GOP blinks on debt limit.

[fskimospy]

what will then?

lol, the republicans are less honest than the dems? so a kettle is more black than the pot?

In the case of the debt ceiling they are less honest, yes. They claim that the deficit is their number one priority, but were unwilling to accept ANY tax increases at all in order to help close it, even when those tax increases were on very favorable terms to them. That clearly means that closing the deficit is not in fact their number 1 priority, but keeping taxes low is.

There's nothing wrong with valuing low tax rates over everything else, but they are clearly not being honest with us when they say that closing the deficit is their goal.

 

[ProfJohn]

McConnel's debit limit vote record:

Obama's debt limit record:

The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies.

He was against it before he was for it..

 

[ProfJohn]

The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies.

Over the past 5 years, our federal debt has increased by $3.5 trillion to $8.6 trillion.That is “trillion” with a “T.” That is money that we have borrowed from the Social Security trust fund, borrowed from China and Japan, borrowed from American taxpayers. And over the next 5 years, between now and 2011, the President’s budget will increase the debt by almost another $3.5 trillion.

Numbers that large are sometimes hard to understand. Some people may wonder why they matter. Here is why: This year, the Federal Government will spend $220 billion on interest. That is more money to pay interest on our national debt than we’ll spend on Medicaid and the State Children’s Health Insurance Program. That is more money to pay interest on our debt this year than we will spend on education, homeland security, transportation, and veterans benefits combined. It is more money in one year than we are likely to spend to rebuild the devastated gulf coast in a way that honors the best of America.

And the cost of our debt is one of the fastest growing expenses in the Federal budget. This rising debt is a hidden domestic enemy, robbing our cities and States of critical investments in infrastructure like bridges, ports, and levees; robbing our families and our children of critical investments in education and health care reform; robbing our seniors of the retirement and health security they have counted on.

Every dollar we pay in interest is a dollar that is not going to investment in America’s priorities.

Senator Barack Obama
Senate Floor Speech on Public Debt
March 16, 2006

 

[fskimospy]

Obama's debt limit record:

He was against it before he was for it..

Hint: the party out of power is almost always against the debt limit. The party in power is almost always for it. Go look at the Republican debt ceiling votes under Bush. (and the Democratic ones for that matter) They conveniently switch.

 

[blackangst1]

Hint: the party out of power is almost always against the debt limit. The party in power is almost always for it. Go look at the Republican debt ceiling votes under Bush. (and the Democratic ones for that matter) They conveniently switch.

Correct!

 

[Lithium381]

Hint: the party out of power is almost always against the debt limit. The party in power is almost always for it. Go look at the Republican debt ceiling votes under Bush. (and the Democratic ones for that matter) They conveniently switch.

well sure..... but doesn't that make it look more like a political issue than a " do whats best for america" policy?

 

[fskimospy]

well sure..... but doesn't that make it look more like a political issue than a " do whats best for america" policy?

Well of course it is. By all accounts raising the debt limit is what is best for America however. An important difference between now and the past however is that before, those 'no' votes were meaningless protest votes; no harm, no foul. While I still find it impossible to imagine that the Republicans would willingly inflict catastrophic damage to the world economy, those 'no' votes matter from them this time. Sadly, they continue to behave like spoiled children.

 

[KlokWyze]

They've been passing the back on the debt issue for years and now it's finally coming down to the wire. The righties want the economy to tank RIGHT NOW and Obama just wants it to tank when they are back in office.

None of the problems that caused all this shit in the first place were even fixed. Every person in this forum sees that. Why is it not possible to hold these people accountable for being enemies of the state?

 

[fskimospy]

By the way, an interesting chat with Bruce Bartlett here. He's a former adviser to Reagan and he worked in the Treasury Department under Bush 1.

http://live.washingtonpost.com/outl...11.html?hpid=z1&tid=sm_twitter_washingtonpost

Basically, he thinks the GOP has gone insane.

