GM recalls 1.5 million cars

[retrospooty]

1. 5 million. Good god... can it get any worse for these clowns? Anyone that still insists GM quaility has been improving can sit down now...

http://money.cnn.com/2009/04/1...postversion=2009041405

I'll start the chant.... BK - BK -BK

 

[MovingTarget]

hawt.

If you don't think that GM has been putting out vastly improved quality vehicles lately, you haven't been paying attention. Go ask the Garage guys----->

BK? Careful what you wish for....

 

[soccerballtux]

Can't even tell which direction the garage forum is in. Think he'd know what's he talking about wrt cars? Nah...

 

[retrospooty]

Originally posted by: soccerballtux
Can't even tell which direction the garage forum is in. Think he'd know what's he talking about wrt cars? Nah...

If you don't think GM is politics, you haven't been paying attention to the news... or to this forum lately.

 

[Dari]

The recall covers certain mid- and full-size passenger sedans under GM's (GM, Fortune 500) Chevrolet, Buick, Oldsmobile and Pontiac brands.

I thought those were the most reliable cars on the road? Goes to show that they really aren't. The problems don't show up because most of their buyers are old people who drive slowly and rarely.

 

[dphantom]

In other news earlier this year Toyota recalls 1.35 million vehicles.

Link

 

[SP33Demon]

Luckily my 97 Buick wasn't on the list, only Regals.

 

[Ktulu]

Originally posted by: dphantom
In other news earlier this year Toyota recalls 1.35 million vehicles.

Link

Oh yeah, and didn't they have BUY BACK a bunch of Tacomas a few years back because they would break in half :shocked:

 

[herm0016]

this is a very small risk, the 3.8L is still one of the best engine designs on the road. this is an issue with these cars now only because the valve covers may start to leak a bit after 10 years. I am going to guess that you all think working on a car is "below you" and that everything should last forever and that you are not responsible for getting the leaks taken care of after driving the car for 10+ years.

people in the garage forum say the quality has improved because it has, because we have a much better chance at actually being able to recognize quality engineering and do not base our car decisions on some "soft feel fake leather plastic" dash.

 

[dphantom]

Originally posted by: herm0016
this is a very small risk, the 3.8L is still one of the best engine designs on the road. this is an issue with these cars now only because the valve covers may start to leak a bit after 10 years. I am going to guess that you all think working on a car is "below you" and that everything should last forever and that you are not responsible for getting the leaks taken care of after driving the car for 10+ years.

people in the garage forum say the quality has improved because it has, because we have a much better chance at actually being able to recognize quality engineering and do not base our car decisions on some "soft feel fake leather plastic" dash.

QFT

That 3.8L will run forever if properly maintained. Tha fact that after 10 years there MIGHT be a leak issue that COULD cause an engine fire is pretty respectable. And the fix is simple.

This is not a quality issue at all. This is nothing but a thread slamming without warrant an American manufacturer.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: herm0016
this is a very small risk, the 3.8L is still one of the best engine designs on the road. this is an issue with these cars now only because the valve covers may start to leak a bit after 10 years. I am going to guess that you all think working on a car is "below you" and that everything should last forever and that you are not responsible for getting the leaks taken care of after driving the car for 10+ years.

people in the garage forum say the quality has improved because it has, because we have a much better chance at actually being able to recognize quality engineering and do not base our car decisions on some "soft feel fake leather plastic" dash.

/agree, my 3.1L V6 is still running strong at 110K miles with no problems whatsoever. Only problems I've had is the window motors dying, and the dashboard shifter light dying (had to replace whole dashboard due to light being INSIDE it - poor design). Aside from cosmetics the engine has been a reliable horse.

 

[1prophet]

A low cost simple repair that has the possibility of bringing in hundreds of thousands of potential customers for sales and service to the dealer.

 

[nobodyknows]

Originally posted by: herm0016
this is a very small risk, the 3.8L is still one of the best engine designs on the road. this is an issue with these cars now only because the valve covers may start to leak a bit after 10 years. I am going to guess that you all think working on a car is "below you" and that everything should last forever and that you are not responsible for getting the leaks taken care of after driving the car for 10+ years.

people in the garage forum say the quality has improved because it has, because we have a much better chance at actually being able to recognize quality engineering and do not base our car decisions on some "soft feel fake leather plastic" dash.

My daughter has an '91 Olds 98 that has the 3800 engine with over 180,000 on it and it still runs like a top.

 

[Harvey]

I just phoned my mom and asked her the year of her Buick She wasn't sure if it's 2003 or 2004 so I asked her to call the Buick agency to see if it's one of those in the recall.

It's been a good car for her. I wouldn't risk having that change, even if the fix wasn't free.

