GameCube Timeline

[bcterps]

Originally posted by: Ikonomi

Originally posted by: purbeast0 gamecube > ps2 > xbox ...

There, I corrected that for you. (But thanks for supporting my assertions about console gamers in general!)

As a whole, I think that PS2 and GCN are about the same. PS2 is where it's at for RPGs, hands down. GCN has SoA:Legends and that's DC port. However the GCN exclusive games simply can't be beat.

 

[Dragnov]

Everything Hiroshi Yamauchi said only goes to prove that he's a scary, curmudgeonly old pimp. Remember when he said that all the people who played Final Fantasy on the PlayStation were losers who sat in dark rooms with their consoles?

Thats not true?

 

[bcterps]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: benchiu

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: benchiu The recent comments by Nintendo advisor Hirsohi Yamauchi (former company president) sum up how out of touch Nintendo is.

No, they only sum up how out of touch Yamauchi is with the gaming industry. Which is exactly the reason why he is no longer in charge.

Actually, current Nintendo president Satoru Iwata has said much the same thing. This feeling is pervasive through Nintendo as a whole. Here's Iwata's latest comments (taken from an IGN article). Quizzed by the paper on Nintendo's next-generation console, Iwata replied: "I do not believe releasing a higher performance machine is the solution. Our hardware development team is thinking about the next move, but I cannot tell you about it."

What is IGN's source and who did the translation of Iwata's original response? What is the context of his answer? "Higher performance machine" is the solution to what? Winning this generation or next? An out of context comment from a translated interview is proof of nothing.

It's about the next generation console.

Read the story for yourself and decide

The source was the Nikkei Business Daily, I was looking for the link over there but I don't have a subscription. It stems from an interview with the Nihon Keizai Shimbun.

 

[BoomAM]

Originally posted by: Rent
The SNES was not the first online console. The Commodore 64 had a modem and games that supported it, however it was expensive.

Let me rephrase it then.
It was the first popular home console that appealed to the masses that had online capibility.
The C64 wasnt that popular, or supported by the masses as the SNES was.

 

[BoomAM]

Originally posted by: benchiu
As a whole, I think that PS2 and GCN are about the same. PS2 is where it's at for RPGs, hands down. GCN has SoA:Legends and that's DC port. However the GCN exclusive games simply can't be beat.

The GC has a few RPGs that blow every other RPG, from any platform out of the water.
Zelda for one. And dont bother arguing. The Majority of the world considers it a RPG.
Metroid as well. Even though its played from a first person view, its fundamentally a RPG.

 

[bcterps]

Originally posted by: BoomAM

Originally posted by: benchiu As a whole, I think that PS2 and GCN are about the same. PS2 is where it's at for RPGs, hands down. GCN has SoA:Legends and that's DC port. However the GCN exclusive games simply can't be beat.

The GC has a few RPGs that blow every other RPG, from any platform out of the water. Zelda for one. And dont bother arguing. The Majority of the world considers it a RPG. Metroid as well. Even though its played from a first person view, its fundamentally a RPG.

Zelda and Metroid are awesome games, but RPG to me is something along the lines of FFX, FFX-2, Star Ocean, Suikoden, etc. The only thing on the GCN that can compare is SoA, although Baiten Kaitos looks interesting, whenever it comes out.

 

[Ikonomi]

Originally posted by: BoomAM

Originally posted by: benchiu
As a whole, I think that PS2 and GCN are about the same. PS2 is where it's at for RPGs, hands down. GCN has SoA:Legends and that's DC port. However the GCN exclusive games simply can't be beat.

The GC has a few RPGs that blow every other RPG, from any platform out of the water.
Zelda for one. And dont bother arguing. The Majority of the world considers it a RPG.
Metroid as well. Even though its played from a first person view, its fundamentally a RPG.

I can see where you're coming from, but I don't agree that Metroid games are RPGs. The Metroid/Castlevania style of play basically defines the adventure/action adventure genre. But the lines have become so blurred and oftentimes stupid that it's hard to tell sometimes.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: BoomAM

Originally posted by: benchiu
As a whole, I think that PS2 and GCN are about the same. PS2 is where it's at for RPGs, hands down. GCN has SoA:Legends and that's DC port. However the GCN exclusive games simply can't be beat.

The GC has a few RPGs that blow every other RPG, from any platform out of the water.
Zelda for one. And dont bother arguing. The Majority of the world considers it a RPG.
Metroid as well. Even though its played from a first person view, its fundamentally a RPG.

By that logic every first person shooter can be called a RPG.

 

[BoomAM]

Originally posted by: Ikonomi

Originally posted by: BoomAM

Originally posted by: benchiu
As a whole, I think that PS2 and GCN are about the same. PS2 is where it's at for RPGs, hands down. GCN has SoA:Legends and that's DC port. However the GCN exclusive games simply can't be beat.

