• We’re currently investigating an issue related to the forum theme and styling that is impacting page layout and visual formatting. The problem has been identified, and we are actively working on a resolution. There is no impact to user data or functionality, this is strictly a front-end display issue. We’ll post an update once the fix has been deployed. Thanks for your patience while we get this sorted.

Gore siezes the high ground?

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.


<< Ummm... do you think the courts would grant Gore an extension on the ballot counting and not do the same for Bush if he so desired? That &quot;gesture&quot; would have nothing to do with Gore, it's entirely a legal matter. >>



Gore will simply ask that the requested manual counts be allowed to happen. I think there are only three counties that asked to have them considered by 2pm today, the time imposed by Secretary of State and Bush Co-chairman Kathleen Harris.

Bush had the same chance to ask for manual counts, he passed it up. I think it is too late to ask for the manual recounts elsewhere in Florida.
 
ride525,

I feel fairly certain that Bush could still get recounts. After all, the courts ruling basically says that &quot;getting it right&quot; is more important than getting it done quickly. Bush could argue he wished to seek to stop the recount before beginning one himself.

If the court denied him that, there would be cries of prefential treatment and discrimination.

Edit: Oops.
 
Moonbeam,

Like I said, he used a page right out of slick Willi's book.
Distract the people with an offer of comity and fairness, knowing full well that the time has past for the Bush campaign to ask for recounts on anything.

 
Gore said that &quot;he would not contest it in court, and he would not support contesting it in court.&quot; That does not mean that if the DNC decided to contest it in court and won that he wouldn't move his belongings right in 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. He would act incredulous as the DNC was wrangling in court on his behalf. Nothing more than political posturing.
 
How can anyone say that Bush should shut up because he decided not to go fishing for votes? To agree with that is to say that it's OK for Gore to fabricate votes because Bush could've picked some Republican counties to make some up for himself! It's WRONG to FABRICATE VOTES on both sides!!!

Bush has won after a week of Democratic attempts to scrounge up some more votes. The law is clear and it's just too bad for Gore that it won't allow him to steal the election. Maybe he should've lied a bit less and gotten some more votes, hmmm?
 
I think it would be entirely reasonable for recounts to be requested elsewhere later on down the road -- the Gore camp has even proposed that just now. It can be argued that if there is a dramatic switch from the now-legal manual recount in the large Dem counties (in the sense that at that time the manual recount has been deemed valid), it is only correct and just to have the TRUE vote of the Florida people and recount the entire state. Selectively choosing the largest Democratic strongholds and then denying the same to the Republicans could never fly in court.

I'm not saying it's correct, only that it's likely to happen if Gore's manual recounts overturn the current standing. Of course, I'm sure his minions have been busy ripping those chads off ballots around the state. 😉
 
This Palm Beach County resident welcomes a Gore loss.

Such a loss will invalidate Democrat Palm Beach County residents' beliefs that, despite being intellectually inept -- unable to poke a hole in a stationary piece of paper -- nevertheless, they are capable of correctly judging who is best able to be President, based on their insightful understanding of the complex issues that confront a President and the nation he/she administers.

Bush is said by many to be intellectually light-weight. There is no longer any doubt that Palm Beach County Democrats are blissfully skipping down the road to OZ in search of a brain and have found only the axe-wielding Tin Man upon which to pin their hopes for protection from that bad, ol', nasty paper ballot.

🙂

 
U.G.

Good point... eh.... I think....?

Are you one of those guys who has one of those old pictures of Einstein hanging in your office? Please tell me no. I hate that.

Just say what you mean. We will still respect you. Promise. 🙂

 
I'm not a fan of Bush, but I'm diametrically opposed to Gore's dirty tactics. It amazes me that after 8 years of trailer trash in our nation's best house that we want another 4. I feel Gore will end up winning. He will lose in 2004 most definately, hopefully the pubs can get a better candidate by then. (mccain?) Anyways, it's nice to see Gore act like he can give and take recounts as he pleases. This is nothing more than a PR move. They know Bush can not take him up on his offer now after going on about handcounts being less reliable than machine counts, or was that it was unfair to handcount just selective counties?

Gore's Speech, it's a nice BS job at least 🙂 (got to respect that)

&quot;GORE: This has been an extraordinary eight days for the American people, and I wanted to speak with you briefly about how I believe we should conclude this election.


The campaign is over, but a test of our democracy is now under way. It is a test we must pass, and it is a test we will pass with flying colors. All we need is a common agreement that what is at stake here is not who wins and who loses in a contest for the presidency, but how we honor our Constitution and make sure that our democracy works as our founders intended it to work.


This is a time to respect every voter and every vote. This is a time to honor the true will of the people. So our goal must be what is right for America.


