Friend just go an MIP

[BlancoNino]

So my friend just got an MIP at age 17. The police showed up at her own house while her parents were out of town and gave her an MIP.

They gave her 30 hours of community service and she loses her license for ONE WHOLE YEAR!!!

Now, if you're a minor and you get a DUI...you lose your license for 90 days. Can anyone shed some light onto why the license suspension is more for an MIP than a minor getting a DUI?

MIP = Minor in Posession (which is also written up for minors who have consumed alcohol).

 

[MadRat]

I'd argue the point the MiP had nothing to do with driving and the punishment is unnecessarily harsh.

 

[ebaycj]

why did the police show up? was she throwing a party?

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: MadRat
I'd argue the point the MiP had nothing to do with driving and the punishment is unnecessarily harsh.

Lots of states do that actually, I've always thought it was one of our dumber laws. MIP has got to be about the least harmful offense ever. But the nanny staters really feel the need to throw to book at kids who have a few beers and don't ask me why. I'm 100% positive that every single tightass that supported that law drank underage.

That being said, unless you are an idiot, you aren't going to get an MIP in your own house...or anywhere else really for that matter. I drank when I was under 21 all the time, and I NEVER got in trouble for it. You know the secret? When you are breaking that law, don't draw attention to yourself. Shocking, I know, but it works.

 

[HombrePequeno]

I believe you lose your license until you are 21 if you get a DUI as a minor. I'm not completely sure on that one though.

The overwhelming majority of police officers won't MIP someone unless they are being a complete dumbass. Trust me on that one, I live in the UW greek system where the police can walk down the street on almost any night and MIP half the people they see. They don't because unless you're being a complete arsehole, they don't want to deal with the paperwork.

Edit: Looking at the law, it turns out I'm wrong. A minor getting a DUI does get their license revoked for 90 days. I would assume they can also give you a MIP though considering you are possessing it.

 

[Forsythe]

The fact you can't drink untill you're 21 in some states is outright stupid. The fact that 16yo's can get a drivers license somewhere is even worse.

 

[Tab]

Rainsford is correct. A lot of conservative states have absolutely ridiculous laws when it comes to drunk driving, minors and other illicit activates.

Example, lets say you happen to get cought smoking pot in california. Not a big deal, you show up to court and get a fine less than $100. If you don't get cought for a certain amount of time, your record is cleared.

Now, in other more conservative states they'll probably arrest you on the spot. You could spend a little time in jail. You'll probably get at least a $300 fine, not to mention you'll need to take some drug re-education class which well probably run you about $50. You'll have to pay for various drug tests which is another $50. If you don't get cought for a couple years, they'll clean you record.

There are some other strange laws which relate to being a minor and alcholol. If you are cought driving, but you've been drinking but aren't legally intoxicated (less than .01 or less than .08) you still get a ticket for drunk driving and a minor.

 

[MadRat]

In my state of Nebraska its .020 for minors when it comes to the DUI law. Absolutely stupid.

Alot of good kids have got rejected from the military for their .02 DUI's.

 

[judasmachine]

She shouldn't have been in possession of a banned substance. Immoral, despicable, and intolerable!

Seriously though, a judge has quite a bit of leeway in sentencing. I'd contact one of those cheapo lawyers who deal with DUI, Traffic Tickets, and such. You may or may not have a case, but it would be worth a shot.

Oh and if she gave any lip to the police, or acted dumb or disrespectful in court, that is most likely why she was given the harsher sentence. The law isn't nice to minors.

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: MadRat
In my state of Nebraska its .020 for minors when it comes to the DUI law. Absolutely stupid.

Alot of good kids have got rejected from the military for their .02 DUI's.

Heh, not any more I bet... Hell, even recently something is up with our local recruiters.... Apparently, some guy got in the marines but hadn't exactly finished high school...

 

[Rastus]

A minor getting a DUI usually gets a MIP also in some states. My son did.

 

[Rastus]

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: MadRat
In my state of Nebraska its .020 for minors when it comes to the DUI law. Absolutely stupid.

Alot of good kids have got rejected from the military for their .02 DUI's.

Heh, not any more I bet... Hell, even recently something is up with our local recruiters.... Apparently, some guy got in the marines but hadn't exactly finished high school...

A friend's son got a DUI after getting accepted into the Air Force. He had to go into the Marines instead. The Marine recruiter made the DUI go away also before he went to court. This happened a couple months ago.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Forsythe
The fact you can't drink untill you're 21 in some states is outright stupid. The fact that 16yo's can get a drivers license somewhere is even worse.

isn't 16 a little late to be getting your liscence? i got mine when i was 14 i think

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Tab
Rainsford is correct. A lot of conservative states have absolutely ridiculous laws when it comes to drunk driving, minors and other illicit activates.

In the town i go to school, a noise violation has a $300 minimum mandatory, and the charge can never be erased from your record. With the law, everyone who lives in the place gets a violation, regardless if they were the ones making the noise or if they were across the state at the time. The standard for a violation is so low, that if I yell across my front lawn at someone, i can be cited. While they don't enforce it to that degree, they do definately push the bounds of what one considers reasonable. The worst thing is that this law, a noise ordanance, has kept people from getting jobs. (a good portion of the students at my school study Aviation wanting to be pilots, and you can't have ANYTHING on your record to get a job with an airline) the really pathetic thing is that locally the penalty for a noise violation is worse than a mip or mic, public intoxication, possession, or assault, and in fact more comparable with a dui than those crimes in term of penalties.

