Gaining weight, but lossing fat?

[mrd316]

Hey everybody, I was surfing the web for some weight lifting tips and stumbled across this site, which seems great and very active.

Here's my question. I'm a 17 year old high school football player looking to add muscle and gain weight, but lose unnecessary fat that slows me down. I'm an offensive guard/center, so obviously I need to have some fat, but I feel that I am too "pudgy," especially in my stomach, and I think that hinders my quickness/speed/explosion.

I'm 5 foot 9 and 212 pounds, and I lift 4 days a week. I consider myself pretty strong (obviously trying to keep building strength though), and I do squats, cleens, bench, incline bench, and all the secondary muscles (not on the same day of course). Every day I lift I do abs as well and two days a week I do cardio/running.

Just so you know, I do drink protein shakes after I lift but I am not comfortable with any supplements or creatine and I definitely am not touching any steroids or anything. My diet isn't awesome but it's not bad either, I do not drink soda/alcohol but I do eat a lot. I grab a Powerbar for breakfast, eat a sandwich at lunch, another sandwich after I lift, and some type of meat/pasta for dinner (this is just a typical day, obviously it varies from day to day). My problem I think is that I eat too many salty foods like chips and stuff and I need to cut out the extra calories.

So basically, how can I continue to build muscle and strength and put on weight, but lose this extra fat that I have? Do I need to do more cardio, change my diet, etc?

Thanks for any responses, I know this is a long post.

 

[Safeway]

Add some HIIT cardio to your routine. That's High Intensity Interval Training. Do some research on it.

 

[spamsk8r]

I think most here will agree that gaining muscle and losing fat are divergent goals. To attempt to do both at the same time will not be a very good use of your time, as even though you might be able to do a little bit of each, you won't get the results that you would get if you focused on one or the other. You can gain strength without gaining muscle, but you won't gain any muscle weight unless you eat more than you need. The problem is that you'll gain fat as well. On the other hand, if you want to lose fat, you need to burn more calories than you take in. You won't build any muscle, though. If you eat the same amount that you burn each day, you're not likely to see much change at all (at least, not in the near future). Decide which is more important to you, muscle mass, or fat loss, and focus on that.

Believe me, we all want to do both, but it's practically impossible for all but the amazingly gifted (genetically).

 

[Safeway]

Originally posted by: spamsk8r
Believe me, we all want to do both, but it's practically impossible for all but the amazingly gifted (genetically).

Not sure I agree. In about 3 months, I was able to build large amounts of muscle and shed large amounts of fat. I can confirm this with physical therapy scans from The University of Texas kinesiology department. My caloric intake was above BMR, and I was eating ~150g of protein per day. I was doing 1 hour of LISS cardio per day, and about 1.5 hours of weight training.

I went from 220 to 190, with large muscle gains.

 

[spamsk8r]

Originally posted by: Safeway

Originally posted by: spamsk8r
Believe me, we all want to do both, but it's practically impossible for all but the amazingly gifted (genetically).

Not sure I agree. In about 3 months, I was able to build large amounts of muscle and shed large amounts of fat. I can confirm this with physical therapy scans from The University of Texas kinesiology department. My caloric intake was above BMR, and I was eating ~150g of protein per day. I was doing 1 hour of LISS cardio per day, and about 1.5 hours of weight training.

I went from 220 to 190, with large muscle gains.

You might be confusing strength gains for muscle gains. You can gain plenty of strength with no increase in muscle mass. Also, removing the fat covering the muscles would make you look larger and more muscular. I'm not saying that you didn't gain muscle, but the body physically cannot create muscle tissue and burn fat at the same point in time. Also, you say you were eating above your BMR, but you have to remember that BMR is the amount of calories you burn if you did absolutely nothing all day. To lose weight, which you did, you ate less calories than you were burning. So I would say that your gains were mainly (again, not completely, but mainly) in strength due to neurological adaptations, as opposed to dry muscle tissue. If not, then consider yourself lucky, you are genetically gifted in that respect. The vast majority of people cannot do this.

 

[bignateyk]

Originally posted by: spamsk8r
I think most here will agree that gaining muscle and losing fat are divergent goals. To attempt to do both at the same time will not be a very good use of your time, as even though you might be able to do a little bit of each, you won't get the results that you would get if you focused on one or the other. You can gain strength without gaining muscle, but you won't gain any muscle weight unless you eat more than you need. The problem is that you'll gain fat as well. On the other hand, if you want to lose fat, you need to burn more calories than you take in. You won't build any muscle, though. If you eat the same amount that you burn each day, you're not likely to see much change at all (at least, not in the near future). Decide which is more important to you, muscle mass, or fat loss, and focus on that.

Believe me, we all want to do both, but it's practically impossible for all but the amazingly gifted (genetically).

I'd have to agree. You can continue to gain strength (through neurological and cardiopulmonary adaptation) while losing fat, but good luck increasing muscle fiber diameter and losing fat at the same time.

 

[Safeway]

Originally posted by: spamsk8r

Originally posted by: Safeway

Originally posted by: spamsk8r
Believe me, we all want to do both, but it's practically impossible for all but the amazingly gifted (genetically).

