Gas Prices.......grrr...

[Soybomb]

As far as the concept charger goes and what will get produced.. If I'm not mistaken the concept chrager was going to have an engine running on CNG (compressed natural gas). I don't know where you live, but around here we dont have many places I can stop and fill up with cng : ) But yeah the new hemi engine looks like it will be the high end piece. As far as the body? Who knows, I think they're trying to keep it under tight wraps, but chrysler has a habit of putting out cars that are very similar to their concept vehicles. The viper, the prowler, the pt cruiser, etc.

My feelings on gas prices? Its gone up but I'm not complaining. I drive both a car that gets like 28 mpg if I keep my foot out of the carpet, and a 80 Jeep cj5 that gets god knows how few single digits per gallon. I enjoy them both, and dont complain when I get gas. Do you guys here in teh states know how easy we had, and still comparitively have it? Go ask a guy some place in europe or asia how much gas is. I think something around $7 a gallon is pretty average. If you don't like it ride the bus, my daily commute takes me past at least 5 miles of empty fields out of the town where public transportation doesnt go! I could carpool, but Its worth $2 a gallon for the convenience I think....

 

[CompuWife]

FFMCobalt....that's unbelievable...in canadian funds that is $2.59 per gallon.
Here it's 76.9 per litre...76.9 x 4litres=$3.07
I drive a small hyundai, 4 cyl, 5 spd...still pay through the nose, seems to me that most of my money is going to gas or high priced groceries....at least the grocery bill is going up...transport is becoming too expensive to keep the cost down on groceries.
I don't think that ethanol is a relevant argument to the fuel crisis at hand.
I think the possibility of developing a feasible ethanol fuel should not be ruled out, however.
Seriously, people do need to start looking for an alternative.
I am buying a wood stove...as gas prices go up, I'm sure that hydro will follow suit.
I feel badly for all the poor saps in my area that converted their entire house to natural gas.

 

[JohnGalt]

In the short run there is inelastic demand for oil, but right now the supply is very elastic, thus the burden of taxes fall heavily on consumers. However in the long run, demand will become more elastic as people carpool, use bikes, and discover new technology. Also blame the government for setting a price ceiling on oil, this creates a huge shortage because equilbrium price is above the price ceiling.

 

[Zucchini]

1.75? AWWWW, here in silicon valley we pay 1.95 or so for regular As for ethanol, that route is too limited. The problem isn't with the vehicals but the supply. I can't remember the figures, but for the US to switch to ethanol would be impossible. Hybrid electric/gas vehicles are the way to go.

And as another poster has already said, suv's should be taxed. They create a disproportionate amount of pollution, use more then their fair share of gasoline, help to increase our dependence on foreign oil, kill people, and are unsightly.

I drive a 98 civic, so the gas prices don't hurt me much

 

[etech]

First, an apology to CompuWife. I have seen to many uninformed people blame the oil companies whenever the price of gas goes up. My apologies for mistakenly assuming you were one of them.
Lots of good points here,
At some point we will need to move to other energy sources. I do believe that until it becomes a crisis that it will not happen.
Ethanol does not seem a workable solution to me, Calculate the energy used to produce a gallon of ethanol. I believe you will find that it takes more engergy to produce it then what you get back. Someone commented on how cheap it is. If you take out the government subsidies it is more expensive.
Dependence on foreign oil- We have to be dependent on foreign oil when the government and others will not let oil companies drill in certain areas of the US.

 

[ParasiticFly]

Hahah sucks for you all

beat $1.30 for regular!

Living in Texas kicks ass for once!

Anyways
hope all you Europeans etc get the freaking prices down

7.60 for a gallon in France.

Holy crap.

 

[Zucchini]

Etech,

Of course dependence on foreign oil seems like a good strategy really. Best to leech your neighbors dry and save your own suppy When those arabs run out, they are %#@ screwed u see. Atleast thats how i see it.

They also know they are screwed.. desperately trying to turn their economies away from their dependence on oil revenue. They have tried massive expansion of agriculture, only to have that blow up in their faces.. unsustainable basically.. currently they must sell oil to buy food since they can't be self sufficient.

 

[Isaiah]

If you have a Computer you do not have to go anyware so why do you need Gas




Isaiah

 

[apoppin]

Gas in Venezuela is 35 cents a gallon.

Sorry, Texas.

 

[RU482]

I read something a while back that scared the hell out of me. It was one of those fact based "what if we don't change our ways" stories. The main fact was that, at the current rate of consumption, the worlds "cheap" supply of oil is going to be gone by ~2014. (cheap meaning putting a simple well in the ground and out spews the oil)

Even the smartest among us probably don't realize just how profoundly petroleum and all of its end products effect our everyday lives. Pretty sad considering it's usage has only become so widespread in the past 120 years.

