"Gee, look who's 'outsaucing'!"

[DealMonkey]

I don't think anyone's answered these questions yet:

(A) How much control over Heinz day-to-day ops does Kerry and his wife have?

(B) What's the story with the overseas factories? Meaning, did they purposely locate them there or did they come into ownership through some roundabout means?

I do know that Best Foods used to ship some of their product to their overseas factories to be relabled for overseas consumption. An expensive proposition particularly when the dollar was strong and you factor in ocean shipping costs. These foodstuff companies often have an extensive network of factories in overseas countries, however their primary function was to crank out food for their host country not to resell the food back to the U.S. I'm sure as time wore on, more and more of the product would be made in the overseas location rather than shipped over there and relabeled.

I don't know if this is considered true outsourcing or not.

 

[rahvin]

Packaged food is rarely sold back into the US because of agricultural import restrictions. (Try to bring in anything but a baked good from another country and watch customs sieze it). The fact is that it does not make economical sense to ship low dollar cost food stuff items out any country. It is simply cheaper to use local crops and package in country. You not only avoid import problems but you reduce shipping costs and benefit from local labor prices that more effectively price your product in the local market.

This attack on Kerry is pretty lame, is that the best they can come up with?

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Apologists...UNITE! These liberal spinsters are too funny. "I don't know if this is considered true outsourcing or not. " That would depend on what the definition of the word "is" is, right? Too funny.

 

[SuperTool]

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Apologists...UNITE!

I will not join you Bush apologists

 

[PELarson]

From the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Apologists...UNITE! These liberal spinsters are too funny. "I don't know if this is considered true outsourcing or not. " That would depend on what the definition of the word "is" is, right? Too funny.

Pussies UNITE! I guess you're too scared to answer the questions I posed, huh Galt? Never mind, here you go from PE's link:

In the real world, the first lady contender has little financial connection anymore to Pittsburgh's H.J. Heinz. She was married for 25 years to a member of the founding family, Republican U.S. Sen. John Heinz, until his death in a plane crash in 1991.

She chairs the Heinz Endowments, which still own stock but not enough to meet the 5 percent ownership threshold that requires notifying the Securities and Exchange Commission.

There's been no Heinz family member involved in the management of the business since the late 1980s, said company spokesman Jack Kennedy. And the family drastically reduced its holdings in 1995 in a secondary stock offering.

Even the Heinz Co.'s foundation is separate from the Heinz family endowments.

"There's no real relationship," said Kennedy, beyond those at the company being respectful, of course, of anyone related to the founder, Henry John Heinz, who came from Sharpsburg.

Yes, I suppose it's technically outsourcing, yet Kerry and his wife appear to have zero control over what the company does. When I asked the question about outsourcing, I was mostly wondering whether the product gets sold back to the U.S. or not. For example, Dell hiring Indian call centers to handle tech support calls from U.S. buyers vs. Heinz opening overseas factories to service overseas markets.

 

[leeboy]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: sandorski
Ridiculous. Is this Outsourcing? Outsourcing involves sending operations overseas for the purpose of meeting Domestic demand usually with a cost savings.

Could it possibly be Foreign Operations which are established to meet product demand in a Foreign Country or Region?

yes Sandorski, this is outsourcing, they are using labor from other lower wage nations to produce their product....you hypocrites are funny...where is Dave? this has been up a whole day without a single peep from him.

And you have proof that the product is shipped back over to the states for sale? Or is it possible that hey, we like ketcheup here in China, build a plant in China to meet that demand and staff it with Chenese workers. Who is the loser in that scenerio? When jobs are shipped overseas to meet the demand in THIS country, then it is outsourcing, but hey that is just my fuzzy logic.

 

[leeboy]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
There will be none of that reason and logic around here, Mister! You either bash Bush, or you can take your reasoning elsewhere!

Too true john, it is really funny to see people like sandorski here try to justify Heinz's operations due to their global market, but fail to recognize that any of the other companies that come under fire also cater to a global market...must be the short sightedness with focus on companies that only recently began to start manufacture in other countries whereas those who have been doing it for years should get a free pass?

Heinz could easily produce their products here and ship worldwide and meet all of their goals, however the cost would be far greater than it is now...they are just as guilty as any other company that is currently manufacturing off shore.

When a call center job once occupied by an american worker is shipped to Bangalore to be staffed by a low wage earning east Indian to handle calls back here in the United States for US consumers, it is outsourcing in my eyes. Producing your product in a foreign land for a foreign consumer is not. If that ketcheup is shipped back here for US consumers (link please?) then I would agree that Heize is then part of the problem. Not too sure how someone who married someone who married into that fortune should have any of the blame passed onto them, though.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: leeboy

Not too sure how someone who married someone who married into that fortune should have any of the blame passed onto them, though.

