GTC Info: "Titan-Z" $3,000 USD

[monkeydelmagico]

That is almost as much as I paid for my car

I really don't want Nvidia to start trying to make $1,000 appear like a reasonable middle tier price point. When upper middle tier used to be ~$200 just a couple years ago.

I don't think you have to worry. Otherwise the existence of million dollar super cars would have made purchasing your hooptie impossible.

 

[realibrad]

I don't think you have to worry. Otherwise the existence of million dollar super cars would have made purchasing your hooptie impossible.

Good luck on getting people to understand that.

People want to feel like they have the ability to purchase the best of things. Nvidia releasing a $3,000 card means they will no longer sell affordable cards for others. AMD seeing Nvidia selling $3,000 cards will have to do the same, and they wont sell anything below Nvidia. Competition means nothing, which is why things always cost more every year something new comes out. Gosh!

 

[Grooveriding]

This has to be aimed at compute. Nvidia may put the geforce moniker on it, and certainly a few fools will buy one or more for gaming, but I'd think most would be businesses needing compute and not able to afford the higher priced pro cards.

The original Titan did well because it was a bait and switch. It was the first availability of GK110 as geforce and plenty of people had been waiting on it. There was no inkling of 780 at the time, so those who could afford them got them. Totally different situation now. There is 780ti available, and soon to come 6GB versions, making Titan Black and this card completely pointless for gaming. Literally pointless, you'd just be spending more for what would be less performance as these cards are all reference whereas you can get a 780ti Classified.

Might as well call this Titan-F, if you get my drift, as far as gaming goes for the people who buy one for that reason.

 

[Keysplayr]

This has to be aimed at compute. Nvidia may put the geforce moniker on it, and certainly a few fools will buy one or more for gaming, but I'd think most would be businesses needing compute and not able to afford the higher priced pro cards.

The original Titan did well because it was a bait and switch. It was the first availability of GK110 as geforce and plenty of people had been waiting on it. There was no inkling of 780 at the time, so those who could afford them got them. Totally different situation now. There is 780ti available, and soon to come 6GB versions, making Titan Black and this card completely pointless for gaming. Literally pointless, you'd just be spending more for what would be less performance as these cards are all reference whereas you can get a 780ti Classified.

Might as well call this Titan-F, if you get my drift, as far as gaming goes for the people who buy one for that reason.

Definitely looks to be for compute primarily, and yes of course they can be gamed on just as the original Titan can.
Also, there isn't anything that says a GTX790 isn't in the works either. There hasn't been a generation without an dual GPU card. Although this time it's a bit of a twist as we already have the GTX690 Kepler.

 

[moonbogg]

Definitely looks to be for compute primarily, and yes of course they can be gamed on just as the original Titan can.
Also, there isn't anything that says a GTX790 isn't in the works either. There hasn't been a generation without an dual GPU card. Although this time it's a bit of a twist as we already have the GTX690 Kepler.

GTX 790 is only good if you want quad SLI but can't use 4 cards, correct? Or SLI and can't have 2 cards or something. I'd rather just get two Z's and be done with it. :awe:

 

[DooKey]

If Maxwell wasn't coming out this year I'd love to get a couple of 790s.

 

[Grooveriding]

If Maxwell wasn't coming out this year I'd love to get a couple of 790s.

I'd wager a 80%+ chance initial 20nm Maxwell at the end of the year will be like the 680 was; smallish die and 20-30% faster than 780ti. 790 would blow it out of the water.

There is nothing ti SLI can't handle at my resolution, so unless games get more demanding, this time I will pass on the first mid-range sold as flagship card.

 

[DooKey]

I'd wager a 80%+ chance initial 20nm Maxwell at the end of the year will be like the 680 was; smallish die and 20-30% faster than 780ti. 790 would blow it out of the water.

There is nothing ti SLI can't handle at my resolution, so unless games get more demanding, this time I will pass on the first mid-range sold as flagship card.