 

[retrospooty]

Originally posted by: herm0016

people in the garage forum say the quality has improved because it has, because we have a much better chance at actually being able to recognize quality engineering and do not base our car decisions on some "soft feel fake leather plastic" dash.

This may be true, and they have improved in initial quality ratings... But the ultimate test is longevity. American cars have never lasted as long as thier Japanese counterparts. GM has been crying wolf - feeding us "this time for sure" quality improvement lines for at least 20 years and it hasnt turned out to be true so far. No-one beleives it anymore. IF today's GM cars are truly better - we wont know for 5-10 more years.

Ultimately resale value is the benchmark. Honda and Toyota maintain quite well, while GM plummets at a much faster rate as soon as you drive it off the lot. The day GM's resale values match Honda, I will eat my Integra's tires =)

 

[MikeMike]

these cars are between like 8 and 12 years old... jeesus christ people, 8 years is well into the wear cycle, and if you dont fix your gaskets, or make sure things are in good condition, of course things might leak.

 

[Robor]

The hate for domestic cars is strong here.

 

[The-Noid]

Because the 2 Audi's I have had never were recalled...oh wait the S4 had 3 major recalls in the first year and my A6 has had 2 in a year and a half. Crazy.

 

[Robor]

Originally posted by: Yoxxy
Because the 2 Audi's I have had never were recalled...oh wait the S4 had 3 major recalls in the first year and my A6 has had 2 in a year and a half. Crazy.

Ah, I see you've experienced 'fine German engineering' as well? See sig! :laugh:

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: retrospooty

Originally posted by: herm0016

people in the garage forum say the quality has improved because it has, because we have a much better chance at actually being able to recognize quality engineering and do not base our car decisions on some "soft feel fake leather plastic" dash.

This may be true, and they have improved in initial quality ratings... But the ultimate test is longevity. American cars have never lasted as long as thier Japanese counterparts. GM has been crying wolf - feeding us "this time for sure" quality improvement lines for at least 20 years and it hasnt turned out to be true so far. No-one beleives it anymore. IF today's GM cars are truly better - we wont know for 5-10 more years.

Ultimately resale value is the benchmark. Honda and Toyota maintain quite well, while GM plummets at a much faster rate as soon as you drive it off the lot. The day GM's resale values match Honda, I will eat my Integra's tires =)

As long as American car companies continue to offer fleet sales, their cars will never have the resale value of Hondas and Toyotas because there will be a perpetual glut of 2-3 year old domestic cars on the used market as fleets turn over. Additionally, resale value is a trailing indicator because even when the facts have changed, it takes still longer for perceptions to change.

Japanese cars were crap in the 1960's and it wasn't until the late 1980's and early 1990's that it became clear (from resale values) that the Japanese had corrected their issues. Even though the problems were corrected in the 1970's, it still took another 10-15 years before people recognized it. Look at Hyundai, they are only just beginning to be recognized as having good cars and even still their resale values are low. It will take at least 20 years of GM matching import quality levels before resale values start to achieve parity.

As far as I'm concerned, American cars (at least Fords) are at the quality of the Japanese. We've had several Explorers that went over 200,000 miles without any issues and my experiences with my Mark VIII and my Mustang were both very positive.

ZV

 

[Arkaign]

Originally posted by: retrospooty

Originally posted by: herm0016

people in the garage forum say the quality has improved because it has, because we have a much better chance at actually being able to recognize quality engineering and do not base our car decisions on some "soft feel fake leather plastic" dash.

This may be true, and they have improved in initial quality ratings... But the ultimate test is longevity. American cars have never lasted as long as thier Japanese counterparts. GM has been crying wolf - feeding us "this time for sure" quality improvement lines for at least 20 years and it hasnt turned out to be true so far. No-one beleives it anymore. IF today's GM cars are truly better - we wont know for 5-10 more years.

Ultimately resale value is the benchmark. Honda and Toyota maintain quite well, while GM plummets at a much faster rate as soon as you drive it off the lot. The day GM's resale values match Honda, I will eat my Integra's tires =)

Lots of things may be the 'benchmark' for various people. GM quality has definitely improved, if someone denies that, they're just blind. Compare the garbage that Ford and GM were making in '89 to the stuff that they had in '99, and now again compare to now.

This recall, for 10 to 12 year old vehicles, with no recorded instances of this possibility even occurring, is not a black mark on reliability. IIRC, Honda even had a similar case with the 1st-gen CRV, due to the position of the oil filter, and the possibility of dripping oil to hit the manifold and ignite.

Resale value cuts both ways, someone who intends to sell a car after 2-5 years or whatever after buying new, it makes total sense to go with something like an Accord or Camry. For those that want to drive it till the wheels come off, or give it to their kids later, it doesn't factor much. Reliability is a big concern, but honestly, there are winners and losers in every brand.