There is a simple reason that Florida law and the law in many other states calls for a careful check by real people of the machine results in elections like this one.


The reason? Machines can sometimes misread or fail to detect the way ballots are cast, and when there are serious doubts, checking the machine count with a careful hand count is accepted far and wide as the best way to know the true intentions of the voters.


That is why there have already been partial or complete hand counts not just in two Democratic counties in Florida, but in six Republican counties as well.


We need a resolution that is fair and final. We need to move expeditiously to the most complete and accurate count that is possible. And that is why I propose this evening a way to settle this matter with finality and justice in a period of days, not weeks.


First, we should complete hand counts already begun in Palm Beach County, Dade County and Broward County to determine the true intentions of the voters based on an objective evaluation of their ballots.


Observers and participants from both parties should be present in every counting room, as required under Florida law.


The results of this recount would, of course, be added to the present certified vote total and the overseas absentee vote total. If this happens, I will abide by the result, I will take no legal action to challenge the result, and I will not support any legal action to challenge the result.


I am also prepared, if Governor Bush prefers, to include in this recount all the counties in the entire state of Florida. I would also be willing to abide by that result and agree not to take any legal action to challenge that result. If there are no further interruptions to the process, we believe the count can be completed with seven days of the time it starts.


Now, second, I propose that Governor Bush and I meet personally, one on one, as soon as possible, before the vote count is finished, not to negotiate, but to improve the tone of our dialogue in America. We should both call on all of our supporters to respect the outcome of this election, whatever it may be. We should both call on all our supporters to prepare themselves to close ranks as Americans and unite the country behind the winner as soon as this process is completed.


Shortly after the results are known, we should both come together for another meeting, to reaffirm our national unity. If I turn out to be successful, I'll be ready to travel to Governor Bush's home. If I am not, I'll be ready to meet him wherever he wishes.


I would also like to urge all of those speaking for either of us to do their part to lift up this discourse, to refrain from using inflammatory language, and to avoid statements that could make it harder for our country to come together once the counting is over. That is the direction I have given to my own campaign.


I don't know what the final results will show, but I do know this is about much more than what happens to me or my opponent; it is about our democracy. My faith is in the people's will, in our Constitution and in our system of self-government.


Thank you, God bless you and God bless America. &quot;

Bush's Rejection

&quot;Good evening. Tonight, Secretary Cheney and I thank the many thousands of Americans who have written or called or e-mailed to offer prayers and encouragement as we all await the outcome of the election.

I'm sure that Vice President Gore and Senator Lieberman are receiving similar good wishes, and would want to join us in thanking our fellow Americans for their caring and concern.

No matter who you voted for in this election, whether you supported Vice President Gore or whether you supported me, all Americans want a fair and accurate count of the votes in Florida, a fair and accurate count that measures up to the highest standards and principles outlined in our Constitution and our laws.

As we work to conclude this election, we should be guided by three principles: This process must be fair, this process must be accurate, and this process must be final.

First, the election must be fair: fair to voters throughout America, fair to voters in Florida, and fair to voters in different counties in Florida. I honor and respect the value of every single vote. That's why my campaign supported the automatic recount of all the votes in Florida.

Everyone in Florida has had his or her vote counted once. Those votes have been recounted. In some counties they have been counted a third and even fourth time.

And that brings us to the second principle: accuracy. This process must be accurate. As Americans have watched on television, they have seen for themselves that manual counting, with individuals making subjective decisions about voter intent, introduces human error and politics into the vote-counting process.

Each time these voting cards are handled the potential for errors multiplies. Additional manual counts of votes that have been counted and recounted will make the process less accurate, not more so.

Third, not for the Vice President Gore, or for me, but for America, this process must have a point of conclusion, a moment when America and the world know who is the next president.

This is precisely why the laws of the state of Florida have deadlines for certification of the election vote. One of them came last night, and tonight, Florida's chief election official and the state's election canvassing commission have reaffirmed it as their responsibilities require.

The next and final deadline comes Friday at midnight, when overseas absentee ballots must have been received to be counted in Florida. I don't know who these ballots will support and neither does Vice President Gore.

The votes of Florida have been counted. They have been recounted and tonight they have been certified and we do not know yet who has won.

The way to conclude this election in a fair and accurate and final way is for the state of Florida to count the remaining overseas ballots, add them to the certified vote, and announce the results as required by Florida law.

I was encouraged tonight that Vice President Gore called for a conclusion to this process. We all agree.

Unfortunately, what the vice president proposed is exactly what he's been proposing all along: continuing with selective hand recounts that are neither fair nor accurate, or compounding the error by extending a flawed process statewide.

This means every vote in Florida would be evaluated differently, by different individuals using different judgment, and perhaps different local standards, or perhaps no standards at all.

This would be neither fair nor accurate; it would be arbitrary and chaotic.

