FYI: Jimmy Carter has won a Nobel Prize

[fluxquantum]

congratulations mr. carter.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Fausto1

Originally posted by: Koba1t

Originally posted by: Fausto1
shinerburke: I'm curious. What specifically in the Cuba speech do you disagree with?

He's a democrat.

I seriously doubt that. Shiner may be conservative, but he's in no way knee-jerk about it. Keep your flamebait to yourself until you actually get to know some of those here.

Maybe not compared to Tominator, AZGamer of NightflyerGTI I know that some conservatives were upset with him going to Cuba because it was seen by the World Community as a slap in the face of GW. It wasn't so much as what he said as it was that he went their in the first place.

 

[shiner]

My problem with the Cuba trip is not what he said, it's that he allowed himself to be played by Castro for PR purposes and that his message never really made it to the Cuban people. So maybe Carter disagrees with Bush on Cuba. Big deal, that's his opinion. I do have a problem with U.S. Presidents, Senators, Congressmen, etc... allowing themselves to be played for PR purposes. It's not quite as bad as Hanoi Jane sitting on a N. Vietnamese AA gun, but it's still a bad move.

 

[Fausto]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Fausto1

Originally posted by: Koba1t

Originally posted by: Fausto1
shinerburke: I'm curious. What specifically in the Cuba speech do you disagree with?

He's a democrat.

I seriously doubt that. Shiner may be conservative, but he's in no way knee-jerk about it. Keep your flamebait to yourself until you actually get to know some of those here.

Maybe not compared to Tominator, AZGamer of NightflyerGTI I know that some conservatives were upset with him going to Cuba because it was seen by the World Community as a slap in the face of GW. It wasn't so much as what he said as it was that he went their in the first place.

True, but if one actually takes the time to read the text of the speech instead of just having kittens because he deigned to visit Cuba, it's clear that he is critical of both countries. Not only does he point out specific issues on both sides, but he essentially scolds both for clinging to an old grudge almost for its own sake. I thought it was a great speech.

 

[Red Dawn]

It's not quite as bad as Hanoi Jane sitting on a N. Vietnamese AA gun, but it's still a bad move.

Not as bad, hell it doesn't even deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence!

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Fausto1

True, but if one actually takes the time to read the text of the speech instead of just having kittens because he deigned to visit Cuba, it's clear that he is critical of both countries. Not only does he point out specific issues on both sides, but he essentially scolds both for clinging to an old grudge almost for its own sake. I thought it was a great speech.

I totally agree with you and with Carters comments in that speech

 

[shiner]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

It's not quite as bad as Hanoi Jane sitting on a N. Vietnamese AA gun, but it's still a bad move.

Not as bad, hell it doesn't even deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence!

I didn't mean it in the sense that Carter was being a traitor like Hanoi Jane, I just meant that it was a bad PR move. Much like her sitting on the AA gun or going to view the prisoners at the Hanoi Hilton. I would dearly love to lock her in a room with John McCain for an hour.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: shinerburke

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

It's not quite as bad as Hanoi Jane sitting on a N. Vietnamese AA gun, but it's still a bad move.

Not as bad, hell it doesn't even deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence!

I didn't mean it in the sense that Carter was being a traitor like Hanoi Jane, I just meant that it was a bad PR move. Much like her sitting on the AA gun or going to view the prisoners at the Hanoi Hilton. I would dearly love to lock her in a room with John McCain for an hour.

I've heard that she has since expressed regret and remorse for her actions. That doesn't forgive what she did but it does say show that she at least has the sense to realize what she did was despicable.

 

[Fausto]

Originally posted by: shinerburke
My problem with the Cuba trip is not what he said, it's that he allowed himself to be played by Castro for PR purposes and that his message never really made it to the Cuban people. So maybe Carter disagrees with Bush on Cuba. Big deal, that's his opinion. I do have a problem with U.S. Presidents, Senators, Congressmen, etc... allowing themselves to be played for PR purposes. It's not quite as bad as Hanoi Jane sitting on a N. Vietnamese AA gun, but it's still a bad move.

While it's true that the Cuban PR people were all over Carter during his visit, I don't know if I'd go so far as to say he was "played" by Castro. Sure, they're going to shape and color the coverage as much as possible to portray Cuba in a favorable light, but at the same time his speech was broadcast live and was not censored to the best of my knowledge. Unprecedented for as high-profile a person as Carter, especially given the government-critical content of the speech. They couldn't even fiddle with the "translation" since it was delivered in spanish (clever on several levels if you think about it).

All in all, I think he of all people was the guy to travel there and deliver the speech. He carries the weight of being a former president (imagine the same speech given by some disenchanted Hollywood moron....a Baldwin perhaps

) and is certainly savvy enough to hold his own in the face of a not-far-removed-from-the-cold-war PR machine. US-Cuba relations have essentially degraded into a pissing match IMO, and if he's willing to potentially tarnish his image in the eyes of some in order to get the dialogue ball rolling, more power to him. Jane Fonda did a huge disservice to american servicemen in Vietnam because she really didn't know WTF she was talking about, whereas I think Carter is well aware of the time, so to speak.