 

[Lithium381]

By the way, an interesting chat with Bruce Bartlett here. He's a former adviser to Reagan and he worked in the Treasury Department under Bush 1.

http://live.washingtonpost.com/outl...11.html?hpid=z1&tid=sm_twitter_washingtonpost

Basically, he thinks the GOP has gone insane.

from your article:

1. The debt limit is an effective way to control spending and deficits.

Not at all. In 2003, Brian Roseboro, assistant secretary of the Treasury for financial markets, explained it best: “The plain truth is that the debt limit does not affect the deficits or surpluses. The critical revenue and spending decisions are made during the congressional budget process.”

um, so in the past 800+ days that have passed since we actually had a real congressional budget......oh wait

but his points are valid overall.... though the part about the '74 budget law.... i'll have to look into that since i've never heard of that one

 

[Thump553]

If this "solution" gives the GOP what it wants without destroying the country (which course of action they have otherwise boxed themselves into) then I'm for it.

 

[Generator]

Mitch was so flustered I thought he pissed his pants. These Republicans are just dreadful for this country. What a waste of time these people are. I was thinking that Congress would do that little extension for a later day. Now it looks like in their incompentence that made Obama a emperor.

As for the Tea Party. That shit group of rubes is an illusion, they died back in February over whatever issue that won't come to mind at the moment.

 

[Double Trouble]

This seems like a very smart strategy. Give Obama the power to do what he's said all along needs to be done. Let him do it, and let him take the blame for taking the politically unpopular action.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm in complete agreement with the GOP with regard to raising taxes: no, absolutely not. Under no circumstances should any additional taxes be created or tax rates raised until government cuts spending significantly and demonstrates the ability to responsibly spend. Until then, it's just handing a credit card to a teenager, it inevitably leads to dumb spending.

 

[fskimospy]

This seems like a very smart strategy. Give Obama the power to do what he's said all along needs to be done. Let him do it, and let him take the blame for taking the politically unpopular action.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm in complete agreement with the GOP with regard to raising taxes: no, absolutely not. Under no circumstances should any additional taxes be created or tax rates raised until government cuts spending significantly and demonstrates the ability to responsibly spend. Until then, it's just handing a credit card to a teenager, it inevitably leads to dumb spending.

As we've long ago shown, taxes and spending are not related to one another.

 

[Craig234]

This seems like a very smart strategy. Give Obama the power to do what he's said all along needs to be done. Let him do it, and let him take the blame for taking the politically unpopular action.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm in complete agreement with the GOP with regard to raising taxes: no, absolutely not. Under no circumstances should any additional taxes be created or tax rates raised until government cuts spending significantly and demonstrates the ability to responsibly spend. Until then, it's just handing a credit card to a teenager, it inevitably leads to dumb spending.

Ignorant ideology, and unrelated to this situation - the proposals on the table are 83% spending cuts with closing some loopholes and subsidies that raise revenue.

Sorry, this deal is a very *Republican* deal. It's crazy that it's the *Democratic* proposal.

No deal should be driven IMO by 'compromise' or fixed percentages, but by the merits of the issues - but in the 90's, the formula was 50% revenue, 50% cuts.

Our problem IMO is we have a good progressive minority, a Republican president, and an insane Republican party for the most part.

The place for budget negotiations is in budget negotiations, not the debt ceiling.

Progressives are not enamored of Barack "take entitlements - please!" Obama.

The fiscally responsible position is to recall that we can move towards a balanced budget and afford the programs keeping a strong middle class and helping the poor.

I recently posted the Progressive budget which does just that - and which is more than fair to the rich both economically, protecting their incentives, and justice.

Guess what, when you have the bottom 80% of Americans getting zero of economic growth, the fix for that is going to need *some* rebalancing of the tax breaks for wealthy.

 

[Macamus Prime]

The Republicans were going to fix everything. Now, they are no different than the Democrats.

Also, now, the Tea Party is nothing more than a group of idiots and no one should listen to them.

You guys need to get your fucking stories straight.