Not sure I agree. In about 3 months, I was able to build large amounts of muscle and shed large amounts of fat. I can confirm this with physical therapy scans from The University of Texas kinesiology department. My caloric intake was above BMR, and I was eating ~150g of protein per day. I was doing 1 hour of LISS cardio per day, and about 1.5 hours of weight training.

I went from 220 to 190, with large muscle gains.

You might be confusing strength gains for muscle gains. You can gain plenty of strength with no increase in muscle mass. Also, removing the fat covering the muscles would make you look larger and more muscular. I'm not saying that you didn't gain muscle, but the body physically cannot create muscle tissue and burn fat at the same point in time. Also, you say you were eating above your BMR, but you have to remember that BMR is the amount of calories you burn if you did absolutely nothing all day. To lose weight, which you did, you ate less calories than you were burning. So I would say that your gains were mainly (again, not completely, but mainly) in strength due to neurological adaptations, as opposed to dry muscle tissue. If not, then consider yourself lucky, you are genetically gifted in that respect. The vast majority of people cannot do this.

Actual muscle mass increased. I can't remember the name of the scan, but it was basically an FMIR or CAT or something. I got in a big machine and they imaged my body. It was for a physical therapy/kinesiology graduate student's thesis. I lost fat and gained muscle. Out of the 25 students in my weight lifting class (that participated), only 2 gained enough muscle/lost enough fat to matter statistically. I was one of them.

 

[Koing]

Originally posted by: Safeway

Originally posted by: spamsk8r

Originally posted by: Safeway

Originally posted by: spamsk8r
Believe me, we all want to do both, but it's practically impossible for all but the amazingly gifted (genetically).

Not sure I agree. In about 3 months, I was able to build large amounts of muscle and shed large amounts of fat. I can confirm this with physical therapy scans from The University of Texas kinesiology department. My caloric intake was above BMR, and I was eating ~150g of protein per day. I was doing 1 hour of LISS cardio per day, and about 1.5 hours of weight training.

I went from 220 to 190, with large muscle gains.

You might be confusing strength gains for muscle gains. You can gain plenty of strength with no increase in muscle mass. Also, removing the fat covering the muscles would make you look larger and more muscular. I'm not saying that you didn't gain muscle, but the body physically cannot create muscle tissue and burn fat at the same point in time. Also, you say you were eating above your BMR, but you have to remember that BMR is the amount of calories you burn if you did absolutely nothing all day. To lose weight, which you did, you ate less calories than you were burning. So I would say that your gains were mainly (again, not completely, but mainly) in strength due to neurological adaptations, as opposed to dry muscle tissue. If not, then consider yourself lucky, you are genetically gifted in that respect. The vast majority of people cannot do this.

Actual muscle mass increased. I can't remember the name of the scan, but it was basically an FMIR or CAT or something. I got in a big machine and they imaged my body. It was for a physical therapy/kinesiology graduate student's thesis. I lost fat and gained muscle. Out of the 25 students in my weight lifting class (that participated), only 2 gained enough muscle/lost enough fat to matter statistically. I was one of them.

Would that not at least show to this guy he is unlikely to be 8% that can do this?

When people bulk they go crazy and eat lots of crap food. They should still be eating clean, but allow for more carbs before and after training. Not just gorge on the stuff 24/7 and wonder why they have no abs.

Sure you can do it but most people will struggle to make decent gains whilst staying really cut. You are better off being a bit less lean but your gaining muscle mass.

OP your eating is poor. Tidy it up and make better food choices.

bread has lots of carbs in it, very refined carbs, you are better off with natural porridge and oats for breakfast, add a bit of honey if you must, milk.

Eat better and train as you aure.

The poddgyness around your stomach is not enough to slow you down unless your carring A LOT of it.

You would be better well served working with a sprint coach for your speed work. You are lacking speed/ agility because you probably don't train it, and your heavy. Tidy up your eating and continue as you are.

Write down what you eat for a day or two and look at it. Don't make any adjustments to what you eat, or it won't be a true reflection.

Koing

 

[Safeway]

Originally posted by: Koing
Would that not at least show to this guy he is unlikely to be 8% that can do this?

When people bulk they go crazy and eat lots of crap food. They should still be eating clean, but allow for more carbs before and after training. Not just gorge on the stuff 24/7 and wonder why they have no abs.

Sure you can do it but most people will struggle to make decent gains whilst staying really cut. You are better off being a bit less lean but your gaining muscle mass.

OP your eating is poor. Tidy it up and make better food choices.

bread has lots of carbs in it, very refined carbs, you are better off with natural porridge and oats for breakfast, add a bit of honey if you must, milk.

Eat better and train as you aure.

The poddgyness around your stomach is not enough to slow you down unless your carring A LOT of it.

You would be better well served working with a sprint coach for your speed work. You are lacking speed/ agility because you probably don't train it, and your heavy. Tidy up your eating and continue as you are.

Write down what you eat for a day or two and look at it. Don't make any adjustments to what you eat, or it won't be a true reflection.

Koing

True. I just don't like when people say that it is impossible to lose fat and build muscle simultaneously.