 

[shiner]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

I've heard that she has since expressed regret and remorse for her actions. That doesn't forgive what she did but it does say show that she at least has the sense to realize what she did was despicable.

A guy I work with, who was a USMC sniper in Vietnam, has a bumper sticker that pretty much sums it up. It says "I'll forgive Hanoi Jane when the Jews forgive Hitler."

 

[ElFenix]

i dunno... i disagree with the embargo, i think it props castro up, but i'm not going to go to cuba to proclaim that...

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: shinerburke

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

I've heard that she has since expressed regret and remorse for her actions. That doesn't forgive what she did but it does say show that she at least has the sense to realize what she did was despicable.

A guy I work with, who was a USMC sniper in Vietnam, has a bumper sticker that pretty much sums it up. It says "I'll forgive Hanoi Jane when the Jews forgive Hitler."

Who can blame him? Then again I think Nixon and LBJ were even a bigger POS than her for their actions regarding that war.

 

[shiner]

I would agree with you 100% on LBJ. That man was an egotistical fool who meddled in the war and wouldn't let the military run it the way it wanted. Hell he hand picked bombing targets based on what he felt like needed to be bombed, not what actually needed to be bombed. I had a professor in college that worked in the Johnson White House and he had some great stories about what a whack job LBJ was. Nixon I think got in the game too late to really make much of a difference, things were already so f'd up I don't think anyone could have reversed the outcome of that conflict unless they were willing to turn the military loose and let them do their job the way they saw fit.

 

[roncarter]

JIMMY IS COOL!!!! he rocks

 

[Red Dawn]

I had a professor in college that worked in the Johnson White House and he had some great stories about what a whack job LBJ was.

Uh.. look under whack Job in the Dictionary and you will see a picture of Nixon.

 

[shiner]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

I had a professor in college that worked in the Johnson White House and he had some great stories about what a whack job LBJ was.

Uh.. look under whack Job in the Dictionary and you will see a picture of Nixon.

Yeah but Nixon was a different kind fo whack job.

LBJ = Classic Type A controlling whack job

Nixon = Paranoid stoner type whack job. Nobody can be that paranoid naturally, he had to be puffin the herb.

 

[Red Dawn]

Nixon = Paranoid stoner type whack job. Nobody can be that paranoid naturally, he had to be puffin the herb.

No, Methamphetimines and Booze.

 

[308nato]

Ahhh. Alfred Nobel. The man who gave us dynamite and spent a great portion of his life to perfecting explosives for war. Still at it and top notch as well.

The Nobel Prize was his last will and testament in trying to ease his troubled mind over what he had created. It isn't worth the spit I could hit it with. I find it a bit hypocritical that Dynamit_Nobel is glad to sell the US military machine (and many other countries/groups)its products but whines about the fact we might use them. Typical European crap.

And Jimmy Carter. Ha. I was unfortunate enough to be in the military on his watch. What a pathetic time that was. We were ready to go during the whole hostage crisis/Khomeini fiasco. Sadly, he left us at home (except for those left at a little sand dune called "Desert One"). You can thank JC for the Iran that funds and trains your top notch tango's.

The fact that he hasn't told them to shove Alfred's little award up there collective asses yet supports what I already think about the wimpy little turd. He isn't smart enough to see he won the booby prize not because they wanted to give it to him but because they wanted to shove it in GW's face.

JC should go do something useful like put on his straw hat and monitor an election in Florida or something.

 

[Red Dawn]

You can thank JC for the Iran that funds and trains your top notch tango's.

Bullsh!t. Wasn't it Reagan who traded arms with those bastards to fund the Nun Rapers called the Contras?

 

[glenn1]

Jimmy Carter was exactly the kind of President that we always say we want... honest and principled (pretty much to a fault). Look how far it got him when he ran against Reagan. I agree however that he has done much better since leaving office than he did inside it, he never "grew into" the position like other men have.

I do think he deserves the award for the work he's done.... he's sometimes off-base with his opinions and positions, but i know for 100% certain that he honestly believes them, and i give him credit for standing up for what he believes. Hopefully he's already accepted the prize and the recognition that goes with it, and now he can make America proud once he hears about the "kick in the leg" comment by tearing the Nobel committee a new one. That way we get to have it both ways... he gets the recognition he deserves, and can still give the committee the good swift kick in the head it needs.

 

[308nato]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

You can thank JC for the Iran that funds and trains your top notch tango's.

Bullsh!t. Wasn't it Reagan who traded arms with those bastards to fund the Nun Rapers called the Contras?

If we would have went and stomped their asses into the dunes when we should have Ollie would have never had a chance to be a radio personality and the fundamentalist islamic types would have taken one in the groin that would have been hard to recover from.

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: glenn1

Hopefully he's already accepted the prize and the recognition that goes with it, and now he can make America proud once he hears about the "kick in the leg" comment by tearing the Nobel committee a new one. That way we get to have it both ways... he gets the recognition he deserves, and can still give the committee the good swift kick in the head it needs.

Dont hold your breath.

 

[shiner]

I almost forgot...

[Homer Simpson]Scooby Doo can do, but Jimmy Carter is smarter.[/Homer Simpson]

 

[Flaredair]

Way to go JC