Handgun to beat

[alkemyst]

Most encounters aren't running gun battles in the streets, they are close quarters engagements at distances of less than 20 feet.

10 yards or less is in the ballpark of 20 feet.

This is why I am disagreeing with Pia's talk of target shooters. You aren't usually 'targetting' on the street, but more or less shooting from the hip.

Which is also why they tell you to never just fire once. You want to at least fire two or three times.

 

[TheNinja]

PSA:
The reason they used Beretta 92's/96's has nothing to do with their functionality. They were purchased cuz they were cheap in bulk quantities. The Sig was also up for competition and deemed too expensive.

Nowadays any soldier, cop or security guard who has a choice, always picks Glock or Sig. And its NOT because of the bandwagon effect.

I have a buddy with a lot of guns and he swears by Sig. He's not cop, security, or military but typically knows his stuff for what it's worth.

 

[alkemyst]

I have a buddy with a lot of guns and he swears by Sig. He's not cop, security, or military but typically knows his stuff for what it's worth.

Sigs are a great gun. The thing most don't like about Glocks are usually the grip. It either works for you or it doesn't.

Sadly most shop price or popularity rather than properly fitting themselves for a gun they can be capable with.

 

[rudeguy]

I have a buddy with a lot of guns and he swears by Sig. He's not cop, security, or military but typically knows his stuff for what it's worth.

I haven't kept up with this thread because I saw Alky take up his trolling station, so forgive me if I'm saying what has already been said.


Sig makes very solid guns. There are plenty of federal agencies that switched from Glock to Sig. Its looking more and more like my next gun will be a Sig.

Now anyone that swears by only one brand is a close minded moron. There are lots of quality choices out there.

And whatever Alky says, ignore. He's a troll. He's on my ignore list so I can't see what he has said, but I can promise you its not intelligent input.

 

[Pia]

10 yards or less is in the ballpark of 20 feet.

This is why I am disagreeing with Pia's talk of target shooters. You aren't usually 'targetting' on the street, but more or less shooting from the hip.

Once more: I'm talking about good shooters in general, not "target shooters".

What do you mean by "shooting from the hip" and how is it superior to solid conventional shooting?

Which is also why they tell you to never just fire once. You want to at least fire two or three times.

Suppose you are in a multiple target situation with a 5+1 ultracompact and have had to fire a shot already? "They" are wrong.

 

[rudeguy]

Once more: I'm talking about good shooters in general, not "target shooters".

What do you mean by "shooting from the hip" and how is it superior to solid conventional shooting?
Suppose you are in a multiple target situation with a 5+1 ultracompact and have had to fire a shot already? "They" are wrong.

You fire until the threat is no longer a threat

 

[alkemyst]

Once more: I'm talking about good shooters in general, not "target shooters".

What do you mean by "shooting from the hip" and how is it superior to solid conventional shooting?

It's not bro, that's what you aren't understanding.

Suppose you are in a multiple target situation with a 5+1 ultracompact and have had to fire a shot already? "They" are wrong.

If you are in a multi target situation with a 5+1 ultracompact you are probably fucked...time to pray they aren't armed and you have an exit.

 

[shortylickens]

I dont know about everyone else but I carry my LCP for personal protection. NOT to engage in shoot-outs. 6+1 is all I need.

I would never engage in a shoot-out, but if I did I would prefer a Benelli with an extended tube.

 

[alkemyst]

I dont know about everyone else but I carry my LCP for personal protection. NOT to engage in shoot-outs. 6+1 is all I need.

I would never engage in a shoot-out, but if I did I would prefer a Benelli with an extended tube.

It sounds like you live/travel in relatively safe places and as such even a 5 round revolver is more than likely adequate.

I am out at past midnight at times on foot, sometimes driving through known murder capitals heading into a warehouse/industrial park when hardly anyone is around, etc. Personally, I feel if I do have to ever pull a gun out on someone; it's going to be 2 or more people.

I have been fortunate enough that words and some OC spray have been enough...also more than likely having my dog with me some of the time.

Too many think it's easy to hit someone on the street...so often you are trying to move, they are definitely moving and you have uneven territory with obstacles. Even seasoned pros have a much lower accuracy in the field than at the range.