 

[Painman]

Theater Fucking Prime. Completely manufactured crisis. WHERE WAS THE DEBT CRISIS!!!! when GWB was waging fraudulent war in Iraq? And needed to raise the debt ceiling to pay for that?

This is such absoloutely naked, brazen Bullshit. A completely manufactured crisis.

Republicans, if they get "their way", should not win another single election for at least 50 years. Since "their way" seems to be holding a gun to the head of every single American (including every Republican) and threatening to shoot...

Srsly... WTF?

 

[Turin39789]

So Mitch wants to abandon his responsibility in this debate? His proposal is that the President can raise the debt ceiling by himself, but has to create equivalent cuts in spending, and then all the Republicans can vote against it but it will pass anyway and then they can run attack ads for his unpopular cuts that they were powerless to stop.

That is his solution to the corner he painted himself into?

 

[PokerGuy]

Republicans, if they get "their way", should not win another single election for at least 50 years. Since "their way" seems to be holding a gun to the head of every single American (including every Republican) and threatening to shoot...

Srsly... WTF?

Funny that you somehow equate "no new taxes on the people, fix government spending first" as holding a gun to everyone's head. Just shows the dimlib way of thinking.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

Funny that you somehow equate "no new taxes on the people, fix government spending first" as holding a gun to everyone's head. Just shows the dimlib way of thinking.

Even funnier is how you seem to believe that the republican policies of cutting the legs out from under the economy with unjustified tax cuts for the wealthy and driving us into insane levels of debt to fund questionable wars was good policy. And after a decade of wealth transfer from the working class to the wealthy you believe the burden for digging us out of this hole created by these policies should be shouldered only by the working class and elderly while the wealthy continue to reap the rewards of prosperity.

 

[kage69]

Mitch was so flustered I thought he pissed his pants. These Republicans are just dreadful for this country. What a waste of time these people are. I was thinking that Congress would do that little extension for a later day. Now it looks like in their incompentence that made Obama a emperor.

As for the Tea Party. That shit group of rubes is an illusion, they died back in February over whatever issue that won't come to mind at the moment.

This.


Usually I love watching that toad squirm, but now it's just gotten sickening as they don't even pretend to give a shit about the bottom 98% of the country. Girding the wallets of record income takers and following political dogma seems to be wayyy more important to the GOP than actually doing their jobs by trying to be part of the solution.

The Dems have more of my sympathy these last few months, having to deal with idiots who are pushing this country to ruin and managing to sound magnanimous in the process must be the definition of maddening.

 

[Munky]

Of course no one ever bothered to ask Obama what he did with all the SS tax income that he now needs to take on more debt to cover the SS payments.

 

[Thump553]

Of course no one ever bothered to ask Obama what he did with all the SS tax income that he now needs to take on more debt to cover the SS payments.

During the Reagan-era SS reform, Al Gore fought valiantly but unsuccessfully for SS trust funds to be actually treated like trust funds, i.e. sequestered in seperate accounts from the general fund but he was overruled. The law and practice for decades now is that SS receipts go right into the general fund.

Blaming that on Obama is to ignore the exact same practice (a practice mandated by law) of a half dozen or so Presidents before him, most of which were GOP.

Sorry to burst your bubble.

 

[Munky]

During the Reagan-era SS reform, Al Gore fought valiantly but unsuccessfully for SS trust funds to be actually treated like trust funds, i.e. sequestered in seperate accounts from the general fund but he was overruled. The law and practice for decades now is that SS receipts go right into the general fund.

Blaming that on Obama is to ignore the exact same practice (a practice mandated by law) of a half dozen or so Presidents before him, most of which were GOP.

Sorry to burst your bubble.

I didn't say it was completely Obama's fault. But he is continuing idiotic policies that got us into this mess in the first place.

 

[xj0hnx]

... with unjustified tax cuts for the wealthy and driving us into insane levels of debt to fund questionable wars was good policy.

Yea, tax cuts are why we have such high debt, nothing to do with ridiculous spending, it's the tax cuts.