Gaming System

[Bobthelost]

SATAII or 300Gb/s are the same thing, marketiny hype, ignore them, no performance increase over SATA interfaces. Note: They use the same cables, SATAII is backwards compatible and all in all don't worry about it.

The improvements you get for normal users with a faster hard drives are a second shaved off here, a second shaved off there. You wouldn't miss it or suffer because you've only got a 7200rpm drive.

 

[hermanocabral]

quote:
Originally posted by: Bobthelost
Yee gods, you do not play hdtach. At no point have i drag raced my HDs against a friends to transfer a movie file. In real world tests the benifits are either none, or very small.

If you want to learn about RAID0 performance rather than just parrot the same old rubbish read the writeups on it at storage review.

Now as to if it improves performance, you'd see as much if not more improvement buying a larger (hence faster) drive in the first place.




any recomendations on a faster and larger and faster hd? sata 300 or sata 2? or theyre both the same thing?

what about those raptor 10krpm???

 

[thespyder]

When Anandtech rated the WD vs Seagate, the Raptor Blew the doors off of all competition. In almost every category rated, the Raptor was 10%+ over the others. As to if that translates into real life, not sure, but it made me want one.

In the end, I will have a WD Raptor 74gp and a Seagate 250 gb. One for speed and one for price and space. I am hoping this will work out well because, if I need a fast load, I will use the Raptor. if I have big levels and such, I will read off the Seagate.

Hope this helps.

 

[hermanocabral]

Originally posted by: thespyder
When Anandtech rated the WD vs Seagate, the Raptor Blew the doors off of all competition. In almost every category rated, the Raptor was 10%+ over the others. As to if that translates into real life, not sure, but it made me want one.

In the end, I will have a WD Raptor 74gp and a Seagate 250 gb. One for speed and one for price and space. I am hoping this will work out well because, if I need a fast load, I will use the Raptor. if I have big levels and such, I will read off the Seagate.

Hope this helps.

what if you are using the raptor and need something from the seagate? i guess the performance of this system will drop to the step of the slower hd, the same thing as putting together ddr333 and ddr400...

 

[Skeeedunt]

wow this thread is all over the place

I'll try to reinforce a few things -
e6600 = good
or
mild overclock of e6400 = easy
x1900xt is good, 7950gx is good too (may still be a littlle buggy though?)
2GB ddr2 533 or ddr2 800 if OC'ing
raid 0 = ok, not really spectacular, raptor 150 is probably a better option
you don't need a 700 watt PSU for a non-SLI non-OC system, just make sure you buy a quality one (seasonic, enhance, etc.)

 

[thespyder]

HD performance does have impact on games and the like, but not game breaking impact (that I know of). Basically what I was trying to say is, if the game requires smaller recurring loads, I would load it onto the Raptor. If it required large level loads, I might install it on the Seagate. At the end of the day, 7200.10 is REALLY good. Just Raptor is better. But could either of us REALLY see the +10%. I don't know.

 

[hermanocabral]

ok... heres what i have so far:

2x - LG 16X DVD±R Super-Multi DVD Burner With 12X DVD-RAM Write Beige E-IDE/ATAPI Model GSA-H10NB - OEM
1x - Western Digital Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB 10,000 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard Drive - OEM
1x - Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS (Perpendicular Recording Technology) 320GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - 1x - connect3D 3055 Radeon X1900XTX 512MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card - OEM
1x - ENERMAX Noisetaker II EG495P-VE ATX12V 485W Power Supply - Retail
1x - GIGABYTE GA-965P-DS3 Socket T (LGA 775) Intel P965 Express ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
1x - Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 Conroe 2.4GHz LGA 775 Processor Model BX80557E6600 - Retail
1x - G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit System Memory Model F2-6400PHU2-2GBHZ - Retail

is this a good setup? im not buying a case because im going to build my own....

theres a few things i was reading in the cpu forum that concerned me.. first is that almost everybody says that conroe runs better on asus and the other core runs better on ds3... is this true? what should i do in order to have more game performance, swith to 6400 or to asus mobo? second is the memory... this one i pick is fine or should i go with CORSAIR XMS2 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM Unbuffered DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit System Memory?

 

[akshayt]

1950XTX CF, upgrade to Dx10 later
4GB DDR2 1066 RAM, upgrade later

P5W asus

 

[hermanocabral]

Originally posted by: akshayt
1950XTX CF, upgrade to Dx10 later
4GB DDR2 1066 RAM, upgrade later

P5W asus

should i move to 1950, 4gb ram and p5w asus?? can you explain better?

 

[Bobthelost]

Originally posted by: hermanocabral

Originally posted by: akshayt
1950XTX CF, upgrade to Dx10 later
4GB DDR2 1066 RAM, upgrade later

P5W asus

should i move to 1950, 4gb ram and p5w asus?? can you explain better?

