Futurecasting. How will the Social Security problem be solved?

[techs]

I figure that the people on SS will be a voting block similiar to the anti-abortion voting block we have now. A very high percentage will vote against any candidate that advocates lowering SS benefits and for any candidate that advocates keeping them untouched.
This block will be far larger than todays anti-abortion block. While the lowest worker to retired person will be 2.5 working to 1 retired, the voting block will include all those within about 10 years of retirement. These people will have paid in all their life and will never vote for a candidate who was advocating cutting SS.
While this one issue, SS, will not give any candidate a majority this voting bloc will completely overwhelm any candidate who doesn't support keeping SS.
If current trends continue, in 20 years, only about 20 percent of working Americans will have health care. I see the SS recipients and the 80 percent of people without health insurance joing forces to make an unbeatable coalition.
AND even more importantly as the middle class shrinks and even the remaining middle class become completely unable to save for retirement they too will joing the SS voting block.
What will be cut to pay for this? Defense will be gutted. In fact the US may very well sell off major weapons systems to other countries. Taxes in the US will be very high. The US will end all its military committments around the world. We will hide behind our nucler deterrrent.

Thats what I think will happen.
How do you think the SS problem will be handled?

 

[Czar]

rise the retirement age

 

[BriGy86]

i can tell you how it SHOULD be handled...

take the total amount paid in by each person, and send it back to them, SS is a joke now, and by the time i retire it wont even be there for me to use, so i'll be paying in all my life with no return

as for all the people all ready on it, it wont really matter since they will get it in one lump sum rather than spread out across many years

if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

let me ask this, who here is IN FAVOR of SS and why?

 

[Thump553]

--Raising retirement age, in a disguised manner like is being done now (instead of qualifying for full benefits at age 65, it will be age 69, 70, etc. depending on your age at the time of the new bill)

--reducing benefits by increasing taxation of them, cutting back on CPI adjustments

--possibly disqualifying certain high income people from receiving SS benefits (unlikely to be a clear provision, more likely to be done through taxation of benefits).

--and the most likely solution-voodoo economics. Congress and the White House will pla games with the numbers as it suits them.

Frankly, in twenty years the SS problem, although a biggie, will be dwarfed by other problems now in the gestation stage-like the replacement of the dollar as the de facto world currency, loss of American hegemony, the effects of years of prolifigate spending finally coming home to roost, fossil fuel shortages, an ineffective and outrageously expensive health care system, etc. Odds are several of Bush's wars will still be going on then too.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: BriGy86
if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

Do you think Americans would let the ederly live on the streets? It would cost us one way or the other.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: BriGy86
i can tell you how it SHOULD be handled...

take the total amount paid in by each person, and send it back to them, SS is a joke now, and by the time i retire it wont even be there for me to use, so i'll be paying in all my life with no return

as for all the people all ready on it, it wont really matter since they will get it in one lump sum rather than spread out across many years

if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

let me ask this, who here is IN FAVOR of SS and why?

SS is a joke now, and by the time i retire it wont even be there for me to use, so i'll be paying in all my life with no return
So you disagree that the SS voting block will allow SS to be ended? I wonder how you figure this?

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: techs

Originally posted by: BriGy86
i can tell you how it SHOULD be handled...

take the total amount paid in by each person, and send it back to them, SS is a joke now, and by the time i retire it wont even be there for me to use, so i'll be paying in all my life with no return

as for all the people all ready on it, it wont really matter since they will get it in one lump sum rather than spread out across many years

if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

let me ask this, who here is IN FAVOR of SS and why?

SS is a joke now, and by the time i retire it wont even be there for me to use, so i'll be paying in all my life with no return
So you disagree that the SS voting block will allow SS to be ended? I wonder how you figure this?

You'll still be paying something, you'll just not be promised any return.

 

[zendari]

Crash and Burn

 

[Genx87]

The best solution is to turn it into the thrift program that federal employee's have access to.

Realistically since we are all lemmings and shat ourselves when the promises of poverty wages are taken away we will end up running ourselves into unbelievable debt and crush our economy.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: BriGy86
SS is a joke now, and by the time i retire it wont even be there for me to use, so i'll be paying in all my life with no return

People have been saying that for 60 years. They were wrong then, they were wrong 30 years ago. Why would they suddenly be correct now?

let me ask this, who here is IN FAVOR of SS and why?

I'm in favor of having everyone who worked hard during their life to have the ability to maintain a life as long as they choose to live. Sure, they won't be wealthy, but they can buy food and pay their heating bills with SS. What if you didn't work? Well screw you then, no mooching off of society. Hmm, that is exactly what SS does. So what if SS only matches inflation? Who cares. If you want a great investment the government gives you many tax advantages to invest in IRAs. Need more money? You can invest on your own throughout your life. SS doesn't prevent any of this.

 

[puffff]

Originally posted by: BriGy86
i can tell you how it SHOULD be handled...

take the total amount paid in by each person, and send it back to them, SS is a joke now, and by the time i retire it wont even be there for me to use, so i'll be paying in all my life with no return

as for all the people all ready on it, it wont really matter since they will get it in one lump sum rather than spread out across many years

if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

let me ask this, who here is IN FAVOR of SS and why?

SS in some form or another is needed, because the practice of the family taking care of the elderly is not widespread in this country. A person may save their entire life, retire, end up living longer than they expected, and find their nest egg wasn't big enough. That could happen to millions of people, as there's no way of accurately predicting how long we'll live.

