GOP 2012: What They (wouldn't) Cut

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zsdersw

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Oct 29, 2003
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http://money.cnn.com/2012/01/05/news/economy/budget_cuts/index.htm?hpt=hp_bn3

NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- For all their differences, the 2012 Republican contenders have at least one thing in common: They all want to cut spending.
Rick Santorum wants to cut $5 trillion over 5 years, immediately return non-defense discretionary spending to 2008 levels, pass a balanced budget amendment and cap federal spending at 18% of Gross Domestic Product.

Mitt Romney would cap spending at 20% of GDP, immediately reduce non-security discretionary accounts by 5% and pursue a balanced budget amendment.
Newt Gingrich, Rick Perry and Jon Huntsman have designs of their own.
Problem is, the candidates lack a set of realistic, specific proposals that stand even a small chance of becoming law.

"If you look at most politicians talking about cuts, they are very, very, very short on specifics with a few exceptions," said Tad DeHaven, a budget analyst at the CATO Institute, a libertarian think tank that advocates for smaller government.

On the hunt for specific budget cuts, DeHaven combed through the economic plans listed on each candidate's campaign website.
He came away disappointed -- with one exception.
"From a spending standpoint, there is Ron Paul and then everybody else," DeHaven said. "You have a complete budget from Paul, and not much from anybody else."

Paul's plan doesn't lack ambition. He wants to eliminate the Departments of Energy, Housing and Urban Development, Commerce, Interior and Education.

And on his website, Paul lays out a four-year plan with budget lines for federal agencies and programs that he wants to eliminate with a high degree of specificity.

By way of contrast, Romney and Santorum list only a few programs they want to axe, despite their big promises.

Romney wants to cut funding for relatively small programs like Amtrak, the National Endowment for the Arts, foreign aid, the Corporation for Public Broadcasting and Title X family planning.

He does detail a few bigger ticket items, like a reduction in the size of the federal workforce and a modification to Medicaid that would turn it into a block grant program -- but not much else. Overall, DeHaven said Romney's specific cuts are "tiny" and "the typical small stuff."

Santorum doesn't fare much better, focusing on red-meat Republican priorities like funding cuts for the National Labor Relations Board, USAID, Planned Parenthood and the Environmental Protection Agency.

The mix of politics and budgeting isn't too surprising, especially given that the candidates are still battling the Republican nomination, a process that requires capturing the attention of the conservative party base.

DeHaven said another factor is contributing to the lack of details: candidates from both parties often shy away from discussing budget cuts for fear of a backlash from interest groups and advocates.

"When you call for specific cuts, every program has a constituency, and that's when they come alive," DeHaven said.

For that reason, GOP candidates are returning to an old standby this cycle: The balanced budget amendment, a proposal that -- barring a GOP landslide in congressional races -- stands little chance of becoming law.

"Most candidates embrace a [balanced budget amendment] because they don't have the desire or ability to formulate a concrete proposal," DeHaven said.
Should one of the Republican candidates defeat President Obama in November, they will run up against another budget plan buzzsaw: Congress.

House Republicans, including an enthusiastic set of freshmen, devoted much of the 2011 legislative session to initiatives that would have reduced spending.

The House passed an ambitious budget that was never enacted, and funding for the federal government almost lapsed on a few occasions while lawmakers squabbled over relatively small budget cuts.

And in perhaps the best example of how difficult it can be to cut spending, the country was brought to the brink of default after negotiations over the debt ceiling dragged until the last minute.

At the termination of that debate, a large number of spending cuts were left to the super committee to identify. Why? Because lawmakers couldn't agree on specific programs to cut.
And of course, the super committee then failed at the same task, despite overwhelming pressure and an extended deadline.

This strikes me as entirely true. Ron Paul is the only one I'd come close to trusting to actually cut spending in significant amounts.

The other candidates won't make a lot of concrete proposals of what to cut because they have a chance of winning and actually being held accountable for living up to their promises.