No one is hoping for a shootout, most of the time on first shot the asshats are going to run away. However; we have all read about those that don't give up and have some dude pinned down and he couldn't get away.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

It sounds like you live/travel in relatively safe places and as such even a 5 round revolver is more than likely adequate.

I am out at past midnight at times on foot, sometimes driving through known murder capitals heading into a warehouse/industrial park when hardly anyone is around, etc. Personally, I feel if I do have to ever pull a gun out on someone; it's going to be 2 or more people.

I have been fortunate enough that words and some OC spray have been enough...also more than likely having my dog with me some of the time.

Too many think it's easy to hit someone on the street...so often you are trying to move, they are definitely moving and you have uneven territory with obstacles. Even seasoned pros have a much lower accuracy in the field than at the range.

No one is hoping for a shootout, most of the time on first shot the asshats are going to run away. However; we have all read about those that don't give up and have some dude pinned down and he couldn't get away.

Alky you shouldn't be shooting at someone running away behind obstacles and crap. This is how it goes from self-defense to murder.

Like all of your other "advice" in this thread, just because it's right for YOU does not mean it's right for everyone else.

Stop acting like your personal opinions are fact, and as if anything anyone else does is automatically wrong. Granted this is your personality flaws showing, but seriously... You make it impossible to have a conversation, instead it always has to be a flat-out argument.

 

[alkemyst]

Alky you shouldn't be shooting at someone running away behind obstacles and crap. This is how it goes from self-defense to murder.

Like all of your other "advice" in this thread, just because it's right for YOU does not mean it's right for everyone else.

Stop acting like your personal opinions are fact, and as if anything anyone else does is automatically wrong. Granted this is your personality flaws showing, but seriously... You make it impossible to have a conversation, instead it always has to be a flat-out argument.

Dude you have gone on record you want to derail any post I make.

If you are in a confrontation, your goal is to get to cover. If they are not shooting back then you are safe. If they are shooting then you probably should be to.

However, these types are shooting back and deciding to engage in a fire fight more and more each day.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

Dude you have gone on record you want to derail any post I make.

If you are in a confrontation, your goal is to get to cover. If they are not shooting back then you are safe. If they are shooting then you probably should be to.

However, these types are shooting back and deciding to engage in a fire fight more and more each day.

Gone on record? What are you talking about?

Like many, I'm sick of your poking and prodding at member's posts trying to cause drama for everyone involved simply for your own amusement. I'm sick of you giving biased inaccurate information and portraying as fact. I'm sick of you coming into posts and completely twisting them around to be about good ole Alky. I refuse to sit back and let you give people terrible, biased, misguided, clearly trollish advice.

But most of all, I'm sick of you being disrespectful to any member who disagrees with you even though we're in here trying to have a healthy discussion.



I'm merely pointing out the problems in your posts, just the same as you do to others. At least I'm not doing is as a troll for my own amusement, and instead am trying to point out to the rest of our community that your advise should be taken with a very small, almost miniscule grain of salt.

I'm certainly not derailing any threads, and am only replying to your terrible advice.



Edit: And to add to this; take a look at:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=33110713&postcount=103

 

[LiuKangBakinPie]

A six shooter. If a round jams just press the trigger again and it will fire unlike a pistol where you have to cock and try again which can mean life or death. You only need about 6 rounds for home defence as the attacker is going to run his socks off 99 times out of a hunderd after the first shot or seeing Dirty Harry pointing at him

 

[TheNinja]

Now anyone that swears by only one brand is a close minded moron. There are lots of quality choices out there.

Ya, sorry, I didn't mean it's the ONLY brand he'll own. He probably has 40 handguns of all different brands and calibers. He's one of those guys that never passes up a "deal" on a gun. But his preferred brand is Sig. Like others have said though, it's probably the one that fits him the best and is a good solid brand. He always tells people to go hold some guns (and try if able) before buying a brand.

 

[etrigan420]

Arcenite, have you decided yet?

 

[Pia]

If you are in a multi target situation with a 5+1 ultracompact you are probably fucked...time to pray they aren't armed and you have an exit.

So you understand that your "never just fire once. You want to at least fire two or three times." is not actually valid advice?

