Gas Mileage Technology

[jamesbond007]

Alright, guys. My roommate is on the fritz with gas mileage enhancement. He's curious about the Tornado gizmo that attaches to the air intake line. Additionally, he's read things about magnets going around the gas line to help break up the particles and whatnot to create a more efficient burn.

I think they're gimmicks, but what do you guys think? I mean, if they really did work, wouldn't the guys who created it be insanely rich? A comment I read on YouTube about the Tornado was something about the ECU re-adjusting the gas/air mixture after the Tornado has been installed over time. Is this true?

ZV, where are ya? I'd really like a technical explaination, if possible, as to whether or not these things really work.

Thanks,
~Travis

 

[jagec]

They don't. The air going through the intake is plenty turbulent enough to mix nicely with the fuel, and adding an extra restriction (which is what the tornado does) will only make things worse, not better. Magnets are also snake oil--gas isn't affected by them in any meaningful way.

What works is (a)using a smaller engine, (b)changing your driving habits (huge!), and (c) not using ethanol in your gas. Real advances in efficiency require modifying the engine in ways that are well beyond the capabilities of your average car owner (things like changing the size, geometry, and operating characteristics of your valves, changing the intake, injector, and piston configuration to get a better swirl with less restriction, engine management changes, and other very fundamental shifts). As such, the best that we can do is buy cars that get good mileage instead of cars that get OK mileage but have good power (which describes pretty much all the "economy" cars currently on the market). If there is demand for a product, they'll build it...but right now there is not that demand.

 

[mwmorph]

If these worked, automakers would be using them already. They don't spend billions per year on efficiency research so they can get a "measly" 26mpg on a midsize sedan. if for $3 worth of metal, they could advertise 50% better EPA mileage, they would be doing it, especially with CAFE going up to 35mpg average by 2011, automakers are scrambling to make cars smaller or more efficient to fit the government regulations.

The only way to make your care more fuel efficient is to learn to drive differently or get a different car or drive only in summers(may states use a winter mix of 85% gas, 15% ethanol which has less energy content than 100% gas)

As for how they work, the tornado and magnets theoretically work on making the air and fuel combine more efficiently.

The Tornado is supposed to induce turbulence, which is good in the intake since more turbulence creates a better fuel dispersion pattern, but creating turbulence so far ahead of the combustion chamber will do nothing but slow down the intake charge and at best, do nothing, at worst, decrease power and mileage. Intakes are specifically designed to use resonant frequencies and create turbulence and speed up the airflow through the airbox design, piping shape, intake runner length and shape and combustion chamber shape among every other combination of factors taken into account during the design phase. The last one is the most important for creating the turbulence desired before ignition.

I'd be especially cautious of cheaply made tornado or tornado like devices. If a vane or piece of metal breaks off in the part and gets sucked in(which seems likely seeing how low quality and thin it looks), you're going to be looking at a complete engine overhaul at the very least.

The magnet supposedly breaks down molecules of gasoline into smaller ones more likely to disperse when sprayed into the intake or combustion chamber but that tends to break a lot of rules of chemistry and physics, one of which is importantly, gasoline is NOT magnetic and the second, magnets would not create "looser" molecules. That's just poor science.

 

[Zenmervolt]

mwmorph has pretty much already covered the technical explanations.

The other claim with the Tornado and its ilk is that it allows the air to flow better, an example they use sometimes is turning a pop bottle upside down and watching water come out. When they swirl it, the water flows out better. However, the reason the "tornado" helps in that situation is because air has to displace the water within the bottle and there's no way for air to get in from the other end of the bottle. The "tornado" creates a path through the center of the exiting water that allows air to flow back into the bottle to displace the water.

Since a car's intake system is a straight through design, there's no benefit from this as there is no need for a single opening to flow in two directions at once.

Also as was mentioned, if the devices worked like they claim, manufacturers would install them in their cars. Despite what some conspiracy theorists want us to believe, car companies have no interest in keeping high-mileage technology away from the consumer. They are out to make money. If an automotive company had a device that could give 20% better fuel economy and increase power, they would install it.

ZV

 

[Uhtrinity]

Changing your driving habits can have the greatest impact short of a different vehicle. Slow down and avoid speeds above 55mph, avoid quick starts and stops, time lights so you can avoid stops. etc. Look up hypermiling, it really works. The average person can easily boost existing mileage by 20% or more.

 

[JulesMaximus]

None of those things work. They only thing they will do is part your roommate from his money.

The only thing you can do, short of buying a more efficient car, is drive slower and make sure your tires are properly inflated. Carpooling would help offset some of the cost of fuel.

 

[Uhtrinity]

On tires, narrower tires with a lower rolling resistance typically do better, as well as running higher tire pressure. This can easily make a 10% difference or more.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Things that work.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: mwmorph
if for $3 worth of metal, they could advertise 50% better EPA mileage, they would be doing it, especially with CAFE going up to 35mpg average by 2011, automakers are scrambling to make cars smaller or more efficient to fit the government regulations.

<TIN FOIL BEANIE>CAFE is just a conspiracy to have use believe the government wants us to conserve gas.</TIN FOIL BEANIE>

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: Demon-Xanth
Things that work.

You can hook up a air dryer to a power inverter and run it to the throttle body too.