So, if Ron Paul doesn't win the nomination (which is quite likely) America's choices will be between Obama and Obama-lite. I don't know about you, but that doesn't exactly get me excited.
 

airdata

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Jul 11, 2010
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If Obama taught me anything, it's that in the end it really doesn't matter who you vote for.

I voted for obama. My vote didn't count toward him winning though since McCain won my state. And then all he's done is carry on Bush era policies. We're still nation building and starting wars we don't need to be starting.

How much influence does the president really have when we have all of these established wars and occupations going on?
 

Anarchist420

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Romney won't cut spending and he's already proposed raising taxes. It pisses me off when they talk about capping spending at n% of GDP, because GDP can be manipulated by the government and it includes government work. If anything, we should really be aiming for lower GDP. Also, does he mean capping spending at real GDP or nominal GDP? Spending as % of GDP means nothing; it should be thought of as absolute spending. Romney has also already complained about us having a stronger currency than China. if elected, he'll be more economically authoritarian than Obama, not less so.

Santorum won't cut spending either.

Here's how you cut spending:
1. Reducing military spending the first year to not more than 1/3 of what it was the previous year. Closing all of our overseas bases is an absolute necessity. That will save at least $425Bn
2. Reform medicare part D (use generics and imports whenever possible and repeal patents). That would reduce the FY13 budget by at least $40bn.
3. Take the wealthy off medicare (something like a 2/3 tax after the first $28k of their non social security income for them to be able to use it). That would save at least $50Bn
4. reduce the highest amount of SS paycheck to about $1.7k/month or at the very least, cap it at what it is now ($~2.45k if I'm not mistaken) for 5 years. The former method would reduce the FY13 budget by at least $60Bn.
5. abolish 5 depts. That can save up to $250Bn
6. Switch handouts to block grants to states and freeze it. That cuts federal welfare spending by 1/2 and saves at least $225Bn.

Will Romney/Santorum do any of those things? No.
 

Ausm

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
25,213
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If Obama taught me anything, it's that in the end it really doesn't matter who you vote for.

I voted for obama. My vote didn't count toward him winning though since McCain won my state. And then all he's done is carry on Bush era policies. We're still nation building and starting wars we don't need to be starting.

How much influence does the president really have when we have all of these established wars and occupations going on?

I agree on many of your points but look at what he is up against ... unparalleled obstructionism by a party who insists on ruling while being in the minority. This makes it damn difficult to get anything done .
 

brencat

Platinum Member
Feb 26, 2007
2,170
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Here's how you cut spending:
1. Reducing military spending the first year to not more than 1/3 of what it was the previous year. Closing all of our overseas bases is an absolute necessity. That will save at least $425Bn

Seriously you are out of your fvcking mind. That is neither possible nor wise. Why would we want to have NO overseas presence are you mad ???

You libertarian retards are something else. No need to address any of your other points. This is why Ron Paul has NO SHOT and never had.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
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If Obama taught me anything, it's that in the end it really doesn't matter who you vote for.

I voted for obama. My vote didn't count toward him winning though since McCain won my state. And then all he's done is carry on Bush era policies. We're still nation building and starting wars we don't need to be starting.

How much influence does the president really have when we have all of these established wars and occupations going on?

That's the wrong lesson to draw. Just because one President is too little 'change', is no reason to say 'democracy is useless'.

You can look to other presidents - a Kennedy, an FDR, for example, who helped a lot.

And you can even learn that President Obama has made some big differences - if many of them were just to 'stop the bleeding'.

But the Supreme Court alone - two moderate Justices appointed that would have been two more on the radical right ensuring terrible rulings for decades to come - is very important.

Consider the impact of our democracy-destroying 5-4 Citizens v. United ruling alone - a few hundred votes in Florida and other irregularities in 2000 gave us that disaster.

The Bush Tax Cuts for the rich would be permenant if Republicans had their way, instead of a President saying he will veto any extension after this year.

