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GeForce 6600 GT & Dell 4500?
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I have a Dell 4550, with essentially the same parts as yours (mine only has 512mb ram), and I've done the research into upgrading for newer games.
Dells are very picky about PSUs. I've heard scenarios varying from minors things such as only have to mod hte case to fit it, from the wrong PSU blowing up the motherboard. Your mileage may vary, and somesuchthings. Basically, it boils down to the basic fact: if you want a new video card, you need a new PSU. Your current one will not be able to handle modern video cards.
You can either:
1: do what Deinonych suggested, and pay extra for a PC PowerCooling PSU that is "guarenteed" to work in your Dell
2: if you have the balls, try your luck with a regular PSU of a reputable make and with sufficent output for your new card.
yeah, it sucks. that's why I'm saving for a new AMD64 computer. I wont be getting another Dell(or any other pre-built computer that for that matter).
not to say this machine hasn't served me exeedingly well, its just that now I know better. ;0)
edit: pah, I didnt read you got it working. good luck with that, hope you've got the jigawatts to keep it running.
Dells are very picky about PSUs. I've heard scenarios varying from minors things such as only have to mod hte case to fit it, from the wrong PSU blowing up the motherboard. Your mileage may vary, and somesuchthings. Basically, it boils down to the basic fact: if you want a new video card, you need a new PSU. Your current one will not be able to handle modern video cards.
You can either:
1: do what Deinonych suggested, and pay extra for a PC PowerCooling PSU that is "guarenteed" to work in your Dell
2: if you have the balls, try your luck with a regular PSU of a reputable make and with sufficent output for your new card.
yeah, it sucks. that's why I'm saving for a new AMD64 computer. I wont be getting another Dell(or any other pre-built computer that for that matter).
not to say this machine hasn't served me exeedingly well, its just that now I know better. ;0)
edit: pah, I didnt read you got it working. good luck with that, hope you've got the jigawatts to keep it running.
Kriz,
Ok, I'm going with the assumption that you know a heck of a lot more than I do about computer hardware, so now i'm kind of worried.
As you see from my prior post, I did install the Leadtek 6600GT and I did NOT get any big error message, or warning as RajunCajun mentioned, that indicated that the card wasn't getting enough power. I have only played MOH, and a little Call of Duty and RTCW, so haven't really "tested" the card to the max (i've been away from home for most of last week).
So, my question is this: why would it seem to be working? I didn't disconnect any other power-draining devices. And is there a particular way to test that it is working fine, receiving adequate power, etc.
Oh, i did install Everest Home Edition to see what kind of specs I was getting and here's the interesting point: I get the expected speed specs, e.g., GPU Clock ~500
RAMDAC Clock ~900 along with the Pixel and Texel Fillrates of ~4400, but after a minute or so, the rated drop to about half!?! Is this a power issue? Or does the card "step" up or down depending on demand (I think I set the OC to self-adjust)? Evertime I restart Everest it gives me the original, expected speed for a minute and then drops again. I'm confused. I'm sure someone out there knows what is going on.
Ok, I'm going with the assumption that you know a heck of a lot more than I do about computer hardware, so now i'm kind of worried.
As you see from my prior post, I did install the Leadtek 6600GT and I did NOT get any big error message, or warning as RajunCajun mentioned, that indicated that the card wasn't getting enough power. I have only played MOH, and a little Call of Duty and RTCW, so haven't really "tested" the card to the max (i've been away from home for most of last week).
So, my question is this: why would it seem to be working? I didn't disconnect any other power-draining devices. And is there a particular way to test that it is working fine, receiving adequate power, etc.
Oh, i did install Everest Home Edition to see what kind of specs I was getting and here's the interesting point: I get the expected speed specs, e.g., GPU Clock ~500
RAMDAC Clock ~900 along with the Pixel and Texel Fillrates of ~4400, but after a minute or so, the rated drop to about half!?! Is this a power issue? Or does the card "step" up or down depending on demand (I think I set the OC to self-adjust)? Evertime I restart Everest it gives me the original, expected speed for a minute and then drops again. I'm confused. I'm sure someone out there knows what is going on.
thanks dug777, I'll try that tonight (I'm working now...well, sort of). I just surfed to Future Mark's website...the 3DMark®05 Full Install Download (Build 1.2.0) is what you mean? That's some heavy duty minimum requirements (2GHz processor, 512MB RAM, DirectX®9.0 compliant graphics adapter that has 128MB of memory and is capable of PixelShader 2.0 or higher...my system makes it, but not by much).
