowed to immigrate I guess. I actually think this is, or used to be, the policy for the US. Back in the early 2000s I worked with a man from Vietnam who spent many years and thousands of dollars setting up a plan to allow his family from Vietnam to immigrate legally.

 

[biostud]

I understand. You can set up some kind of rule that a immigrant must have employment and/or financial support lined up ahead of time before they are allowed to immigrate I guess. I actually think this is, or used to be, the policy for the US. Back in the early 2000s I worked with a man from Vietnam who spent many years and thousands of dollars setting up a plan to allow his family from Vietnam to immigrate legally.

And that is kind of what they have done so only wealthy people can move to Denmark, but they are generally not that fond of our tax system

Currently we see immigration from Germany of skilled workers who gets better salary and work life balance than in Germany and we want and need skilled workers, but we prefer immigrants to speak close to fluent Danish, which is also to too often the case...

 

[Fenixgoon]

And that is kind of what they have done so only wealthy people can move to Denmark, but they are generally not that fond of our tax system

Currently we see immigration from Germany of skilled workers who gets better salary and work life balance than in Germany and we want and need skilled workers, but we prefer immigrants to speak close to fluent Danish, which is also to too often the case...

Having briefly worked in Sweden, I did learn that your neighbors to the north love to pick on you for your language differences even if written Swedish, Norwegian, and Danish aren't all that far apart

I remember being sent a clip from a Danish show that is even a little self deprecating about how Danes can't understand each other 🤣

Do you find certain groups are able to pick up the language more easily, or is there a particular group (e.g. Germans as mentioned) that make up the bulk of immigrants to Denmark currently?

I found written swedish easy enough to follow since it has the same basic structure as English, but I only picked up a few words in my 4 months. It would take me a long time to pick up another language (I know just barely enough French to not die if I were dropped in the middle of the country)

 

[BurnItDwn]

And that is kind of what they have done so only wealthy people can move to Denmark, but they are generally not that fond of our tax system

Currently we see immigration from Germany of skilled workers who gets better salary and work life balance than in Germany and we want and need skilled workers, but we prefer immigrants to speak close to fluent Danish, which is also to too often the case...

I figure Danish Immigration test was to have them sit with Chili Klaus for a snack. And then the country gets to vote them in or out.

Chili Klaus

Chili Klaus - danish chili pepper connoisseur. Feel free to subscribe ð¥

www.youtube.com

 

[pmv]

The problem for politicians is to put it very bluntly: It is very difficult to make non-discriminate laws which excludes immigrants and refugees from Africa and the Middle-East, while attracting skilled workers from the rest of the world.

All EU citizens can move to Denmark if they want.

Just stumbled on this article today

How Denmark's left (not the far right) got tough on immigration

Denmark has come under international attention for its tough approach. And its Social Democrat prime minister is leading the charge

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[pmv]

Given that Brexit was driven by immigration fears, as is Trump, that is rounding up immigrants and sending them concentration camps. It's funny to single out UK and USA as Open to immigrants.

In terms of the political mood/climate? No, absolutely not, especially right now. But in terms of the nature of the economy and society, yes, they are. Most EU countries are quite hard to migrate to, because their systems are set up to benefit insiders at the expense of making it harder for those outside the system to get in. That's part of why Brexit happened, becuase the 'free movement of labour' was rather one-sided in practice.

 

[biostud]

Just stumbled on this article today

How Denmark's left (not the far right) got tough on immigration

Denmark has come under international attention for its tough approach. And its Social Democrat prime minister is leading the charge

www.bbc.co.uk

It gives a very well balanced view of the situation IMHO. My main problem with our current government on this area is that they believe "more surveillance equals more freedom" and that they make laws that on one hand is tough on immigration, but at the same time prevent ordinary hard working foreigners from settling in Denmark.

 

[biostud]

It's the economy...