The stimulus we had for the economy was too small - but a lot bigger because Obama was for it, while Republicans were against it, and it helped.

Even things like ANY move towards better healthcare for people and reducing the inefficient and corrupt private insurance system, ending gay discrimnation in the military.

There are areas to be upset about, like civil rights - but part of the issue comes from the voters not choosing a more progressive leader.

All the big money propagandizing has affected public opinion. It would have been a disaster had McCain/Palin been elected.

Save234
 

IonusX

Senior member
Dec 25, 2011
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Seriously you are out of your fvcking mind. That is neither possible nor wise. Why would we want to have NO overseas presence are you mad ???

You libertarian retards are something else. No need to address any of your other points. This is why Ron Paul has NO SHOT and never had.

excuse me you have hundreds of bases manned by troops in over 140 countries..
let us also make it very clear that you have a shiny new base in iraq you just finished paying off with your tax dollars. its about the size of the vatican, perhaps you've heard of it??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEov7B5ewdk
this man has advocate for spending cuts for decades among a multitude of smart and wise idea's.. you should learn to read or listen before firing all guns.
 

Darwin333

Lifer
Dec 11, 2006
19,946
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http://money.cnn.com/2012/01/05/news/economy/budget_cuts/index.htm?hpt=hp_bn3



This strikes me as entirely true. Ron Paul is the only one I'd come close to trusting to actually cut spending in significant amounts.

The other candidates won't make a lot of concrete proposals of what to cut because they have a chance of winning and actually being held accountable for living up to their promises.

So, if Ron Paul doesn't win the nomination (which is quite likely) America's choices will be between Obama and Obama-lite. I don't know about you, but that doesn't exactly get me excited.

Not exactly correct. They won't make a concrete set of proposals because they want to win not because they might win.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,873
463
126
Not exactly correct. They won't make a concrete set of proposals because they want to win not because they might win.
This is true. Most people (and everyone who might possibly vote Republican) like to hear that you'll cut government, but every time you make any specific proposals you're going to lose some support. That's why we'll never have a balanced budget, let alone debt reduction, without a balanced budget amendment. Politicians on the right like to talk about it because they know it stands little chance of passing, but it's the only way we're ever going to see significant government contraction.
 

Balt

Lifer
Mar 12, 2000
12,673
482
126
all they have to do is cut NPR...

Yeah, no kidding. Based on their stump speeches, one would be convinced that it's programs like the NEA and NPR that are bankrupting this country.

Can't risk pissing off seniors, though. Need their votes. :rolleyes:
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,686
136
Cut spending to create Jobs! Force layoffs to reduce unemployment!

Cut SS, medicare, medicaid, unemployment, food stamps and the rest so we can cut taxes at the top again to, uhh, yeh, uhh, err, Stimulate the Economy! Yeh, that's it!
 

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
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I agree on many of your points but look at what he is up against ... unparalleled obstructionism by a party who insists on ruling while being in the minority. This makes it damn difficult to get anything done .

Obama had a Democrat Majority in both houses when he started...he STILL was almost identical to Bush in many ways.
 

zsdersw

Lifer
Oct 29, 2003
10,505
2
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Not exactly correct. They won't make a concrete set of proposals because they want to win not because they might win.

Actually, both of them are correct. Just two different ways of expressing the same basic truth.

The politically "safe" things to do are things that keep you in or put you into office. Part of that is making proposals that you can either enact or successfully weasel your way out of. That's true for remaining in office and/or having power while in office (what I was saying) and for seeking the office in the first place (what you're saying). Since one-term-by-choice politicians are an extremely rare breed, it's fairly safe to conclude that none of the GOP candidates aren't interested in remaining in office if elected.
 
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sm625

Diamond Member
May 6, 2011
8,172
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Rick Santorum wants to cut $5 trillion over 5 years. Ha ha HAAAA! That's so funny. I wonder how many people think the national debt would not continue to rise by at least 15% per year under a Santorum presidency? These people spew nothing but lies when it comes to cutting spending.
 
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