The ideal solution for all this is a change of culture. The younger generation needs to welcome the older into their own homes instead of sending them to retirement homes. When the retired can fall back on and count on family for stability instead of relying on a check from Uncle Sam, that's when we can think about scrapping SS.

 

[EatSpam]

Originally posted by: zendari
Crash and Burn

Then your glorious Ayn Randian paradise will emerge! :thumbsup:

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: puffff

Originally posted by: BriGy86
i can tell you how it SHOULD be handled...

take the total amount paid in by each person, and send it back to them, SS is a joke now, and by the time i retire it wont even be there for me to use, so i'll be paying in all my life with no return

as for all the people all ready on it, it wont really matter since they will get it in one lump sum rather than spread out across many years

if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

let me ask this, who here is IN FAVOR of SS and why?

SS in some form or another is needed, because the practice of the family taking care of the elderly is not widespread in this country. A person may save their entire life, retire, end up living longer than they expected, and find their nest egg wasn't big enough. That could happen to millions of people, as there's no way of accurately predicting how long we'll live.

The ideal solution for all this is a change of culture. The younger generation needs to welcome the older into their own homes instead of sending them to retirement homes. When the retired can fall back on and count on family for stability instead of relying on a check from Uncle Sam, that's when we can think about scrapping SS.

Qualify them for another social program called Welfare.

 

[Genx87]

People have been saying that for 60 years. They were wrong then, they were wrong 30 years ago. Why would they suddenly be correct now?

Demographics

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

Originally posted by: Genx87
The best solution is to turn it into the thrift program that federal employee's have access to.

Realistically since we are all lemmings and shat ourselves when the promises of poverty wages are taken away we will end up running ourselves into unbelievable debt and crush our economy.

We've already got proponents of that option running the country.

 

[zephyrprime]

The government has changed inflation reporting so that obligations to SS have already fallen a lot. Also, as I have to point out in every SS thread, the SS age has already been raised for future generations. Retirement is set at 67 1/2 years of age for people of my age.

The government will have to pay out less real SS funds. Without a lot of young workers, there's just no other way.

 

[catnap1972]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: BriGy86
if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

Do you think Americans would let the elderly live on the streets?

Of course not--their plan is to line them up and shoot them once they turn 65

 

[BaliBabyDoc]

At some point . . . in the distant future . . . a leader (preferably leaders) will tell the truth.

We cannot continue to live beyond our means . . . and the means of our children . . . and the means of our grandchildren.

Missile defense . . . gone.
A ring of satellites reading newspapers in Iran . . . gone.
Drug benefit in Medicare . . . gone.
Cost of living adjustment in Social Security . . . gone.
Tax policy skewed in favor of the wealthy . . . long gone.

 

[blackllotus]

Originally posted by: BriGy86
if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

I'm still wondering how you can save up any money earning 20k a year. Enlighten me (note the precondition of no extra spending money).

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: blackllotus

Originally posted by: BriGy86
if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

I'm still wondering how you can save up any money earning 20k a year. Enlighten me (note the precondition of no extra spending money).

Live at your means, dont live the lifestyle of a 40K a year person on a 20K a year salary.

 

[BriGy86]

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: blackllotus

Originally posted by: BriGy86
if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

I'm still wondering how you can save up any money earning 20k a year. Enlighten me (note the precondition of no extra spending money).

Live at your means, dont live the lifestyle of a 40K a year person on a 20K a year salary.

or (like said above) use another system called welfare if you genuinely need it

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: BriGy86

Originally posted by: Genx87

Originally posted by: blackllotus

Originally posted by: BriGy86
if people can't save there own damn money and think of the future they deserve what's comming to them

I'm still wondering how you can save up any money earning 20k a year. Enlighten me (note the precondition of no extra spending money).

Live at your means, dont live the lifestyle of a 40K a year person on a 20K a year salary.

or (like said above) use another system called welfare if you genuinely need it

If they arent going to push us onto the Thrift program they need to open up a means test to qualify for help. These blanket social programs never work in the long run because a blanket system doesnt work in a society that has many layers.

 

[Aisengard]

Easy. Raise taxes a fraction of a percent. BAM! SS safe for another 60 years.

Seriously, SS is one of the most successful government collection agencies. IT MAKES A PROFIT! There is no SS problem. The real problem is health insurance, and Medicare.

The SS 'problem' is one of the most overblown things in this country. Leave it alone. There are plenty of other, much more important things to spend political capital on. Too bad Bush thought his eked out 2% margin was a mandate.

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: Czar
rise the retirement age

Thats a solution that requires change. Americans don't want change. They want fairy dust magic.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Aisengard
Easy. Raise taxes a fraction of a percent. BAM! SS safe for another 60 years.

Seriously, SS is one of the most successful government collection agencies. IT MAKES A PROFIT! There is no SS problem. The real problem is health insurance, and Medicare.

The SS 'problem' is one of the most overblown things in this country. Leave it alone. There are plenty of other, much more important things to spend political capital on. Too bad Bush thought his eked out 2% margin was a mandate.

Because of demographics which arent in our favor starting right about now.
I would suggest looking at the SS trustee estimates for 2040, a 1 trillion dollar SS deficit. Where does the money needed to make this up come from?

The general fund! You think our deficits are crazy now, wait until we have to drag that anchor along.