 

[halik]

GARBAGE

If there was a simple 20 dollar solution to increase gas milage, don't you think auto companies would do it? Instead of spending millions developing hybrids, cylinder shut off, low CD bodies you just plop in a stupid piece of sheet metal and get 10% more mpg

 

[jamesbond007]

Thank you for the information everyone! It's exactly what I thought it'd be: BOGUS!

I should mention that it's pretty ironic that he brings this up now. He had a failing Nissan Maxima which he replaced with a GMC Z71 truck. He doesn't have to drive much, so he said he wanted to make his ride more enjoyable, get a better vehicle for the winter, etc. I think having a truck is great for hauling and is very practical, but definitely not as your only daily driver. That's my opinion, but he also has a nice Yamaha R1 bike that he rides a lot when (IF!!!) the weather ever decides to cooperate in North Dakota.

Can anyone shed some light on fuel additives? My dad is hyped up on some kind of product that is manufacturered in our area and he claims it did in fact bring his Chevy S-10 mileage up about 3-4MPG. I'm personally very wary about putting anything but the manufacturer recommended stuff inside my car. It's a complicated piece of machinery and my lack of know-how and judgement leaves much to be desired, so I just play it safe.

I found it and it's called CA-40.

 

[PottedMeat]

There are three things that are needed in combustion: fuel, oxygen and ignition. CA-40 suspends within the hydrocarbons and further allows oxygen and fuel to be held together (fuel and oxygen). The third component of ignition is accomplished due to the thermo-electric and Piezo-electric properties of the calcium in CA-40. When combustion occurs in the engine, the heat and pressure causes the electrons in the calcium to accelerate. This acceleration provides the ignition (spark) in the proximity of the hydrocarbons resulting in further oxidation (burning) of the hydrocarbons. The end result is a longer, stronger push on the piston, causing an increase in horsepower (see Diesel Dyno test page).

...wat?

Putting calcium in a combustion chamber dosen't seem like a very good idea.

 

[Zenmervolt]

CA-40 is BS. I can tell just from this statement, "Usually only about half of the hydrocarbons in fuel are burned in an internal combustion engine." Engines achieve a near-complete burn of their fuel. If only half were being burnt, there would be massive amounts of black smoke coming out of the tailpipe of every car on the road.

ZV

 

[desy]

CA-40 from what I seewould be no better than fuel injector cleaner.
I suspect he would have noticed the improvement by just doing that and cheaper.

Also a tune up does wonders and is what most vehicles with any amount of miles on them need the most to improve mpg

 

[Squisher]

Keep the car well tuned up, make sure you keep your tires properly inflated, change your driving habits. No jackrabbit starts and avoid hard stops, slow down below the posted speed limit on the e-way. Each car has its own best speed for mpg, most are around 60 mph.

You can bump up the tire pressure on the vehicle over the manufacturers settings, but only up to the max pressure on the side of the tire. However, a tire at max pressure with a fully loaded vehicle on a hot summer day is asking for a blow out. If a blow out occurs at at 70 mph it could ruin your day. I really wouldn't suggest going more than 3-5 psi over those stated on the sticker on your driver's door.

 

[alpineranger]

Overinflation is much safer than underinflation. The speed and load ratings for tires are normally only specified at the max sidewall inflation pressure. Underinflation increases rolling resistance, which generates more heat. Yes, that means blowouts are caused by _underinflation_ (among other things), and generally not by overinflation, and that running at the door sticker pressure is more likely to cause a blowout (when combined with factors like high speed and overloading). The manufacturers often list underinflation as a factor in tire failure, while not listing overinflation.

Why inflate to the manufacturer specified psi? The inflation pressure is a compromise between comfort on one hand and tire life / handling / economy on the other. Raise the pressure and you sacrifice comfort (and probably cause your suspension to wear more).

I remember reading an article in C&D years ago about one of those stunt drivers who does the driving on two wheels stunts. He used normal tires, but inflated them to like 100psi (and since they were riding on the sidewall, had to be replaced after a short distance. If massive overinflation like that, coupled with much higher weight loading and abusive wear didn't cause regular tire failure, you can be confident that there is a large safety margin built into the tires and slight overinflation alone is not going to cause an imminent catastrophe.

 

[Demon-Xanth]

Over inflation can cause some distinct changes in handling and premature wear. An example of how the tire pressures can affect a car, when I used to run 285/60R16's on the front and 295/65R16's on the rear of my car, it took me a month of playing with the tire pressures to get a good balence, I think I ended up with 28PSI on the front and 23 on the rear was the best I could get it. So if you're going to futz around with tire pressures, keep an eye on the wear and get ready to fiddle with it a lot to make it feel right.



...and for anyone else with a Dakota thinking about running that tire combo, don't. I hated those 295/65s and ended up getting new ones (285/60s all around) when they were half worn, but not before leaving a few 32nds worth of tread outside an old, unused dump. I thought the larger tires would get me better gas mileage, look better, and hook up better. The look was arguable, but not conclusively better, and it cost me half an MPG (after factoring in diameter differences), didn't hook up at all, complained every time I turned in a parking lot, and just had nothing going for them. Lower RPM doesn't necessarily mean better MPG.

 

[SoulAssassin]

Take a block of wood and stick it under the skinny pedal...that's about the only thing that works.