Going Dual-Core. Need advice!

[evo4ever]

Hello people.

I've finally made my decision to go dual-core!

My A64 3700 SD (@ 2.80GHz/FX-57) has served me very well but with the increasing demand for multi-core capabilities its time to ditch the 3700+. My requirements are as follows:

1. Need to Remain on 939 till next year. Or could shell out for an E6600, DDR2, and nForce680i.
2. Opteron, Better overclocker than X2.
3. Desire to overclock to 3GHz+ on air if possible.
4. Budget 200GBP/380USD

What are your recommendations?

Help appreciated.

 

[nyker96]

Seems you have your requirement panned out pretty much. 165s//170s etc etc.

 

[Duvie]

3ghz is no easy sell especially on dual core chips....I think you should hit 2.8 but cross your fingers for 3ghz...I have seen plenty of single core opteron 14x chips do it but not a regular amount do it with dual core opterons. In theory they should be getting closer as the process has been more refined.

I would stick with AMD since your upgrade path is soo simple for now....I can tell you from experience that my E6600 at 2.4ghz was faster then my X2 at 2.66ghz based on my test....BUmp that E6600 up to near 3.3ghz and it is a total arse kicking.....

So I guess if you could get an S3 mobo for 115.....E6300 chip for 180.....Nice HSF (though stock can takle you up to 3ghz) for 40-50....and 1gb at least of ram PC6400 cas 4 DDr2 for 170-180....you would have a much faster system in single apps and dual core apps....However that puts it around 540 shipped and you should be able to get an opteron 165 for the low 200 range.

 

[the Chase]

Go for the Opty 170 at Newegg- they were $189 US last time I checked. Just got one last week and I'm gaming stable at 3.01GHz at 1.49 Volts. Dual Prime stable at 2.96 GHz so far. Not a Conroe but for under $200 I'm happy, especially with articles like the new AT one on Valve's multithreading push. I'm waiting for DDR3 to do a whole platform upgrade.

 

[evo4ever]

To be quite honest I don't think I need a Conroe. An Opteron170 is probably more than enough and not far behind from an E6600 when overclocked. I think ill stay on socket 939 and buy a 170 for now and wait for DDR3 and Intels Kentsfield or AMDs Quad-Core chip.
Theres no point in doing nearly a complete system overhaul when theres gonna be minimal gaming performance improvements.

 

[Duvie]

Originally posted by: evo4ever
To be quite honest I don't think I need a Conroe. An Opteron170 is probably more than enough and not far behind from an E6600 when overclocked. I think ill stay on socket 939 and buy a 170 for now and wait for DDR3 and Intels Kentsfield or AMDs Quad-Core chip.
Theres no point in doing nearly a complete system overhaul when theres gonna be minimal gaming performance improvements.

Yeah if the E6600 is hardly oc'd at all...I am telling you at 3.2ghz my E6600 has laid waste to to my X2 at 2.66ghz.....I dont necessary have the best E6600 OC around so you had 300 to the C2d for what some have and 300 to the X2 to get what some have and the spread is the same.....

Kentsfield will just pop into my DS3 right now and I am off and running.

I respect your plan to stay now, but have no dreams about it an average air oc'd e6300-6400-6600 will crush an air oc'd opteron 170....

 

[evo4ever]

I'd rather have a satisfying performance boost from the next gen CPUs and DDR3 rather than current Intel gen which wont give significant improvement over AMD X2/OPTY. I think ill get a 170 for now and save the rest of my money for DDR3 and Quad-Core. I wanna see what AMD have up their sleeve!

 

[Duvie]

Originally posted by: evo4ever
I'd rather have a satisfying performance boost from the next gen CPUs and DDR3 rather than current Intel gen which wont give significant improvement over AMD X2/OPTY. I think ill get a 170 for now and save the rest of my money for DDR3 and Quad-Core. I wanna see what AMD have up their sleeve!

Like I said I agree you are making the right upgrade choice at this time....Good luck...

 

[evo4ever]

Thanks for your support!

Duvie, could you recommend me the best opteron to get which will get me the closest to 3GHz on air?

 

[Duvie]

Well remember that the 165 is like the 3800+X2 and has a horribly low 9x multi.....This would require 333mhz HTT....Do you think your board can do thi? May wish to test that out now with your current system...

170 will at least give you the 10x multi and that way I bet the Asus can handle that and you could emply a divider and keep it close to your current memory config you have now...


I think they all (165-170-175-180) all have a reasonable chance. Obviously the closer to 3ghz may have a slightly better bet since you have less to move and you dont have to OC the mobo as much, but I dont thik you want to spend that kind of money. Right?

I would go 170, personally....for the 10x multi...

 

[evo4ever]

Yeah a few ppl have recommended the 170. But I do desire the 10x or 11x multi for the memories sake! If I get the 175 I can basically use the same OC settings as im using now (11x255). I dont want wanna put my memory on a divider and sacrifice mem bandwith with using 10x multi. My memory is rated to run at 275mhz with slacker timings. I could run at 10x275 (or 10x280) with slightly slacker timings but will that comprimise memory bandwidith tho? that is the question!