 

[pmv]

I don't feel confident to comment much about Danish politics. I really don't understand the mad panic about immigration even in my 'own country'. Baffled why so many are so worked up about it (which, judging from the opinion polls and what I hear on radio phone-ins, people, especially provincials, very much are). Presumably I'm out-of-touch (but also am aware my own great-grandparents came from multiple "foreign" countries - though all of them were ones that Britain decided to go and take over and exploit, effectively obliging their population to become "British", whether they wanted to be or not).

I remain skeptical about EU "freedom of movement" because that's not really immigration, so much as long-distance long-term, trans-national commuting. Which I think is a different thing, and potentially more destabilising.

 

[biostud]

I don't feel confident to comment much about Danish politics. I really don't understand the mad panic about immigration even in my 'own country'. Baffled why so many are so worked up about it (which, judging from the opinion polls and what I hear on radio phone-ins, people, especially provincials, very much are). Presumably I'm out-of-touch (but also am aware my own great-grandparents came from multiple "foreign" countries - though all of them were ones that Britain decided to go and take over and exploit, effectively obliging their population to become "British", whether they wanted to be or not).

I remain skeptical about EU "freedom of movement" because that's not really immigration, so much as long-distance long-term, trans-national commuting. Which I think is a different thing, and potentially more destabilising.

For one thing the language barriers might be larger, as I would think more people can speak some degree of English.

The minimum wage is really high in Denmark, which is good if you are a skilled and efficient worker. But the entry level to the Danish workforce is really high, and many companies are reluctant to hire people who doesn't have a Danish degree.

Maybe it also has something to do about tribalism and cultural protectionism and fear of changes.

 

[Indus]

For one thing the language barriers might be larger, as I would think more people can speak some degree of English.

The minimum wage is really high in Denmark, which is good if you are a skilled and efficient worker. But the entry level to the Danish workforce is really high, and many companies are reluctant to hire people who doesn't have a Danish degree.

Maybe it also has something to do about tribalism and cultural protectionism and fear of changes.

Denmark is pretty crap from an immigration point of view.

I know a few cases where Denmark tried to deport spouses of citizens who passed away and said it's more human for them to go back to their own country as they have no connection to the country even though lived there and had a job over 20 years.

 

[biostud]

Denmark is pretty crap from an immigration point of view.

I know a few cases where Denmark tried to deport spouses of citizens who passed away and said it's more human for them to go back to their own country as they have no connection to the country even though lived there and had a job over 20 years.

Exactly, there are some rules which are inhumane and plain stupid, which most Danes can agree on, but apparently it's "difficult" or not politically opportune to find good solutions.

 

[igor_kavinski]

A guy I know got his degree from Denmark. When I asked him what Danes are like, his approximate reply, "If they were religious, they would be first in line to enter Heaven". So I gather from that bit that Danes are very ethical people.

I used to know a Danish girl online. She was a small little thing but looked kinda wild like a party loving animal. Her name looked like Tanya but it had a weird alphabet in it so it was spelled differently. She was super nice AND boring (she never had any misadventure to report). One night she was typing weirdly and not making much sense. I asked her if she was alright. She said, I was out with friends and had too much to drink. Even her drunk chat was...BORING

 

[biostud]

A guy I know got his degree from Denmark. When I asked him what Danes are like, his approximate reply, "If they were religious, they would be first in line to enter Heaven". So I gather from that bit that Danes are very ethical people.

I used to know a Danish girl online. She was a small little thing but looked kinda wild like a party loving animal. Her name looked like Tanya but it had a weird alphabet in it so it was spelled differently. She was super nice AND boring (she never had any misadventure to report). One night she was typing weirdly and not making much sense. I asked her if she was alright. She said, I was out with friends and had too much to drink. Even her drunk chat was...BORING

Are you sure you didn't mistake her for me

 

[igor_kavinski]

Are you sure you didn't mistake her for me

This was some time in my late teens.

So 20+ years ago.

 

[biostud]

This was some time in my late teens.

So 20+ years ago.

And?

 

[igor_kavinski]

And?

Nothing. She never fell in love with me