As far as anyone hating OPEC, you sure can't blame them. If they run their wells dry, who's gonna give a flying fsck about them. With that in mind, I think we should really be keeping an eye on what kinds of weapons and such are going into the mid-east.

Damn, I hate thinking about this stuff. It's getting harder every day to see the future of this world with a "glass half full" attitude.

 

[Mday]

i pity the people in the UK...

 

[apoppin]

<< i pity the people in the uk ... >>



Maybe you should save your pity, Mday. We may not be too far behind them.

 

[Dave]

Some of my takes:
1.The world is not running out of oil/natural gas etc.

2.Government tax and environmental policies are combining to slow the exploration for petroleum. Example: The US Dept. of Energy and EPA recently (and very quietly) fessed up that it was US Gov policies (mostly related to the requirement to use Reformulated Gasoline) that caused the huge spike in gas prices in the US mid-west this spring and summer. Remember, it was trumpeted in the media that the evil/rich/greedy oil companies were behind it all. NOT!

3. Gargantuan (hundreds of year at present consumption rate+allowance for growth)supplies of coal, oil shale and tar sands are available. It will not be as cheap as most of todays petroleum supplies.

4. Britian is a very curious example: It is one of the worlds largest oil producers (e.g. Brent North Sea crude), but they have extremely high gas prices: taxes alone account for about 75% of the ~$5US/gal cost. YIKES! ... and the Canadians are evidently not too far behind.

Hope you mates don't have to wait too much longer to get some relief ... but Blair appears to be hanging tough. By the way, I see/hear very little about your troubles in the American media.

5. Fuel cell technology, as currently proposed, will initially use gasoline. Yes, gasoline. Expect 50-80 mpg from the relatively small autos that use this technology. They will however be extremely clean from an emissions standpoint.

 

[JellyBaby]

I like gas/electric hybrid cars. If you can even buy one in your area, they're still too expensive. When running on gas, the batteries get charged so you're not (as) reliant on electrical docking stations. I'd give serious thought to buying one of these cars. Acceleration and top speed are much better than you'd think and I'm all for less engine noise (greater sound clarity for music). Of course car manufacturers are in no hurry to make them and the government has relaxed the push to have them made.

Can't wait until this winter. The shortage will persist, I'm sure, through the election and into winter. Home heating oil is already way up in my neck of the woods and it's only gonna get worse. Damnit.

 

[LAUST]

The guy's with the new hybrids must be laughing

 

[evolotion]

I cant BELIEVE you are moanin about the price you pay!!
In britain I pay $1.88(CAD) PER LITRE where as you pay less than that for a gallon(we pay over$7 per gallon)
This country stinks. I bet our insurance is dearer too..
I Know our cars are..

 

[BiB]

evolution Thats right but I think your incomes in england (after currency conversion) are a bit higher than in can/US - correct me if I'm wrong, I've wondered how you guys can even drive. Car prices are damn near the same price in pounds as we pay in Canadian dollars!

--

I also like gas/electric as an idea. However, the cars are still too pricey. The new honda insight costs a lot of money for a very very small car, and in actual fact its mileage isn't THAT much better than, say, an echo. Sure its better, but to break even from a personal financial standpoint it would take many many years to do so.

If this gas/electric comes down in price soon and is added to larger cars well it seems pretty cool, I'm sure it will. THe toyota gas/electric hybrid isn't nearly as ugly as the honda one.

BiB

 

[Nick Stone]

I've carefully read all these threads; The most common observation I see is that the price went up and no one planned for it.
Some more observations:

Everyone here could have bought gasoline on the commodities market this last winter, as a hedge, when the price was lower -- if they wanted to.

Anyone who believes that it is inexpensive to produce alcohol from corn should do us all a big favor and start producing it themselves. No one is stopping you. Yes, the government might regulate your activities just like they regulate oil companies and automotive companies but what would you expect? Just be sure you sell me your better, cheaper, cleaner, more convenient product 1st since I turned you on to the idea.

Personally I'm amazed that the automotive industry has sustained and improved the internal combustion engine. It took them long enough. They had no technological advances in the 1970s even though an oil crisis started in 1973. Slowly, cars became lighter, aerodynamic, and used fuel injected engines -- controlled electronically. By the late '80s and early '90s our cars were probably 60% more efficient than they were in the early 70s. But now, the spoiled consummer wants monster trucks and 5000 lb SUVs that won't fit into the parking spaces we used a few years ago. Detroit changes it's marketing strategy and builds what you, the consumer, wants.

This winter I could buy gasoline for $.69 a gallon. (That was the lowest I saw for a couple of days) This price included about $.38 cents tax. I could also buy a gallon of water at Wal-mart for $.69 + $.05 tax = $.74. BTW suppose you could buy gasoline in gallon jugs at Wal-mart now for $.74 each. Would you bitch about it? Of course you would. It would take you at least 30 minutes each time you wanted to put 20 gallons in the tank of your truck. Imagine loading 3 shopping carts full of gallon jugs, Running them through the checkout, out into the parking lot. (Hope it's not 110 degrees outside) and pouring these jugs into your car. Then you would have to return these empty jugs back to the store to have them recycled. You couldn't take these gasoline jugs with you because that would be unsafe and you sure wouldn't want you condo neighbors storing the stuff in their garage right next to your living room. Guess what. People don't know when they are well off.