At this unique moment in our nation's history, all of us have responsibilities. We have a responsibility to conduct ourselves with dignity and honor. We have a responsibility to make sure that those who speak for us do not poison our politics. And we have a responsibility to respect the law and not seek to undermine it when we do not like its outcome.

The outcome of this election will not be the result of deals or efforts to mold public opinion. The outcome of this election will be determined by the votes and by the law.

Once this election is over, I would be glad to meet with Vice President Gore, and I join him in pledging that regardless of who wins after this weekend's final count, we will work together to unite our great country.

Thank you and God bless America.&quot;

Sound like similar BS jobs to me, nothing new here.
 
Cybordolphin;

<...one of those guys who has one of those old pictures of Einstein hanging in your office?..>

Nope. An old picture of Feynman. 😉

 
what six republican counties got hand counted? i've never heard that before! what a crock of sh!t. daley helped rig the 1960 election, now his son is trying to rig the 2000 election. manual counting sucks. inaccurate, easy to fake, easy to commit fraud. &quot;oops, i just happned to mark the democrat's tally twice, and hey, no one noticed&quot; we've already counted TWICE and both times were for bush. this election will have more infamy that landslide lyndon johnson's first senate bid where 100+ people voted in alphabetical order for LBJ, and signed into the poll in the same writing.
 


<< what six republican counties got hand counted? i've never heard that before! >>



Interesting question....I'm checking to see if Gore said that....and what they are....

EDIT: Gore clearly said that.....he was talking partial too, were their six Republican counties that got spot or partial manual counts? Still checking... I haven't heard the Republican Spin Doctors say anything about this....they would have jumped all over it if untrue....if I find out more I'll post..
 
so who do you think will get the absentee ballots?? I think Bush will. reason being a lot will come from oversea's army officers. and good ol'. billy has spent a lot of time cutting back on our defense. why vote a guy in that is probably going to take away your job.....
 
If manual recounts are finally not allowed, they Gore will have a lot of make-up to do on overseas ballots....and apparently some overseas ballots have already been included in counts...

Some say in addition to military, absentees in Israel were pushed where Gore/Lieberman would be expected to be favored....Stay tuned...
 
fluxquantum, you're not forced to watch tv with the election coverage on, you don't have to read the top headline in the newpaper concerning this issue. Obviously you care who gets elected or you wouldn't be sick of it after only one week.

 
several counties released some stats today on the uncounted foreign AB ballots. Mine has about 70.

20% registered dems, 60% reg Republicans, 20% reg independent. other counties will have different breakdowns.

There have been about 500 military ballots received by postmaster in Miami.

Total uncounted foreign AB ballots received, so far around 4,900, statewide

foreign AB ballots received before Nov 7 were counted with the other AB ballots. There was no breakdown of how they voted.
 
500 military ballots? Any figures available on how many were requested and sent out and if any of those have already been returned and counted on or before the 7th? If none have already been counted then that 500 figure seems awfully low to me. Do we know approximately how many military personnel from Florida are overseas?
 


<< I think be deemed legal as an attempt to find the true intent of the American people. >>


You mean the intent of a heavily Democratic county as determined by Democratic election officials who conduct their actions in accordance with a legal opinion handed down by a Democratic Attorney General and a Democratic judge, right?
 
Bore is really starting to piss me off...where the heck does he get off trying to circumvent the law, and further taint the real vote count. Ballot counts aren't supposed to be 100% accurate, this isn't a true democracy...😀 There's nothing wrong with Bush not meeting with Bore; who would want to meet with such a liar and childish loser (in all definitions of the word). Getting a &quot;fair&quot; count is such BS. Maybe not orriginally, but it is now...
 
Caught a clip on the news yesterday that stated Bush was up by 300 votes... guess Bush should just chill until he Gore goes up. Man, I'd rather have Clinton back again... I guess the lure of the presidential office isn't that great anymore when you have this set of candidates running... whatever happened to all the glamour? I could give two sh*ts about the presidency these days... Bill Gates has my attention more than Bill Clinton...
 
<<meet with Gore to work things out>>

Gore has made it quite clear that like a petulant child, nothing short of stealing the election will suffice. What is there to 'work out'? I can just hear it now.... &quot;GW, can't you be reasonable and let me have the election? Common, give me the election, and I'll drop all the lawsuits filed by my minions. Aw common, you're not being reasonable. Give me it! I said Give me it! Mooooo-ooooom, GW's not playing nice!&quot;.
 
have you noticed how all republicans say bush has won, yet the will of the people aka popular votes is for gore??

i guess its true, whatever favors the elite in USA, screw the other (larger) half

sad next 4 years, no one cry when they dig up crap on bush because i will say:

I Told You So😉😛
 
Back
Top