Dole sold his shares in Disney when he saw that they released an R-rated movie; perhaps the Kerrys (funny how she assumed his last name just before his bid; prior, she had him sign a prenup and didn't want anything to do with his name) should follow suit?

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: DealMonkey

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
loaded fine for me. thats a pretty lame statement about the quality and performance. Ever think their servers may be located in India? Hmmmm????

Yes, and that's exactly why I said that. Although it was somewhat tongue-in-cheek. Somewhat. Why? Are you all offended now because you're from India?

dude, the servers are in india. physical distance makes a difference when transferring data, unless you use a service like Akamai or something. meaning, it will take longer for you to load, that is only natural.

physical distance makes a difference when transferring data? Surely you're kidding. It has little to no bearing what so ever.

If heinz is like most other enterprises all the servers are centrlized in 1 or more large data centers.

 

[DamnDirtyApe]

Ever actually look at the label on a bottle of Ketchup? Here in Canada at least, the label near the lid says that the ketchup is "union made". I would hazard a gues that this implies that the product is made somewhere in a developed country with advanced labour laws, not some sweatshop in the slums of Bangalore.

And as previous posters have said, it would make no sense to outsource (in the usual sense) processed food production because the plants aren't really all that labour intensive anyway, and the cost of the supply chain required to actually do such a thing would eliminate any potential cost savings.

 

[DealMonkey]

I think it's safe to conclude the following:

(A) John Kerry and/or his wife have zero influence over the day-to-day operations of Heinz and they certainly have no control over whether the company chooses to outsource or not.

(B) Heinz is not likely outsourcing in the typical sense because they're maintaining overseas plants to facilitate products destined for the market of their host country, not for resale back to the United States.

(C) The background behind the overseas plants is somewhat of an unknown. I wasn't able to locate any information on how Heinz came to operate those plants precisely. Perhaps someone else can link me in the right direction. It's very possible that Heinz ended up with the foreign plants via a merger or buy-out. I sort of recall Heinz being bought out by Best Foods but I don't have any details . . . or certainly Heinz could have acquired smaller companies along with overseas production locations.

So what was the point of this thread again?

 

[DealMonkey]

Well, digging around, I did find this PR from Heinz.com ...

Currently, 60% of the sales of the H. J. Heinz Company are outside the United States and to accommodate those customers by providing facilities closer to those markets, the company maintains a number of overseas facilities that provide products for consumers in those markets. This allows Heinz to pack the freshest ingredients, tailor its recipes to local tastes and deliver the final products in a timely and efficient manner. In the United States, Heinz makes its flagship ketchup in factories in Fremont, Ohio; Muscatine, Iowa; and Stockton, California.

I also checked my own catsup bottle, and yup it's made in the U.S.A. by Heinz North America.

 

[Gaard]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey

Originally posted by: xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx
Apologists...UNITE! These liberal spinsters are too funny. "I don't know if this is considered true outsourcing or not. " That would depend on what the definition of the word "is" is, right? Too funny.

Pussies UNITE! I guess you're too scared to answer the questions I posed, huh Galt? Never mind, here you go from PE's link:

Notice how Galt skipped right over this post and went on to reply to a later post.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Well, digging around, I did find this PR from Heinz.com ...

Currently, 60% of the sales of the H. J. Heinz Company are outside the United States and to accommodate those customers by providing facilities closer to those markets, the company maintains a number of overseas facilities that provide products for consumers in those markets. This allows Heinz to pack the freshest ingredients, tailor its recipes to local tastes and deliver the final products in a timely and efficient manner. In the United States, Heinz makes its flagship ketchup in factories in Fremont, Ohio; Muscatine, Iowa; and Stockton, California.

I also checked my own catsup bottle, and yup it's made in the U.S.A. by Heinz North America.

404 error Outsourcing not found

 

[bozack]

Originally posted by: leeboy

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: sandorski
Ridiculous. Is this Outsourcing? Outsourcing involves sending operations overseas for the purpose of meeting Domestic demand usually with a cost savings.

Could it possibly be Foreign Operations which are established to meet product demand in a Foreign Country or Region?

yes Sandorski, this is outsourcing, they are using labor from other lower wage nations to produce their product....you hypocrites are funny...where is Dave? this has been up a whole day without a single peep from him.

And you have proof that the product is shipped back over to the states for sale? Or is it possible that hey, we like ketcheup here in China, build a plant in China to meet that demand and staff it with Chenese workers. Who is the loser in that scenerio? When jobs are shipped overseas to meet the demand in THIS country, then it is outsourcing, but hey that is just my fuzzy logic.

Not really, as it would be very possible for said company to just build more factories in the US, employ more US workers and provide more income for the US economy.

 

[rahvin]

Originally posted by: bozack
Not really, as it would be very possible for said company to just build more factories in the US, employ more US workers and provide more income for the US economy.

