Government corruption and wealth disparity

[moonbogg]

These are huge problems in western society. We are doing well on pretty much all other fronts with these two being the biggest exceptions. What are the characteristic problems of, and solutions to these issues?
Some of us know the feeling of struggling just to get by while some rich person gambles away large sums of money or drives around in a car that could have bought your family a home to live in. The governance of the west and the US in general may play a part in why this is so much more common here than in other areas. What's your take?

 

[JM Aggie08]

I don't worry about anyone other than myself and those that I care about. It's worked pretty well so far :thumbsup:.

 

[IronWing]

The characteristic solution is revolution and mob violence. Since that solution pretty much sucks for all involved then the other solution is to organize and vote one's interests.

 

[mmntech]

The public needs to demand more and hold political leaders to a higher standard. Strict caps on campaign donations and lobbying would go a long way to reducing corruption in the US.

Though it's impossible to get Americans motivated enough to do it. Especially if you can't hashtag it.

 

[DesiPower]

<--- P&N?

 

[JM Aggie08]

<--- P&N?

Probably the most important comment in this thread. Get this shit out of OT.

Better yet, ban OP.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Hey I am glad I could inspire.

The solution for America at least is a future activist Supreme Court that reverses what the current court has done with campaign finance. Or just have completely publicly funded campaigns and ban all campaign finance. For the latter to work we need to have more than a two party system though.

Wealth disparity will work itself out after that, as when the 1% can't buy elections the politicians will need to pander for votes which means taking from that 1% via taxes or something else to placate the 99%.

That is the least P&Ny (aka Team Based) answer I can give.

 

[maddogchen]

government corruption in the West? Have you seen the rest of the world? Western countries are amongst the least corrupt...

 

[moonbogg]

<--- P&N?

It not news. Its an off topic discussion.

Probably the most important comment in this thread. Get this shit out of OT.

Better yet, ban OP.

lol, yes of course. Dump the shit right in P&N and keep OT nice and clean. WTF planet are you from? Get with the program.

Hey I am glad I could inspire.

The solution for America at least is a future activist Supreme Court that reverses what the current court has done with campaign finance. Or just have completely publicly funded campaigns and ban all campaign finance. For the latter to work we need to have more than a two party system though.

Wealth disparity will work itself out after that, as when the 1% can't buy elections the politicians will need to pander for votes which means taking from that 1% via taxes or something else to placate the 99%.

That is the least P&Ny (aka Team Based) answer I can give.

Good response, and yes, I borrowed your idea so that I could formally give it back to you.

 

[Ruptga]

Was your other thread on western government not enough?

Require 100% of all campaign funds to come from public funds and ban "gifts" to all government officials and see if that doesn't fix our problems. The solutions are fairly simple, but we don't see it as a problem that threatens our morals (aka Jesus), our children, or our freedoms (aka guns), so nobody really gives a fuck.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Oh and term limits. Jeez term limits would really clean up Washington, which is why we will never get them. By far the biggest flaw in the original system.

 

[unokitty]

Congrats to Denmark, New Zealand, and Singapore!

Uno

 

[JamesV]

Was your other thread on western government not enough?

Require 100% of all campaign funds to come from public funds and ban "gifts" to all government officials and see if that doesn't fix our problems. The solutions are fairly simple, but we don't see it as a problem that threatens our morals (aka Jesus), our children, or our freedoms (aka guns), so nobody really gives a fuck.

Better yet :

1. Require all TV and cable channels to donate time for political ads. You got your semi-monopoly, pay for it Cable. No need to use public funds.

2. Disallow ANY investing while in office or holding a job having anything to do with politics. The current "I'm allowed to insider trade because I'm elected' is pure bullshit, and shouldn't be allowed.

3. Disallow ANY gifts to politicians including everything from lunches to car rides.

4. Mandatory removal from boards, or any funding hearings if you or anyone in your family works for or is invested in the interested parties.

5. Follow the intent of the law, not how you can get around it for your benefit, or face possible expulsion from your post. Want to filibuster to kill an opponents bill instead of working to change it? See ya.

 

[moonbogg]

Was your other thread on western government not enough?

Require 100% of all campaign funds to come from public funds and ban "gifts" to all government officials and see if that doesn't fix our problems. The solutions are fairly simple, but we don't see it as a problem that threatens our morals (aka Jesus), our children, or our freedoms (aka guns), so nobody really gives a fuck.