 

[Duvie]

Do you have a 183 divider in the Asus Bios....My calculations tell me 10x300 for 3ghz would set the memory at 255mhz...Or same as you have it now....If you need to 9x333 with a 166 divider would set it to the same speed as well...

166divider with a 170's multi would set ram around 460mhz...so that ma be a tad low for you..

Granted a 175's 11x multi with 273 will get you 3ghz and a 1:1 divder at same memory you are currently at...

The question is then...Is the added price worth it? I think they may all have the same ceiling. Dont be afraid to use dividers if they are there

opty 165 = $160
opty 170 = $190
opty 175 = $236

All at newegg!!!

 

[evo4ever]

I have the 183 divider! Ive just tested these settings and they are stable:

CPU 10x
FSB: 280MHz
HT: 3x / 3x
mem: 183MHz divider

Results in CPU @ 2800MHz and memory at 254MHz. These settings will be suitable for the 170 if it cant go any further that 2.8ghz and it keeps my memory at optimal OC levels. What do u think?

 

[Duvie]

Originally posted by: evo4ever
I have the 183 divider! Ive just tested these settings and they are stable:

CPU 10x
FSB: 280MHz
HT: 3x / 3x
mem: 183MHz divider

Results in CPU @ 2800MHz and memory at 254MHz. These settings will be suitable for the 170 if it cant go any further that 2.8ghz and it keeps my memory at optimal OC levels. What do u think?

It is close....You said above you can run 10x275...you wont be any higher than that even if you hit 3ghz with the 183divider....

Ultimately it is your choice....weigh the added cost versus fears of running slack timings...The A64's are not really bandwidth limited so over speed wont matter...timings have always seemed to matter mor ein my testing...however in gaming it did like a composition of both.

My fear only wit 165 is the high HTT that would be needed to get to 3ghz....170 makes it more reasonable...obviously the 175 is even better but with an added cost you coudl possibly save...

 

[evo4ever]

Running my memory at 255mhz with tight timings gives me higher bandwidth than 275mhz with slacker timings. Ive tighened up the timings as much as I can with the highest stable speed of 255mhz (maybe 260mhz) which gives me the best memory performance. Its imperitive that I keep the memory at 255-260 to maintain tight timings for highest bandwidth.

Im gonna go for the 170. What settings would you recommend for getting the 170 as close as 3GHz as poss by maintaining the memory at 255-260mhz?

 

[Duvie]

Originally posted by: evo4ever
Running my memory at 255mhz with tight timings gives me higher bandwidth than 275mhz with slacker timings. Ive tighened up the timings as much as I can with the highest stable speed of 255mhz (maybe 260mhz) which gives me the best memory performance. Its imperitive that I keep the memory at 255-260 to maintain tight timings for highest bandwidth.

Im gonna go for the 170. What settings would you recommend for getting the 170 as close as 3GHz as poss by maintaining the memory at 255-260mhz?

well if you use the 10x multi....10x300 = 3ghz

183 divider = 272mhz ram speed (slackened timings)
166 divider = 250mhz ram speed

run 9x300 on your CURRENT system with 166 divider and verify the ram speed will be 250....OK!!! That would be absolutely perfect!!!

It is so close I dont know if it would round up causing the ram speed to actuallyu be 230

If you had to and you can go over 300mz HTT then ofcourse 9x333

150 divider = 250mhz ram speed
133 divider = 215mhz ram speed ???

You may also want to see if you can run 8x333 on your CURRENT system with a 150 divider. This will help to see if the mobo can handle it...

 

[evo4ever]

I've tested 9x300 and 8x333 with memory dividers in place and booted first time into windows and got through 3DMark06 and Sandra tests so im assuming boths settings are stable. So do you think im sorted then when it comes to overclocking the FSB?

EDIT:

Im currently running at 9x312=2808 and memory at 166 divider = 255mhz which has ultimately give me higher sandra memory bandwidth and a tad better 3DMark06 score!

New settings: 7308 marks
Old settings (11x255, mem: 200 divider): 7257

And sandra memory bandwidth:

New settings: 7111/7090
Old settinghs: 7050/6977

My mobo is capable of very high FSB settings so I don't think getting the 170 close to 3GHz using high FSB will be a problem!

 

[Duvie]

Then you should be safe for your attempt at 3ghz with the 170

 

[evo4ever]

One last question Duvie, do you think my memory bandwidth is good/high for an nForce4 SLI 16x & DDR1 based system? And do you think its competitive with DDR2 scores?

 

[Duvie]

Originally posted by: evo4ever
One last question Duvie, do you think my memory bandwidth is good/high for an nForce4 SLI 16x & DDR1 based system? And do you think its competitive with DDR2 scores?

No simple answer there...The A64 is not bandwidth limited so it really doesn't matter...DDR2 with the chips on an AM2 system is really not going to garner you much more....nforce4 mobos are quite good in this area

 

[dev0lution]

yeah, stick with the 939 system if you're limited by the budget you listed. The memory, processor and motherboard for a Core 2 would kill your budget, though you'd probably be able to get a bit more out of it and hit 3Ghz on air a bit easier