So it would make sense to you to bottle ketchup in the US for about a $1, put it on a ship and ship it to china and sell it to the chinesse who probably like a different flavor of ketchup? In the shipping you risk spoilage and contamination. The shipping alone would probably and $.10 to the price and would probably price the ketchup right out of the market.

To me it makes more sense for them to build the local factory, sell at a competative price and keep the high price management jobs in the US and let the cheap nearly worthless jobs be in china. And believe me, there aren't going to be a lot of jobs in a factory like this, nor will they be "high wage".

Those that think we should force companies to build the products in the US are smoking crack. The products would not be price competative in foreign markets and we wouldn't have the benefit of keeping the corporate suit jobs in the US because of the loss of market share. It's better if our cheap commercial products dominate the world and we let the cheap labor produce the product while the profit and suits are still in the US.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: leeboy

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: sandorski
Ridiculous. Is this Outsourcing? Outsourcing involves sending operations overseas for the purpose of meeting Domestic demand usually with a cost savings.

Could it possibly be Foreign Operations which are established to meet product demand in a Foreign Country or Region?

yes Sandorski, this is outsourcing, they are using labor from other lower wage nations to produce their product....you hypocrites are funny...where is Dave? this has been up a whole day without a single peep from him.

And you have proof that the product is shipped back over to the states for sale? Or is it possible that hey, we like ketcheup here in China, build a plant in China to meet that demand and staff it with Chenese workers. Who is the loser in that scenerio? When jobs are shipped overseas to meet the demand in THIS country, then it is outsourcing, but hey that is just my fuzzy logic.

Not really, as it would be very possible for said company to just build more factories in the US, employ more US workers and provide more income for the US economy.

Sure, I suppose they could, though ver good reasons not to have been offered. Not doing that still isn't "Outsourcing" though.

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: sandorski
Sure, I suppose they could, though ver good reasons not to have been offered. Not doing that still isn't "Outsourcing" though.

Outsourcing: The procuring of services or products, such as the parts used in manufacturing a motor vehicle, from an outside supplier or manufacturer in order to cut costs.

How, in this case, is Heinz outsourcing anything? All we're talking about here is overseas locations owned and operated by Heinz delivering product to the very same overseas markets. If Heinz was contracting with Del Monte to provide ketchup that would be a different story.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey

Originally posted by: sandorski
Sure, I suppose they could, though ver good reasons not to have been offered. Not doing that still isn't "Outsourcing" though.

Outsourcing: The procuring of services or products, such as the parts used in manufacturing a motor vehicle, from an outside supplier or manufacturer in order to cut costs.

How, in this case, is Heinz outsourcing anything? All we're talking about here is overseas locations owned and operated by Heinz delivering product to the very same overseas markets. If Heinz was contracting with Del Monte to provide ketchup that would be a different story.

exactly

 

[SherEPunjab]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab

Originally posted by: DealMonkey

Originally posted by: SherEPunjab
loaded fine for me. thats a pretty lame statement about the quality and performance. Ever think their servers may be located in India? Hmmmm????

Yes, and that's exactly why I said that. Although it was somewhat tongue-in-cheek. Somewhat. Why? Are you all offended now because you're from India?

dude, the servers are in india. physical distance makes a difference when transferring data, unless you use a service like Akamai or something. meaning, it will take longer for you to load, that is only natural.

physical distance makes a difference when transferring data? Surely you're kidding. It has little to no bearing what so ever.

If heinz is like most other enterprises all the servers are centrlized in 1 or more large data centers.

well from my experience pings and response times are related to the server location. maybe not bandwidth.

 

[leeboy]

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: leeboy

Originally posted by: bozack

Originally posted by: sandorski
Ridiculous. Is this Outsourcing? Outsourcing involves sending operations overseas for the purpose of meeting Domestic demand usually with a cost savings.

Could it possibly be Foreign Operations which are established to meet product demand in a Foreign Country or Region?

yes Sandorski, this is outsourcing, they are using labor from other lower wage nations to produce their product....you hypocrites are funny...where is Dave? this has been up a whole day without a single peep from him.

And you have proof that the product is shipped back over to the states for sale? Or is it possible that hey, we like ketcheup here in China, build a plant in China to meet that demand and staff it with Chenese workers. Who is the loser in that scenerio? When jobs are shipped overseas to meet the demand in THIS country, then it is outsourcing, but hey that is just my fuzzy logic.

Not really, as it would be very possible for said company to just build more factories in the US, employ more US workers and provide more income for the US economy.

I don't even think I need to reply to that logic man.

 

[xxxxxJohnGaltxxxxx]

Originally posted by: DealMonkey

(B) Heinz is not likely outsourcing in the typical sense because they're maintaining overseas plants to facilitate products destined for the market of their host country, not for resale back to the United States.

You need to take a look at where their manufacturing plants/holding companies are located before you make such an assertion. There are a few that are contrary to your hypotheses.