The GC has a few RPGs that blow every other RPG, from any platform out of the water.
Zelda for one. And dont bother arguing. The Majority of the world considers it a RPG.
Metroid as well. Even though its played from a first person view, its fundamentally a RPG.

I can see where you're coming from, but I don't agree that Metroid games are RPGs. The Metroid/Castlevania style of play basically defines the adventure/action adventure genre. But the lines have become so blurred and oftentimes stupid that it's hard to tell sometimes.

Not saying all Metroid Games. Just Metroid Prime.

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: BoomAM

Originally posted by: benchiu
As a whole, I think that PS2 and GCN are about the same. PS2 is where it's at for RPGs, hands down. GCN has SoA:Legends and that's DC port. However the GCN exclusive games simply can't be beat.

The GC has a few RPGs that blow every other RPG, from any platform out of the water.
Zelda for one. And dont bother arguing. The Majority of the world considers it a RPG.
Metroid as well. Even though its played from a first person view, its fundamentally a RPG.

By that logic every first person shooter can be called a RPG.

We could use this logic you`ve invented if Metroid was a FPS game. Which its not. Just cos it has guns and a first person view point, doesnt automatically make it a FPS.

 

[Ikonomi]

Not saying all Metroid Games. Just Metroid Prime.

Ah, duly noted.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: BoomAM
We could use this logic you`ve invented if Metroid was a FPS game. Which its not. Just cos it has guns and a first person view point, doesnt automatically make it a FPS.

First Person Shooter.

I remember the game being in the first person. And I also remember having to do a crapload of shooting. In fact, every time I left a room and returned later, I had to shoot the exact same creatures over again.

I'm sorry. What part of that did I invent again?

 

[LordJezo]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: BoomAM
We could use this logic you`ve invented if Metroid was a FPS game. Which its not. Just cos it has guns and a first person view point, doesnt automatically make it a FPS.

First Person Shooter.

I remember the game being in the first person. And I also remember having to do a crapload of shooting. In fact, every time I left a room and returned later, I had to shoot the exact same creatures over again.

I'm sorry. What part of that did I invent again?

I always wondered the same thing.. how is Metroid not a FPS? When I tried it I did a lot of shooting of enemies from the first person and jumping around. Dosent that make it a FPS? And then there were the bosses which I shot at much like I shot at bosses in Quake..

 

[BoomAM]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: BoomAM
We could use this logic you`ve invented if Metroid was a FPS game. Which its not. Just cos it has guns and a first person view point, doesnt automatically make it a FPS.

First Person Shooter.

I remember the game being in the first person. And I also remember having to do a crapload of shooting. In fact, every time I left a room and returned later, I had to shoot the exact same creatures over again.

I'm sorry. What part of that did I invent again?

Metroid is more of a genre hybrid. Like DX1. You can`t put it in any particular catagory, but most the most obvious elements that point towards a specific genre are the RPG one. Hence why most of the worlds population considers it a Action/Adventure/RPG. It just happens to have shooting sections, to appeal to the masses, and is played from a first person viewpoint.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: BoomAM
Metroid is more of a genre hybrid. Like DX1. You can`t put it in any particular catagory, but most the most obvious elements that point towards a specific genre are the RPG one. Hence why most of the worlds population considers it a Action/Adventure/RPG. It just happens to have shooting sections, to appeal to the masses, and is played from a first person viewpoint.

Appeal to the masses? Since when is shooting in any Metroid game considered "appealing to the masses?"

Why is so difficult to admit that Metroid is considered a FPS? When did "first person shooter" start carrying such a negative connotation? The game is in the first person perspective and there is a lot of shooting - whether it's at small creatures, machines, huge bosses, or even doors that open to new areas.

RPGs tend to be heavily story driven - something that Metroid Prime is very weak in. Deus Ex, Wheel of Time, System Shock - Ok, fine I can see some RPG elements.

 

[edro]

Here is another vote for Metroid Prime being a Third/First Person Shooter... (although it has large, complex levels)

 

[bcterps]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: BoomAM Metroid is more of a genre hybrid. Like DX1. You can`t put it in any particular catagory, but most the most obvious elements that point towards a specific genre are the RPG one. Hence why most of the worlds population considers it a Action/Adventure/RPG. It just happens to have shooting sections, to appeal to the masses, and is played from a first person viewpoint.

Appeal to the masses? Since when is shooting in any Metroid game considered "appealing to the masses?" Why is so difficult to admit that Metroid is considered a FPS? When did "first person shooter" start carrying such a negative connotation? The game is in the first person perspective and there is a lot of shooting - whether it's at small creatures, machines, huge bosses, or even doors that open to new areas. RPGs tend to be heavily story driven - something that Metroid Prime is very weak in. Deus Ex, Wheel of Time, System Shock - Ok, fine I can see some RPG elements.