And you consider "shooting from the hip" to be inferior, yet you are (apparently) training yourself and recommending others to do exactly that, instead of training to shoot well also under stress. Why?

 

[rudeguy]

So you understand that your "never just fire once. You want to at least fire two or three times." is not actually valid advice?

And you consider "shooting from the hip" to be inferior, yet you are (apparently) training yourself and recommending others to do exactly that, instead of training to shoot well also under stress. Why?

please ignore him

If you keep edging him on, he'll keep derailing the thread. Anyone with any sense knows to stop firing when there is no longer a threat. I'm not going to fire 3 times if the threat is negated after one shot. Technically if the person is no longer a threat and you shoot them, you could be charged with murder.

Now please, please don't pay him any more attention.

 

[alienb]

10 yards or less is in the ballpark of 20 feet.

This is why I am disagreeing with Pia's talk of target shooters. You aren't usually 'targetting' on the street, but more or less shooting from the hip.

Which is also why they tell you to never just fire once. You want to at least fire two or three times.

Math win. 10 yards is actually exactly 30 feet. Who knew.

</Smartass>

 

[alkemyst]

please ignore him

If you keep edging him on, he'll keep derailing the thread. Anyone with any sense knows to stop firing when there is no longer a threat. I'm not going to fire 3 times if the threat is negated after one shot. Technically if the person is no longer a threat and you shoot them, you could be charged with murder.

Now please, please don't pay him any more attention.

no dude, you are not shooting 3 shots independently.

They are rapid fire.

You like to fart with your son in walmarts, you arent ever going to be a target.

 

[x-alki]

Yea you bitches, listen to alkemyst. He knows everything about everything. Now go repent your sins against the almighty and bow down to him.

 

[alkemyst]

Yea you bitches, listen to alkemyst. He knows everything about everything. Now go repent your sins against the almighty and bow down to him.

was this necessary here? Where was I wrong?

don't be a jerk-off.

 

[x-alki]

was this necessary here? Where was I wrong?

don't be a jerk-off.

Was that really necessary? I already bowed to you.

 

[sourceninja]

I actually train two methods of 'high stress aiming'. The first is front sight only aiming. At short range, putting just your front sight on the target and practicing so your draw almost more or less always levels the pistol. This way you can reliably hit your target center mass at short (self defense) ranges.

The second method (and one I'm really becoming a fan of) is a method taught to me by some of my marine buddies. I'm not sure of what to call it. Basically, with a two hand grip, the thumb of the dominate hand raises up to make a V with the barrel. You put your target between your thumb and your barrel and you should hit center mass. Repetition allows your groups to be tight.

Neither of these methods are accurate in the sense that you can shoot right between the eyes or hit the exact spot you are aiming at. The advantage here is it gives you a general point of aim without a lot of effort. This works really well for me with guns like the LCP which have rear sights I really can't use.

I still practice target shooting (I have a really nice ruger 22) and standard shooting fundamentals weekly, but when I'm shooting my carry, I'm working on speed to target and center of mass accuracy (rather than target shooting accuracy).

I also sometimes practice "zen shooting". This is where I shoot my target without aiming or trying to hit it. I point down range, relax, think about a spot on the target and when the moment strikes, I shoot my gun. This is similar to kyudo's seisha seich&#363; (correct shooting is correct hitting). Basically, I focus on connecting myself to my target and pushing the bullet to the target. It's relaxing and I tend to be more accurate when I go back to normal shooting at the end. I also tend to always hit my target somewhere with this method.

 

[x-alki]

Neither of these methods are accurate in the sense that you can shoot right between the eyes or hit the exact spot you are aiming at. The advantage here is it gives you a general point of aim without a lot of effort. This works really well for me with guns like the LCP which have rear sights I really can't use.

I still practice target shooting (I have a really nice ruger 22) and standard shooting fundamentals weekly, but when I'm shooting my carry, I'm working on speed to target and center of mass accuracy (rather than target shooting accuracy).

For some reason the above reminds me of a time when I was in ROTC.
While on the rifle range I had a crusty old Master Sergeant yell at me when I had a ragged hole on a 3 shot group. He said "why on gods green earth would you shoot the poor bastard in the same place? Spread the love around and shoot the SOB in the other side of his chest".