What does 3000 (IIRC) stand for?
What does 3000 (IIRC) stand for?
knyghtbyte
Senior member
Dells PSU's are very reliable.....i was running a 9800XT off an 8300's 250watt PSU without any drop in power even when running both disc drives plus playing a game, that was with a P4 3ghz and 512mb RAM....so handling a 6600GT shouldnt be a problem....a 6800GT however might be...lol
RajunCajun
Senior member
Dug777 referred to 3000 as the combined score after running 3dMark05. What you get or don't get isn't that important. Only compare your score with another machine that has the EXACT, IDENTICAL hardware. You should be close, but may either be above or below. Remember that 3dMark05 is a "synthetic" benchmark and nothing else. It's a very relative comparison to what other PCs get as a score. You don't play 3dMark05!
Your machine is identical to my old one except I was running 512K and an AGP FX5900SE. My old machine was quite able to run Far Cry, Halo, Unreal Tournament 04, etc at a very nice clip. You have double the RAM and a more beefy video card, so you should be able to run about anything at a good speed at high quality.
Again, don't worry about your power supply. Just keep the extra power dongle plugged in (my FX5900 needed this also) and you shouldn't have any problems. Remember, if it "ain't broke don't fix it"!
Your machine is identical to my old one except I was running 512K and an AGP FX5900SE. My old machine was quite able to run Far Cry, Halo, Unreal Tournament 04, etc at a very nice clip. You have double the RAM and a more beefy video card, so you should be able to run about anything at a good speed at high quality.
Again, don't worry about your power supply. Just keep the extra power dongle plugged in (my FX5900 needed this also) and you shouldn't have any problems. Remember, if it "ain't broke don't fix it"!
Thanks again RajunCajun!
Just curious, if I didn't have it plugged into my psu would it even work? Say, do you have any idea about that Everest benchmarky thing? As for "ain't broke don't fix it" -- this is so hard for me to adhere to...I'm neurotic as hell and like to make sure I'm getting what I paid for.
Plus to add another wrinkle to the saga, I was suspicion that the card I bought was a 'return' or something because the circular seal was removed from the box flap opening...so I got that to worry about too. I could still return it as I called newegg to complain as soon as the card arrived and they'll give 30 days and no restocking fee...but I do digress off topic a bit here... sorry.
RajunCajun
Senior member
Even though I didn't run my 5900 without the dongle plugged in, you wouldn't hurt anything. Worse that could happen is that NVidia's Forceware control panel would throw up a caution window saying there is not enough voltage running to the card. If you don't fix it, the card will run but at lower gpu and memory speeds (at least with the FX series cards - probably the same the 6 series).
As far as running benchmarks, I'm not that great an enthusiast in that I don't chase the net looking for recent benchmarks using xxx driver release getting xx more fps. Before I upgrade to a new Forceware release I WILL research to see if there is something I need to know about a new driver. I tend to use proven drivers (not necessarily fully certified, WHQL, whatever). Bottom line install a known good driver, and as long as it does the things you needs it to STAY WITH IT!
The vastness of the internet and good forums like this one will give you much more reliable information from those who actually install and use the darn things. Another excellent site for NVidia fans is NVNEWS. If you haven't been there before I suggest you visit it. Also check their forums for all NVidia graphics cards AND Forceware drivers. You won't be disappointed! NVidia's own website also has forums which I've also found helpful several times.
The "if it ain't broke don't fix it" applied to your concern about the PSU. But really, if you think about it, applies to about everything. I've owned many PCs (and hand built 5) and have never run into major problems. Small problems were corrected by my limited knowledge or on the net in forums like this.
Example: Splinter Cell: Pandora Tomorrow came with my Leadtek. You know, it wouldn't run any length of time without spitting me out to the desktop with an error message. By searching the net I found what the problem was and which driver release OR Windows XP adjustments I needed to have for this problem to resolve.