You might be right about the small die Maxwell. Anyway, with my luck big die Maxwell comes out and is near 790 performance with less power and full DX12 and I splurged on 2x 790. First world problems.........I might go ahead and buy a couple of 790s for giggles anyway........

 

[NTMBK]

GTX 790 is only good if you want quad SLI but can't use 4 cards, correct? Or SLI and can't have 2 cards or something. I'd rather just get two Z's and be done with it. :awe:

Or if you want to ram as much gaming power as you can into a two-slot case. The world's most awesome mini-ITX :$

 

[Vesku]

Or if you want to ram as much gaming power as you can into a two-slot case. The world's most awesome mini-ITX :$

Some people have said it is a 2.5 (i.e. 3) slot card.

 

[Arkaign]

Some people have said it is a 2.5 (i.e. 3) slot card.

Easy : take the stock cooling off, run a hidden radiator to the case from under the desk Stealth water!

 

[Turab]

Dual Hawaii is approaching, Nvidia will make a price cut for sure.

 

[f1sherman]

Dual Hawaii is approaching, Nvidia will make a price cut for sure.

Like they did with Titan after Hawaii launch?

any betting man here:
60:40 that they launch proper gaming dual card instead
70:30 that AMD uses water :ninja:

 

[3DVagabond]

This has to be aimed at compute. Nvidia may put the geforce moniker on it, and certainly a few fools will buy one or more for gaming, but I'd think most would be businesses needing compute and not able to afford the higher priced pro cards.

The original Titan did well because it was a bait and switch. It was the first availability of GK110 as geforce and plenty of people had been waiting on it. There was no inkling of 780 at the time, so those who could afford them got them. Totally different situation now. There is 780ti available, and soon to come 6GB versions, making Titan Black and this card completely pointless for gaming. Literally pointless, you'd just be spending more for what would be less performance as these cards are all reference whereas you can get a 780ti Classified.

Might as well call this Titan-F, if you get my drift, as far as gaming goes for the people who buy one for that reason.

They sold 3 sets of GK110 cards to you. They really like you. You sure you aren't interested in a couple of these? No? How about a couple of 6gig 780ti's then? Surely you've had these plain old 780ti's too long by now. /sarc

 

[VulgarDisplay]

I'd wager a 80%+ chance initial 20nm Maxwell at the end of the year will be like the 680 was; smallish die and 20-30% faster than 780ti. 790 would blow it out of the water.

There is nothing ti SLI can't handle at my resolution, so unless games get more demanding, this time I will pass on the first mid-range sold as flagship card.

This is the question that I really have. Will they go big die out of the gate next gen?

Will AMD ever go big die on the scale of nvidia? I really wish they would because that is the fight I want to see. Two 500+mm2 dies fighting for the performance crown.

 

[3DVagabond]

This is the question that I really have. Will they go big die out of the gate next gen?

Will AMD ever go big die on the scale of nvidia? I really wish they would because that is the fight I want to see. Two 500+mm2 dies fighting for the performance crown.

AMD needs to be able to come in at <300W @ >500mm². I think their designs are too high strung for that. Unless they want to give up clocks and leave performance on the table. Then what's the point?

 

[tolis626]

AMD needs to be able to come in at <300W @ >500mm². I think their designs are too high strung for that. Unless they want to give up clocks and leave performance on the table. Then what's the point?

The problem isn't power when it comes to big dies, not by a long shot. Unless they blew power consumption out of proportion, the smaller heat density would help keep the card cooler.

No, the problem with big dies is financial. A larger die will mean quite fewer dies per wafer (Not to mention more wasted space as the edges of the circular wafers can't be used). I think wafer cost is kinda standard, so they must already know whether they can or cannot go big die. NVidia on the other hand not only have much more money to throw at a big die and sustain the losses in case it flops, but they also have the assurance of the professional market with its humongous margins. If AMD could position itself in the professional market, I'm pretty sure we'll see dies comparable to those NVidia uses.