No you should not. The 1950 is a more powerful GPU, but it's a bit of a waste of money imo.

The 4GB of RAM is utterly pointless, although there's no reason other than money not to go with a P5W.

 

[VTrider]

Originally posted by: akshayt

4GB DDR2 1066 RAM, upgrade later

:roll:

 

[theprodigalrebel]

Originally posted by: hermanocabral

Originally posted by: akshayt
1950XTX CF, upgrade to Dx10 later
4GB DDR2 1066 RAM, upgrade later

P5W asus

should i move to 1950, 4gb ram and p5w asus?? can you explain better?

No, you don't need 4GB of RAM. Rather than buy 4GB today and wait for something to use it, buy 2GB today. IF someday you need 4GB, you can buy it then. Hardware prices always go down with time.

X1950XTX isn't out yet. September 13 is the date, I think. And X1900/X1950 Crossfire is only a good idea at 1920x1200 and above. A Crossfire setup with a 1600x1200 is NOT a bright idea.

About the build you posted above: its actually pretty good. But the Raptor 150 is a monstrous waste of money. Does it matter if a game loads in 35 seconds as opposed to 39 seconds? Yes, but not at the HUGE markup for the Raptor. That is ALL the difference you are likely to notice (or not).

This is what you have been reading in the CPU forums:
965-chipset motherboard (ASUS P5B Deluxe/Gigabyte DS3) - Ideal for E6300/E6400 (the 2MB L2 C2Ds)
975-chipser motherboard (ASUS P5W DH) - Ideal for the E6600/6700 (the 4MB L2 C2Ds)

This only really matters if you plan on a major overclock: like trying to get as close to 4GHz as possible. If that is not something you feel comfortable with, just get an E6600 and plug it into a quality motherboard. It's great at stock...and will still OC pretty damn fine, though not necessarily 70% and more like the lower-end chips are.

I think this should last a good 2 years and even more:
CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E6600/E6700

MB: There only appear to be three decent choices: DS3, P5B Deluxe and P5W DH Deluxe. The first one has VERY mixed reviews (mostly incompatability-issues, most of which have been ironed out), second is very expensive but pretty bug-free and the third one is a little more expensive... but seems to be the best one out there. I would still take the DS3 and hope/pray I didn't have any headaches. It's almost $100 cheaper than the ASUSs.

RAM: The G.Skill 2GBHZ RAM you chose is great. It should easily hit DDR2-1000 and above.

GPU: An X1900XT is absolutely great. $315 for a retail Sapphire unit: what's not to like?

PSU: Get a 500W PSU from Enhance, Seasonic, Silverstone, OCZ or FSP. All great brands.

Forget the Raptors, the P5W DH, the X1950XTX CF talk...keep the money in a "next-year's next-gen GPU upgrade" piggy bank or buy yourself a nice watch or something

Regards,
the rebel

 

[imported_RedStar]

maybe our systems will match as i am planning for mine to last for 4 years with only video upgrades as necessary (mostly for gaming):

I plan on buying:

CPU: Conroe: e6400 (well, really allendale

MB: asus pw5 dh (nvidia says will unlock 975x chipset for sli --link in this forum can't remember where)) --but i really want the asus board based on the nforce 590 (depends on release date) edit: P5N32-SLI Premium/WiFi-AP

video card: x800xl until direct x 10 parts become available --then switch to sli high end

2 gig ddr2 800 ram (was leaning towards OCZ...but with all the complaints some kind of corsair prolly)

HDD: 2 seagate barracuda 7200.10 320 gig
couple dvd burners

x-fi extreme music sound card (only thing i have bought so far

PSU: Corsair HX Series CMPSU-620HX 620W (or even the 700w OCZ gamexstream --though the ripple concern is still an oustanding issue with me.)

case: p180b

 

[hermanocabral]

this directx thing is concerning me too.... why should i waste money on a top gpu, if directx will come out and blow all them away? should i wat for dx10 to come out or when it comes out wont do that much difference in today games?

and about the raptor... i usually play games that load ******* loads* of textures, maps, and stuff like that.... wont the raptro do better on those games?

 

[imported_RedStar]

with the raptor ..with all advice i got, games will load levels faster. But that's about it.

and dx 10, from an MS release, will make games 7-15x faster. Games will use that boost to cram in more effects ect..

so lets assume that MS is really, really optimistic...even a 50% performance boost would be amazing to me

I expect big things from dx 10

 

[hermanocabral]

but how can today games enjoy dx10 if they are designed with dx9?

my point is: if i buy this gpu today, and let say, in november dx is out.... will i be throwing my money away?