As far as the "opened" box, be very careful!!! Many people (aka a**holes) will buy a video card and overclock or try to modify it. If it doesn't pass their muster, or they fry it, they'll RMA it back from where they bought it for a refund or exchange. No way to know for sure what yours is like, but make certain within the next couple of weeks you load EVERY game and run it. Put 3dMark05 into a continuous loop for hours; if anything serious is wrong it WILL show up, hopefully before your 30 days is over.
Good luck dcdub. If you have any questions please post. Remember, the only stupid question is the one you ask!
Dennis
As far as running benchmarks, I'm not that great an enthusiast in that I don't chase the net looking for recent benchmarks using xxx driver release getting xx more fps. Before I upgrade to a new Forceware release I WILL research to see if there is something I need to know about a new driver. I tend to use proven drivers (not necessarily fully certified, WHQL, whatever). Bottom line install a known good driver, and as long as it does the things you needs it to STAY WITH IT!
The vastness of the internet and good forums like this one will give you much more reliable information from those who actually install and use the darn things. Another excellent site for NVidia fans is NVNEWS. If you haven't been there before I suggest you visit it. Also check their forums for all NVidia graphics cards AND Forceware drivers. You won't be disappointed! NVidia's own website also has forums which I've also found helpful several times.
The "if it ain't broke don't fix it" applied to your concern about the PSU. But really, if you think about it, applies to about everything. I've owned many PCs (and hand built 5) and have never run into major problems. Small problems were corrected by my limited knowledge or on the net in forums like this.
Example: Splinter Cell: Pandora Tomorrow came with my Leadtek. You know, it wouldn't run any length of time without spitting me out to the desktop with an error message. By searching the net I found what the problem was and which driver release OR Windows XP adjustments I needed to have for this problem to resolve.
As far as the "opened" box, be very careful!!! Many people (aka a**holes) will buy a video card and overclock or try to modify it. If it doesn't pass their muster, or they fry it, they'll RMA it back from where they bought it for a refund or exchange. No way to know for sure what yours is like, but make certain within the next couple of weeks you load EVERY game and run it. Put 3dMark05 into a continuous loop for hours; if anything serious is wrong it WILL show up, hopefully before your 30 days is over.
Good luck dcdub. If you have any questions please post. Remember, the only stupid question is the one you ask!
Dennis
Dennis,
Thank you, and everyone, so much for all the info, support, and help. I'll check out the other forum you mentioned and I'll take your advice about loading games and playing them. I didn't download the 3dMark05, but did the PCMark (it was a much smaller program) and it gave me various scores each time I ran it, but all around 3000...which seemed to be right were it should be according to the comparison of other folks with similar systems (same card and similar cpu). However, I'm concerned that the core clock is initially detected at whatever I have it clocked or o/c to (eg. over 500) and then will suddenly drop each time I run Everest (and sometimes PCMark04) to 299 something right before my eyes. Not sure if I'm describing things clearly. As for games, I was just playing Call of Duty but I don't think that stresses the card too much. I cranked the setting on COD to the highest and I can tell it sure looks sweeter than before and obviously runs smoothly. I'll load the Splinter Cell PT that came with the card and see how that goes. Haven't bought Far Cry yet...that's supposed to utilize/need faster cards. Maybe, just for the piece of mind I'll RMA it and see if the new card does the same thing. I mean the box wasn't sealed...that just doesn't sound right does it?
Thank you, and everyone, so much for all the info, support, and help. I'll check out the other forum you mentioned and I'll take your advice about loading games and playing them. I didn't download the 3dMark05, but did the PCMark (it was a much smaller program) and it gave me various scores each time I ran it, but all around 3000...which seemed to be right were it should be according to the comparison of other folks with similar systems (same card and similar cpu). However, I'm concerned that the core clock is initially detected at whatever I have it clocked or o/c to (eg. over 500) and then will suddenly drop each time I run Everest (and sometimes PCMark04) to 299 something right before my eyes. Not sure if I'm describing things clearly. As for games, I was just playing Call of Duty but I don't think that stresses the card too much. I cranked the setting on COD to the highest and I can tell it sure looks sweeter than before and obviously runs smoothly. I'll load the Splinter Cell PT that came with the card and see how that goes. Haven't bought Far Cry yet...that's supposed to utilize/need faster cards. Maybe, just for the piece of mind I'll RMA it and see if the new card does the same thing. I mean the box wasn't sealed...that just doesn't sound right does it?