The only recent first person game that I've played that is a true RPG is Morrowind. Even Deus Ex didnt feel like an RPG to me. Maybe my view of RPGs is very limited, but MP definitely does not fall into the RPG category in my book. Awesome game though

 

[BoomAM]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed
Why is so difficult to admit that Metroid is considered a FPS?

Thats the thing though. 1 or 2 of you think it is. Most of the world says otherwise. I can point you to a whole host of magazines that list it as a Adventure RPG.

When did "first person shooter" start carrying such a negative connotation?

It didnt. I like fps games. Just saying Metroid Prime is a FPS is an insult to the game.

RPGs tend to be heavily story driven - something that Metroid Prime is very weak in. Deus Ex, Wheel of Time, System Shock - Ok, fine I can see some RPG elements.

Story in Metroid Prime weak? ha, thats a laugh. The story in it is far better than most games out.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

Originally posted by: BoomAM
Thats the thing though. 1 or 2 of you think it is. Most of the world says otherwise. I can point you to a whole host of magazines that list it as a Adventure RPG.

What can I say, the world is full of stupid people. Please link to some of these magazines. Not that I don't believe you, I just want to see for myself.

It didnt. I like fps games. Just saying Metroid Prime is a FPS is an insult to the game.

You say "FPS" doesn't carry a negative connotation, then say calling Metroid a FPS is an insult. Please elaborate.

Story in Metroid Prime weak? ha, thats a laugh. The story in it is far better than most games out.

I'm sorry, you mean the story that isn't remotely close to being important to the game? You mean the story that you read in bits and pieces throughout the game by scanning various totems on walls and such? Saying the story is weak compared to most games sure as hell doesn't make the story in Metroid high quality or even relevant to the gameplay.

The problem isn't with Metroid's story, per se. The issue lies in the presentation, or in Metroid's case complete lack thereof, to the gamer. Nobody likes sitting through hours of cut scenes, but laying out the story in these scan points in the miscellaneous rooms makes it very easy to miss important bits. The best way to lose the audience's attention is to break up the development of characters and plot.

Take out Metroid's plot and you have an elaborate game of "find the key to open the next door." The difference, thankfully, is that Retro put forth a damn good, polished game.

 

[Spoooon]

I'm sorry, you mean the story that isn't remotely close to being important to the game? You mean the story that you read in bits and pieces throughout the game by scanning various totems on walls and such? Saying the story is weak compared to most games sure as hell doesn't make the story in Metroid high quality or even relevant to the gameplay.

The problem isn't with Metroid's story, per se. The issue lies in the presentation, or in Metroid's case complete lack thereof, to the gamer. Nobody likes sitting through hours of cut scenes, but laying out the story in these scan points in the miscellaneous rooms makes it very easy to miss important bits. The best way to lose the audience's attention is to break up the development of characters and plot.

Take out Metroid's plot and you have an elaborate game of "find the key to open the next door." The difference, thankfully, is that Retro put forth a damn good, polished game.

I liked the way they presented the story in Metroid Prime. It made it seem more like I was doing the exploring. I thought it was cool.

 

[BoomAM]

Originally posted by: KnightBreed

Originally posted by: BoomAM
Thats the thing though. 1 or 2 of you think it is. Most of the world says otherwise. I can point you to a whole host of magazines that list it as a Adventure RPG.

What can I say, the world is full of stupid people. Please link to some of these magazines. Not that I don't believe you, I just want to see for myself.

Ha ha, i can`t belive you let that one slip. Do you want me to scan the magazines for you? lol.

It didnt. I like fps games. Just saying Metroid Prime is a FPS is an insult to the game.

You say "FPS" doesn't carry a negative connotation, then say calling Metroid a FPS is an insult. Please elaborate.

Metroid Prime is a far more involving and intricate game than any fps can ever hope to be. Most fps are good shooting games (obviously), and the better ones have a few puzzles & a good story behind it.
Metroid Prime has a great story, great puzzle sections, the ability to actualy learn about your surroundings, to better your ingame character, and a few rpg elements. Calling Metroid Prime "just a fps" is an insult to the game and the developers who have worked hard to make it what it is. Its so much more than a fps. And guess what genre that leads to? Yes you guessed it, the rpg/fps hybrid that the SS & DX series made "popular".

Story in Metroid Prime weak? ha, thats a laugh. The story in it is far better than most games out.

I'm sorry, you mean the story that isn't remotely close to being important to the game? You mean the story that you read in bits and pieces throughout the game by scanning various totems on walls and such? Saying the story is weak compared to most games sure as hell doesn't make the story in Metroid high quality or even relevant to the gameplay.