 

[realibrad]

AMD has been slowly increasing the size of the chips they are making. GK110 that Titan is based on is larger than Hawaii, and has less heat density. When you look at perf/cycle, they are fairly close, but what holds back AMD is heat. As the chip heats up, it loses efficiency, which means performance goes down. AMD then cranks up fan speed, to try and reduce heat, and thus you get the 290.

Nvidia has taken the gamble on larger a larger die because they can. Its given them an advantage for a while now, but the gap is closing. If Hawaii was the same size as GK110, I think things would be very different for AMD, but AMD cant afford to spend more on the larger die.

 

[caswow]

AMD has been slowly increasing the size of the chips they are making. GK110 that Titan is based on is larger than Hawaii, and has less heat density. When you look at perf/cycle, they are fairly close, but what holds back AMD is heat. As the chip heats up, it loses efficiency, which means performance goes down. AMD then cranks up fan speed, to try and reduce heat, and thus you get the 290.

Nvidia has taken the gamble on larger a larger die because they can. Its given them an advantage for a while now, but the gap is closing. If Hawaii was the same size as GK110, I think things would be very different for AMD, but AMD cant afford to spend more on the larger die.

I think there is more than just simple die size = heat. Look at the w9100. It equals the titan z in dp performance while beeing on 435mm² and 275tdp. what do you think about that.

 

[realibrad]

Die size does not = heat, it just means that heat density increases. This means there is less surface area to dissipate heat. Less heat dissipation means lower performance. Larger die means greater surface area, which allows for heat to be taken away easier. Less Heat means higher efficiency.

AMD has packed in a lot of transistors in a smaller area. This means the coolers have to work extra hard to remove the heat being made. It limits the clock rates used, because it has to stay cool. I guess that is what I think about that

 

[TreVader]

I think there is more than just simple die size = heat. Look at the w9100. It equals the titan z in dp performance while beeing on 435mm² and 275tdp. what do you think about that.

Titan Z has horrible compute because Kepler sucks at compute and was never designed for it to begin with. If Titan Z had ECC ram it would be a viable compute card, right now it's just the most expensive card you can buy but not the fastest or even useful for professionals.


It's basically a giant middle finger in the face of customers to advertise this as a "Gaming/professional" card. It is a giant price gouge on a card that would've otherwise fetched $1000 and totally outperformed titan black and the 780ti (GTX-790).

Nvidia designed the 790, looked at the current ti and titan, and realized that they could charge 3x the price if they didn't cripple DP. So they didn't fuse the dies off, and now you pay 3x the price under the laughable excuse that it's for "prosumers".

 

[sontin]

I think there is more than just simple die size = heat. Look at the w9100. It equals the titan z in dp performance while beeing on 435mm² and 275tdp. what do you think about that.

Like the 290x with the 5,7TFLOPs and 250W? :|
Why dont we wait for official numbers from AMD? And then we should wait for actual tests.

 

[caswow]

Like the 290x with the 5,7TFLOPs and 250W? :|
Why dont we wait for official numbers from AMD? And then we should wait for actual tests.

what do you want to say with your post? that amd is crippling dp perf. on consumer cards too? i dont get it.

 

[MrK6]

what do you want to say with your post? that amd is crippling dp perf. on consumer cards too? i dont get it.

Sorry, you're new here. You said something against nvidia, it's a fanboy kneejerk reflex. Welcome to AT :thumbsup:


Use of inflammatory language is not permitted here.

-Moderator Rvenger

 

[DooKey]

Sorry, you're new here. You said something against nvidia, it's a fanboy kneejerk reflex. Welcome to AT :thumbsup:

The NV fanboys don't have a monopoly on kneejerks. That honor is shared by fanboys on both sides of the vid card battle.



That will be enough, let's get back on topic here.

-Moderator Rvenger