RajunCajun
Senior member
You should suspect any piece of hardware that wasn't factory sealed. IMHO you should contact newegg and RMA for a replacement. Newegg is a very good company and they'll treat you right. Just tell them it wasn't sealed when you opened it.
Core speeds change related to what you're doing on NVidia cards. 2D application speed (and I think PCMark04 runs 2D) is fixed at 300mhz. Everything in 2D runs at that speed to conserve power and lessen heat (including WinXP). However, in 3D games the core jumps to 500mhz (default). Have you noticed the sudden increase in noise from your 6600GT once you load 3D games? That's the cooling fan on the video card turning faster to help cool the core when it's running at 500mhz. Right after you exit the game the fan spins down to a lower speed in 2D.
Far Cry can be had at ~ $10-20 now. It is one of, if not THE most graphically demanding game, and will stress your system more than other game. More than Doom3, Half Life2, etc. I run mine at 1280x1024 with all settings to very high, ansiotrophic filtering 8x, anti-aliasing 0. In a word BEAUTIFUL! And game play is equal to or better than the rest. Jack is one cool customer that you don't want to mess with. You have so many options of what to do or where to go. My system runs it butter smooth. Go NOW, BUY IT, you won't regret it. Unless you are not into first person shooters, that is.
Core speeds change related to what you're doing on NVidia cards. 2D application speed (and I think PCMark04 runs 2D) is fixed at 300mhz. Everything in 2D runs at that speed to conserve power and lessen heat (including WinXP). However, in 3D games the core jumps to 500mhz (default). Have you noticed the sudden increase in noise from your 6600GT once you load 3D games? That's the cooling fan on the video card turning faster to help cool the core when it's running at 500mhz. Right after you exit the game the fan spins down to a lower speed in 2D.
Far Cry can be had at ~ $10-20 now. It is one of, if not THE most graphically demanding game, and will stress your system more than other game. More than Doom3, Half Life2, etc. I run mine at 1280x1024 with all settings to very high, ansiotrophic filtering 8x, anti-aliasing 0. In a word BEAUTIFUL! And game play is equal to or better than the rest. Jack is one cool customer that you don't want to mess with. You have so many options of what to do or where to go. My system runs it butter smooth. Go NOW, BUY IT, you won't regret it. Unless you are not into first person shooters, that is.
Yes, I called Newegg the moment I received the card and saw the seal was off to go on record and they said I could get an RMA and exchange it (no restocking fee or anything else); figured i'd see if it worked, which it apparently does...now that you clarified that the change in core speed is normal. And yes I heard the fan come on and knew that this was expected. I will decide today if I'll return it; I may, but there's the rebate time-frame (haven't cut-off the UPS yet) to contend with. I'll has to ask newegg how long the exchange process takes (I'm two weeks into the 30 day rebate time-frame, so have to decide soon if I want my $20 rebate).
Wow, I had no idea Far Cry was that cheap. Ebay? or Retail?
Once again, great chatting with you and thanks. Hopefully this thread has helped others out too; I know a couple people were weighing in on getting the card for their Dell 4500 and I can recommend it now as it seems to have not been a problem so far with the psu.
Wow, I had no idea Far Cry was that cheap. Ebay? or Retail?
Once again, great chatting with you and thanks. Hopefully this thread has helped others out too; I know a couple people were weighing in on getting the card for their Dell 4500 and I can recommend it now as it seems to have not been a problem so far with the psu.
grimlykindo
Senior member
Just so you know DELLs have some serious heat/air movement issues. Just look at my sig! I had to add 4 fans to my 4700 to cool my HDs and X800XL!
A STOCK DELL CANNOT HANDLE A HIGH-HEAT VIDEO CARD! YOU NEED AN EXHAUST FAN IN BACK TO PROPERLY VENTILATE. THE PSU IS NOT THE PROBLEM.
and as you know already know ALL DELLs use a rear INTAKE fan to cool the CPU and all the air is trapped in the case.