The problem isn't with Metroid's story, per se. The issue lies in the presentation, or in Metroid's case complete lack thereof, to the gamer. Nobody likes sitting through hours of cut scenes, but laying out the story in these scan points in the miscellaneous rooms makes it very easy to miss important bits. The best way to lose the audience's attention is to break up the development of characters and plot.

Metroid prime has been designed in a way where its possible to trek through the whole game oblivious to the specifics of the story. You`ll still have an idea about it, but not all the info. Its also possible to get all the info from the game, and learn more about the connections between all of the species in the game. Its cos of that that it appeals to a wide range of gamers. Both the gamer looking for an enjoyable game, and those looking for a game thats deep and involving.

Take out Metroid's plot and you have an elaborate game of "find the key to open the next door." The difference, thankfully, is that Retro put forth a damn good, polished game.

Your contradicting yourself there. First you say Metroid Primes story is crap, and now you say it`d be crap without the story!?

 

[StageLeft]

I, as a console customer, want a console that has games like GTA3 with lots of violence, and I like features in the console

 

[BoomAM]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
I, as a console customer, want a console that has games like GTA3 with lots of violence, and I like features in the console

You mean open-ended ness?
With amazing gfx?
A range of control options?
The ability to play DVDs?
Online Play?

Your using one right now. Its called a PC!

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: BoomAM

Originally posted by: benchiu
As a whole, I think that PS2 and GCN are about the same. PS2 is where it's at for RPGs, hands down. GCN has SoA:Legends and that's DC port. However the GCN exclusive games simply can't be beat.

The GC has a few RPGs that blow every other RPG, from any platform out of the water.
Zelda for one. And dont bother arguing. The Majority of the world considers it a RPG.
Metroid as well. Even though its played from a first person view, its fundamentally a RPG.

those are usually considered adventure games. the adventure game died off in the mid 90s for the most part though.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: BoomAM

Originally posted by: Lawrencetan21
I though a good portion of the money they are making are from game lisencening. So that means if they're weak on third party games then...

Nope.
Most of the money comes from the GB`s & the GC sales. The GC is sold at £90 in the UK, yet costs only £40 to make(remember reading that in a mag once).

Originally posted by: Anubis

Originally posted by: abaez
Customers don't want colors in their games. They want bring brawny game characters to knock the snot out of people and things. They want fast games, nevermind the story. You have to make sure that, whenever the customer finishes the game, they feel in some way superior over something or someone else (but limit yourself to the quake color palette of course.)

i think your wrong,

Theres no think about it. He is wrong.
You(abaez) might want games with no depth, fast paced gameplay and no story, but there are far more people who want decent games.
For example;
Zelda. By its looks alone, its a kiddy game. Play it and you`ll soon realise that it has more depth than 90% of the games outthere, with a better story as well. Another example. X2. Slow paced gameplay, deep plot. wealth of things to do, yet is more popular than most of the "no brain required" games that you seem to fondly enjoy.
So it just goes to show, that a game doesnt have to be mindless to play for it to sell. Thats why almost all of the great games that has ever come out, has more depth than the average game of their time. If all games were like you describe, then we wouldnt be awating HL2 and similar games.

i think both of you fell into a giant gaping sarchasm

 

[yukichigai]

I think Nintendo is lagging in the US because they're trying to use the same business model here that they use in Japan. In order to unlock a lot of the extra features in games on the GC and the GBA you have to connect them up with other consoles or other systems, usually meaning you have to play or otherwise interact with other people. Now in Japan games are probably more of a social thing, but I think in the US more gamers are loners than aren't. Zelda: Four Swords, Crystal Chronicles, etc. They all require you to interact, physically, with other people. In Japan getting together with a group of friends who own all the latest Nintendo gadgets probably isn't that hard. But here... well I don't even have 3 friends with GBAs, much less 3 with the same games as me. That ties in to the online play issue. I think Nintendo isn't concentrating on online play because they figure everyone will just get together in one place. Wrong! Online play is pretty much an alternative to human interaction for most fans of it.

I think the bottom line is that Nintendo really needs to start developing more stuff with the US consumer in mind, particularly some manner of online support. A lot of these games that seem like a pain in the ass due to their multiplayer requirements (or almost-requirements, e.g. FF:CC) would be a lot more well received if you could fufill those requirements through an online service.

P.S. Metroid: Zero Mission and Wario Ware are now the two main focuses of my life. Nintendo is kind of struggling with the console market but they really do know how to dominate the handheld market. (Having no competition at the moment helps though ) If they released some of the good oldschool RPGs for GBA -- Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy 6, hell even Mario RPG -- it is entirely possible I wouldn't really need to own any other gaming platform.

EDIT: text edited on the advice of the Department of Redundancy Department.