Next subject -- Taxing gasoline. let's face, the legidimate excuse for taxing gasoline is to pay for the roads and their infrastructure. Most of us will agree that taxes for those purposes are necessary.

I don't know what the British and French are doing. I think that they tax gasoline excessively, supposedly to support public transportation or maybe for some other unrelated public good. I suppect price controls are used. Maybe someone who lives there, and is politically knowledgeable can enlighten us.

No one seems to be posting about their inside knowledge concerning the &quot;ramping up of effort to meet the demand&quot; by the oil companies. I notice 20% more drilling activity and heavy hiring activity of anyone qualified. But nothing excessive. Remember that producing oil and gas in the USA is truly a &quot;Boom or Bust&quot; proposition. Many backruptcies after the 1984 turn down in prices have left the oil companies and more importantly their finacial backers conservative.

Some people seem to think that mineral resources should be free like the air we breathe or like the water that we don't think we are paying for.

Anyone disagree?

 

[JellyBaby]

Nick Stone, some good points there but you're generalizing. My car gets 35 mpg (with the wind). It's a compact car. No SUV here nor would I ever purhcase one. Buying gas cheap and storing it is not an option for many (where the hell does someone in an apartment legally store a large reserve of oil??). On the tax issue, did you realize in the US, the states collect the gas tax then send it to the feds who take an 11% cut then return it back to the states!? It'd help a great deal if they stopped dipping into the till.

Anyway there's plenty to bitch about. Even if you've adjusted your lifestyle there's much to bitch about. The soaking at gas stations in the midwest this summer, government's refusal to aid its citizens in any way (releasing reserves, repleaing taxes, etc.), the Clinton administrations lack of energy policy, etc. etc. If you're happy with the situation go start a happy-touchy-feely thread.

 

[Dave]

Nick Stone:

Taxing gasoline. let's face, the legidimate excuse for taxing gasoline is to pay for the roads and their infrastructure. Most of us will agree that taxes for those purposes are necessary.Text

With regard to the above: It is universally accepted as fact that the US gov collects more in gas taxes than is needed for road construction and maintenance ... that is one of the reasons that our beloved legislative representatives have been on a spending spree for things known as &quot;Highway Demonstration Projects.&quot; You know, things like the &quot;Bud Schuster Highway.&quot; BTW: Bud is chairman of the committee that doles out the highway funds. Shocking! REPEAT: The Feds are awash in tax funds that are not needed for the tasks that they are required to carry out. Please, for the love of God, since you don't need it, give it back to those from whom it was taken. That would be fair!

 

[Zucchini]

Great, so now we're over funded. It really doesn't seem that way, public transport here in silicon valley isn't that hot, and freeway expansion isn't either. To even get subway/train service extended to our area we might have to increase taxes. And if we really do have a surplus of money, better to siphon it into programs that need it like education then to give it back as you said

 

[Mem]

Yes we pay about 80% Tax for our fuel (the greedy Government gets all that)anyway we have another big fuel demostration in 60 days time so the British Government as some time to sort it out but I don`t think they will give in so looks like this fuel problem is not over yet.

 

[Zucchini]

Yes, hehe, and stupid americans bitch about taxes

 

[Nick Stone]

mem
What do the people want the government to do as a result of these protests? Reduce the taxes? What else?

Everyone else
I don't fully know if the taxes on fuel match the needs to support the infrastructure, but in a fair democracy, I would think that would be the goal.

I also believe that a wise government would develope policies that equate to &quot;saveing during the fat years and consume what you have saved during the lean years&quot;. Now I'm not advocating the literal saving of the refined products -- that's just not efficient. I'm advocating a policy that would accomplish that goal, balance out the &quot;ups&quot; and &quot;downs&quot; in the pricing.
I'm hoping that a &quot;policy guru&quot; from this forum will step forward and suggest a good policy.

I live in Oklahoma. We produce more energy than we consume. However, I don't see anyone here rushing to change jobs to one that's oil related -- or joining a crusade to help save the world from energy depletion.
A lot of people here were badly hurt during the last cycle. From the bankers to the rufnecks. Oilfield workers work in &quot;inhumane conditions&quot; in case you didn't know it. In the early 80's many worked their 12 hour shifts, 7 days a week away from their familys and slept in a tent or the camper shell in the back of their pickup. They were probably thankful when they were fired so they could get a life.

 

[GT1999]

I have to drive to and from college (local community college), so my gas bill kinda gets high. Lucky me, though, I have a Nissan Sentra &quot;rice-burner&quot;.