 

[Bobthelost]

DX10 won't be needed for a while, and i really, really wouldn't expect that much improvement. Either way you'll need vista, games that use DX-10 and a DX10 card. We don't know when any of those are going to turn up, let alone all of them. Some games might make use of DX10 in the next six months or so, but you won't find games that need DX10 for at least a couple of years.

DX10 will offer some new eyecandy, but that's about it.

Once you've loaded the map it doesn't matter if you've got a 2.5" 5400rpm drive or a raptor. The difference is only in the load times (where yes, the raptor will shave off a few seconds).

 

[imported_RedStar]

dx9 will also be supported with dx 10 cards ...you will be able to run both in vista.

However, to use dx 10 you will need a dx 10 compliant vid card (not out yet --supposed to coincide with vista (january).

this is why i will not spend big bucks on video card now.. i consider it a waste of money.

 

[imported_RedStar]

2 years for dx 10 games? i don't think so.

doh ment to add this as an edit. sorry for double post.

edit: as for the promise of dx 10, look at crysis

and read up on dx 10 here:

http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTA0NSwxLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==

edit2:

http://www.driverheaven.net/articles/dx10/

ati is closer to unified architecture

 

[Bobthelost]

Originally posted by: RedStar
2 years for dx 10 games? i don't think so.

doh ment to add this as an edit. sorry for double post.

edit: as for the promise of dx 10, look at crysis

and read up on dx 10 here:

http://enthusiast.hardocp.com/article.html?art=MTA0NSwxLCxoZW50aHVzaWFzdA==

You didn't read my post did you.

ome games might make use of DX10 in the next six months or so, but you won't find games that need DX10 for at least a couple of years.

2 years before you see games that NEED DX10. Nothing in that article leads me to reconsider that statement. Think of this as HDCP and you're getting the same impression, computer games companies want to make money, ruling out a good portion of the customer base is not a good plan for that.

 

[imported_RedStar]

seems the r600 will be the first dx10 part out ...all on shaky ground now. But for me...the ability to do both xfire and sli would hedge my bets. compromises..the bain of existence

--
as for need(require) vs need(performance) -time will tell soon enough i think

edit2: thinking more on your statements .. i think we are thinking exactly the same. Except i am opting to compromise early for an anticipated future benefit and your are opting for a later compromise on the promise of an known and established early benefit.

ie: i say get a cheap card now..as you will still be able to game with all current games (no restriction) though at reduced settings/resolution...so you can get a dx10 for better anticipated future performance.

and you are saying get a great dx 9 card now for immediate performance benefit while settling for reduced performance in the future.




edit 3: and if you know you can resell your high end part or have lots of money ..you need not have to compromise at all!

 

[deadseasquirrel]

Originally posted by: theprodigalrebel
X1950XTX isn't out yet. September 13 is the date, I think. And X1900/X1950 Crossfire is only a good idea at 1920x1200 and above. A Crossfire setup with a 1600x1200 is NOT a bright idea.

I disagree that 1600x1200 is bad for SLI/Crossfire. The increase isn't as much as some of the higher resolutions, but there is still an increase. It's up to the buyer to determine whether that % increase is worth their money or not.

HL2 LC 1600x1200 4xAA 16xAF
7900GTX SLI......90
7950 GX2...........76
7900 GTX...........61

SLI improvement is 48% (compared to 52% at 19x12 and jumping above 70% for 20x15 and 25x16).

Quake4 Ultra 16x12 4xAA 16xAF
7900GTX SLI......104
7950 GX2...........86
7900 GTX...........62

68% increase

FEAR 16x12 4xAA 16xAF
7900GTX SLI......90
7950 GX2...........71
7900 GTX...........48

87% increase

Oblivion Foliage 16x12 0xAA (HDR) 16xAF
7900GTX SLI......41
7950 GX2...........32
7900 GTX...........22

86% increase

I should look for some Crossfire numbers too, but I'm pretty sure they'd be close to these anyway. The point is, yes, you're paying 100% more for a second GPU and only getting 50-90% increase. But what other component in your system can do that? None. You could pay 500% more for the most expensive CPU and get 0% increase in games at 1600x1200.

 

[hermanocabral]

lol, im kinda lost here... guess i will stick with a cheaper gpu and put some more on the mobo....

 

[Bobthelost]

Don't. Shelling out on a fancy motherboard doesn't do much for performance (remember that even at stock your CPU is more than enough) but getting a cheaper GPU will be very noticable.

 

[imported_RedStar]

i would agree...any money saved on the cheap video substitute is to be used to buy the dx 10 part coming out in the very near future .

you could also compromise on the compromise and get a mid range part for 250$ and then spend the 600$ on the dx 10 part