The other thread is about culture. This is a very specific thread. Not the same, but thanks again for stopping by and posting in ANOTHER moonbogg thread.

Also, we need to remove the ability to bribe government as well as fix healthcare.

 

[Ruptga]

I wish I knew how to quit you, moonbogg.

 

[moonbogg]

I wish I knew how to quit you, moonbogg.

I know Ruptga, I know. Lets keep it on topic though, OK? You'll be fine.

 

[Ruptga]

I already answered your question, and you even agreed! We'll have to find something to argue about or this thread will have to be closed.

 

[cbrunny]

Congrats to Denmark, New Zealand, and Singapore!

Uno

Yeah pretty much this. The modern presidential system as it exists in the states requires extremism in order to make moderates of each political party seem tolerable in order to win support. Not only that, but people have a difficult time distinguishing between extremism to make a point (Greenpeace) and just straight up extremism because that's what you believe (Tea Party). One of these two - Greenpeace and the Tea Party - is taken much more seriously than the other. You all know which one it is.

Extremism breeds corruption on both sides of the aisle.

I'd bet there will be another US Civil War in my lifetime, and hopefully whatever emerges is at minimum more co-operative than what currently exists, if not a full blown Parliament.

There's a comedy bit by some stand up guy that I hear sometimes on XM about how 9/11 changed America in a way where people are now more focused on their own children and lives rather than fostering a community. Not to say it isn't important to look after your own but he says the concept of "it takes a village" is completely gone now. Sad how true that appears to be. I'm guilty of it too, though I don't want to be.

If we were all just nicer to each other - even just a little bit - that'd be something positive.

 

[poofyhairguy]

2. Disallow ANY investing while in office or holding a job having anything to do with politics. The current "I'm allowed to insider trade because I'm elected' is pure bullshit, and shouldn't be allowed.

There has to be some crazy non-compete too. Like a five year non-compete. The worst thing IMHO is when former politicians become future lobbyists (for big $) the second they are out of office.

5. Follow the intent of the law, not how you can get around it for your benefit, or face possible expulsion from your post. Want to filibuster to kill an opponents bill instead of working to change it? See ya.

So basically William Shakespeare's plan?

 

[z1ggy]

I second the motion to ban OP.

 

[poofyhairguy]

There's a comedy bit by some stand up guy that I hear sometimes on XM about how 9/11 changed America in a way where people are now more focused on their own children and lives rather than fostering a community. Not to say it isn't important to look after your own but he says the concept of "it takes a village" is completely gone now. Sad how true that appears to be. I'm guilty of it too, though I don't want to be.

Sounds like another good spinoff thread.

 

[moonbogg]

I already answered your question, and you even agreed! We'll have to find something to argue about or this thread will have to be closed.

You have no idea what you are talking. The US has major corruption problem and the salary is not at fault. A salary is not a bribe.

 

[Ruptga]

You have no idea what you are talking. The US has major corruption problem and the salary is not at fault. A salary is not a bribe.

This is what bribery looks (or looked) like
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/...cle_53ab0bee-f47f-5e7a-8cfd-1b0b88f6d550.html

Also I count any campaign contributions as bribes. These days nobody gets elected without spending millions on calling their opponent an asshole, so those donors are literally buying elections. Make it so every campaign has to use the same amount of resources and that kind of corruption should be impossible. Salaries have nothing to do with it, but that was a nice try at starting an argument for the sake of the thread.

 

[moonbogg]

This is what bribery looks (or looked) like
http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/...cle_53ab0bee-f47f-5e7a-8cfd-1b0b88f6d550.html

Also I count any campaign contributions as bribes. These days nobody gets elected without spending millions on calling their opponent an asshole, so those donors are literally buying elections. Make it so every campaign has to use the same amount of resources and that kind of corruption should be impossible. Salaries have nothing to do with it, but that was a nice try at starting an argument for the sake of the thread.

Without "bribes" how would people fund campaigns? There are donation limits. What else do you want in that area? The US is corrupt because we lack a core moral structure and we put our own interests before anyone else's, as individuals and as a society. We are taught to think that way. Get as much for yourself as possible and watch the world burn in your wake.
We are taught that our neighbor is a competitor instead of a companion. The man next to you is someone who you must defeat, rather than someone you can lean on and offer support in return.
A dozen branches standing individually will fall, but if they lean on each other they become a strong structure.

 

[DesiPower]

It not news. Its an off topic discussion.

The title of your thread says "Government" how much more political can get dimwit? The the frell out of there