A STOCK DELL CANNOT HANDLE A HIGH-HEAT VIDEO CARD! YOU NEED AN EXHAUST FAN IN BACK TO PROPERLY VENTILATE. THE PSU IS NOT THE PROBLEM.
and as you know already know ALL DELLs use a rear INTAKE fan to cool the CPU and all the air is trapped in the case.
grimlykindo
Senior member
And those are horrible temps!
79c full load is really bad for an x800 xl. Me and my friend both have one and neither of our full load temps go above 70c!
Oh, and the Dimension 8x00 series are a totally different case design then the 4x00 series. You have the clamshell design correct? Your case is a much better design IMO than the 4x00 series
Try going to the DELL forums and search "6600gt - 4x00" You will find a TON of threads on OVERHEATING problems in the 4x00 series.
79c full load is really bad for an x800 xl. Me and my friend both have one and neither of our full load temps go above 70c!
Oh, and the Dimension 8x00 series are a totally different case design then the 4x00 series. You have the clamshell design correct? Your case is a much better design IMO than the 4x00 series
Try going to the DELL forums and search "6600gt - 4x00" You will find a TON of threads on OVERHEATING problems in the 4x00 series.
RajunCajun
Senior member
He doesn't have a 4700 like you and I. His Dimension 4500 has the same case that the 8400 has, which has fairly good airflow and additional cooling is not needed unless you're radically overclocking, which since we own Dells we know that can't happen.
For what he's doing it's fine.
Far Cry in WalMart is $20 retail. If you search online can be had for about $10 OEM. Bought mine from NewEgg earlier this year for $18 (this is the DVD version) and they threw in a new AMD K6-500 processor!
For what he's doing it's fine.
Far Cry in WalMart is $20 retail. If you search online can be had for about $10 OEM. Bought mine from NewEgg earlier this year for $18 (this is the DVD version) and they threw in a new AMD K6-500 processor!
One final word in case anyone is still following this thread, then I'll let it rest.
Played Splitter Cell Pandora Tomorrow last night. Although I didn't exact love the game (too much stealth for me -- give me Nazis to blow away with my Thompson or Sten), it seemed to run just fine. Will purchase Far Cry this weekend and give it a go. I finally downloaded 3DMark05: (clean-boot, closed other programs and ran over-clocked by detecting optimal frequencies) for a score of 3220. From the comparisons with similar systems and same card this seems to be respectable. I'm happy!
As for temp./air-flow, yes I have the 4500 clamshell case; seems to have adequate airflow; I can alway remove a card (i.e., modem that is right next to gpu) if I want to free space up. Not sure that I'm getting the core temp. when I'm in the middle of a game, so never really saw it go above the 40's (c). maybe 50c, but don't think that over-heating is going to be much of an issue. If so, I can choose not to o/c and I guess it'll run cooler then. Thanks to all again.
Cheers.😀
Played Splitter Cell Pandora Tomorrow last night. Although I didn't exact love the game (too much stealth for me -- give me Nazis to blow away with my Thompson or Sten), it seemed to run just fine. Will purchase Far Cry this weekend and give it a go. I finally downloaded 3DMark05: (clean-boot, closed other programs and ran over-clocked by detecting optimal frequencies) for a score of 3220. From the comparisons with similar systems and same card this seems to be respectable. I'm happy!
As for temp./air-flow, yes I have the 4500 clamshell case; seems to have adequate airflow; I can alway remove a card (i.e., modem that is right next to gpu) if I want to free space up. Not sure that I'm getting the core temp. when I'm in the middle of a game, so never really saw it go above the 40's (c). maybe 50c, but don't think that over-heating is going to be much of an issue. If so, I can choose not to o/c and I guess it'll run cooler then. Thanks to all again.
Cheers.😀
bamacre
Lifer
The 8300's came with 9800 XT's as an option, fyi. Same with 9800 Pro's and NonPro's.
But you are right, Dell's PSU's are of high quality. My X800 Pro even worked fine in an 8100. Even the 4500 and 4550, and 4600 should have good enough PSU's for 6600GT cards, shouldn't be a need to replace them. The 4600's also came with a 9800 Pro as an option, and maybe the 4500's, too.
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