Eating clean is very important. I was eating steel-cut oats, ultra whole-grain breads, greens, broccoli, carrots, snap peas, chicken, tuna, salmon, ... just clean! Sure, you can throw in a protein shake (skim), creatine, Animal Pak, fish oil, and other supplements, just don't snack on chips. Instead, eat a handful of almonds or some cut vegetables. It takes some getting used to, but it works. To get my salt fix, I eat a few salty peanuts. Sweet fix, put some Splenda packets in your Special-K Protein Pluss cereal.

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: Safeway

Originally posted by: spamsk8r
Believe me, we all want to do both, but it's practically impossible for all but the amazingly gifted (genetically).

Not sure I agree. In about 3 months, I was able to build large amounts of muscle and shed large amounts of fat. I can confirm this with physical therapy scans from The University of Texas kinesiology department. My caloric intake was above BMR, and I was eating ~150g of protein per day. I was doing 1 hour of LISS cardio per day, and about 1.5 hours of weight training.

I went from 220 to 190, with large muscle gains.

What was your bodyfat percentage at 220 and 190? Was it actually measured?

Beginners may be able to do both at the same time. However, good luck getting to < 10bf% while simultaneously increasing your LBM to > 200 lbs. If you can do that, then you definitely have elite genetics.

Also, you said you did this in 3 months. Can we then extrapolate that and say after 12 months you would continue to burn fat and build muscle that entire time?

Every time I read about someone who claims to have gained muscle and lost fat at the same time, it's always for only a short period of time. I have yet to see anyone claim they can do it continuously, year after year, with nonstop progress. If you can do that, then you should start thinking about becoming an IFBB pro

 

[Safeway]

Originally posted by: Special K

Originally posted by: Safeway

Originally posted by: spamsk8r
Believe me, we all want to do both, but it's practically impossible for all but the amazingly gifted (genetically).

Not sure I agree. In about 3 months, I was able to build large amounts of muscle and shed large amounts of fat. I can confirm this with physical therapy scans from The University of Texas kinesiology department. My caloric intake was above BMR, and I was eating ~150g of protein per day. I was doing 1 hour of LISS cardio per day, and about 1.5 hours of weight training.

I went from 220 to 190, with large muscle gains.

What was your bodyfat percentage at 220 and 190? Was it actually measured?

Beginners may be able to do both at the same time. However, good luck getting to < 10bf% while simultaneously increasing your LBM to > 200 lbs. If you can do that, then you definitely have elite genetics.

Also, you said you did this in 3 months. Can we then extrapolate that and say after 12 months you would continue to burn fat and build muscle that entire time?

Every time I read about someone who claims to have gained muscle and lost fat at the same time, it's always for only a short period of time. I have yet to see anyone claim they can do it continuously, year after year, with nonstop progress. If you can do that, then you should start thinking about becoming an IFBB pro

I will consider that, thanks for the idea.

 

[darkxshade]

I agree with Safeway, HIIT is the best way to burn fat and it only takes up about 20 mins of your time and you only need to do it like twice a week though I'd also throw in weight training 3 times a week as well and rest with the 2 days remaining.

 

[Scarpozzi]

The answer to your question is easy. The hard part comes from the execution side.

To lose fat, you simply have to use up more calories than you consume. To gain muscle-mass, you have to essentially TEAR your muscles and have the essential protiens available to rebuild them...bigger. This is why it's important to eat protein when weight training... Most people who diet do 2 things. 1. They cut out fatty foods (often greasy red meat like hamburgers) and sweets (simple and complex sugars) 2. They do more aerobic exercise to burn more calories than they consume.

To gain muscle mass, protein is only the tip of the iceburg. You will need to eat more vegetables to get the iron content in your blood higher. Hemoglobin is the oxygen-transport metalloprotein in the red blood cells. The more iron you have in your blood, the more effective the hemoglobin is in delivering oxygen from your lungs to your muscles.

Eating green leafy vegetables(spinach, greens, brocoli, etc), will also help get you Vitamins A, E, and C which keep your skin healthy and keep your immune system up.

Now you have the vegetables, now add the meat. You can eat lean steak, chicken without the skin, fish, and pork... If you eat ribeyes or steaks of higher fat content, you aren't going to lose much weight. Some cuts of pork have a lot of fat in them, so try to stick to tenderloin cuts only. It's also important to take in small amounts of protein often. If you cook chicken, cook enough to last you 4 or 5 meals and try throwing in some protein for a snack.

Additionally, lower protein meats such as Chicken or Fish are also good options. The key is to stay away from the chicken skin and fried dishes and stick to lean, grilled or broiled alternatives. Cook with olive oil or canola oil only.

There is a differece between the protein found in meet and the protein found in beans or nuts. Meat protein is MUCH more effective at building muscle....but don't be afraid to consume plenty of plant-made proteins as well.

Feel free to keep doing the protein shakes, but mix some jogging in with your weight workouts. Do at least 30 minutes of walking or jogging per day....even on top of your regular workout and keep the protein and green vegetables up. You may see a reduction in your muscle mass as you do the 30 minutes/day, but this is important not only for calorie burning, but overall digestive health.