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: MadRat
In my state of Nebraska its .020 for minors when it comes to the DUI law. Absolutely stupid.

Alot of good kids have got rejected from the military for their .02 DUI's.

Heh, not any more I bet... Hell, even recently something is up with our local recruiters.... Apparently, some guy got in the marines but hadn't exactly finished high school...

you can enlist at 17.

 

[BoomerD]

http://www.clallam.net/JuvenileServices/html/juvi_mip.htm

http://www.dol.wa.gov/news/07mip03.htm
"For the juvenile's first conviction, the DOL was required to revoke the juvenile's driving privilege for one year, or until the juvenile reached 17, whichever period was longer. For second or subsequent convictions, the DOL was required to revoke the juvenile's driving privilege for two years or until the juvenile reached 18, whichever period was longer. Each conviction resulted in a separate period of revocation, and periods of revocation ran consecutively. "

http://www.dol.wa.gov/ds/minor.htm

http://www.lawforwa.org/resources.html?iso1%3Aint=13&iso2%3Aint=2489

Not sure how or why the cops found out that your friend was in violation, but they acted per the state law...

http://www.maddwashington.org/kitsap/madd-01.htm
Youth. Any person under the age of 21 who has a blood alcohol concentration of .02% or higher and drives will lose their license. This will he done administratively and will be swift and sure. For a first offense, the license will be suspended for 90 days. A second offense will result in a one year revocation or until age 21, whichever is longest. In addition, drivers under 21 will still be subject to the DUI law and the Minor In Possession law."
"

 

[Tab]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Tab

Originally posted by: MadRat
In my state of Nebraska its .020 for minors when it comes to the DUI law. Absolutely stupid.

Alot of good kids have got rejected from the military for their .02 DUI's.

Heh, not any more I bet... Hell, even recently something is up with our local recruiters.... Apparently, some guy got in the marines but hadn't exactly finished high school...

you can enlist at 17.

You need to have a GED or High School Dipolma

 

[Thump553]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: MadRat
I'd argue the point the MiP had nothing to do with driving and the punishment is unnecessarily harsh.

Lots of states do that actually, I've always thought it was one of our dumber laws. MIP has got to be about the least harmful offense ever. But the nanny staters really feel the need to throw to book at kids who have a few beers and don't ask me why. I'm 100% positive that every single tightass that supported that law drank underage.
. . .

There is something about youth that blesses everyone with the perception that they are immortal, that if they really screw up they can get up, dust themselves off, hit the reset button and continue on their merry way.

It's no big surprise that many people well past their teen years did all sorts of dumb things themselves, and it's only through the grace of God or pure dumb luck that they survived (hopefully with no permanent results).

A substantial loss of driving privileges is an extremely effective punishment to teenagers and costs society in general very little (unlike incarceration). Maybe a few of your friend's friends will wize up because of what happened to her. It's better than wizing up at her funeral.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Thump553

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: MadRat
I'd argue the point the MiP had nothing to do with driving and the punishment is unnecessarily harsh.

Lots of states do that actually, I've always thought it was one of our dumber laws. MIP has got to be about the least harmful offense ever. But the nanny staters really feel the need to throw to book at kids who have a few beers and don't ask me why. I'm 100% positive that every single tightass that supported that law drank underage.
. . .

There is something about youth that blesses everyone with the perception that they are immortal, that if they really screw up they can get up, dust themselves off, hit the reset button and continue on their merry way.

It's no big surprise that many people well past their teen years did all sorts of dumb things themselves, and it's only through the grace of God or pure dumb luck that they survived (hopefully with no permanent results).

A substantial loss of driving privileges is an extremely effective punishment to teenagers and costs society in general very little (unlike incarceration). Maybe a few of your friend's friends will wize up because of what happened to her. It's better than wizing up at her funeral.

I tend to agree that we all did dumb crap when we were teenagers (I certainly did), but I don't think just drinking underage is one of those things. Is having a beer at 19 more dangerous than at 21? Maybe binge drinking is more likely underage (although I'd argue you don't remember being 21 that well), but that's not what the law was written for...you can get an MIP for having a few beers, something I would argue isn't going to send you to an early grave.

In any case, you are EXACTLY the type of nanny stater I was talking about. Look at the facts. As you suggest, most people did some dumb stuff as teenagers, but it's not just blind luck that they made it through ok, it's the fact that the stuff isn't really all that dumb, and the very few cases of people dying from alcohol poisoning are blown out of proportion by the safety police. Being a teenager is about making mistakes and LEARNING from those mistakes, but it works whether or not there are stupidly strict outside laws punishing your every wrongdoing.

Looking back through all my friends in high school and college, the ONLY cases I can think of where dumb teenage stuff had a significant negative impact on their lives was when it involved the police enforcing some stupid-ass law. Smoking pot in your own dorm room is hardly what I'd call a life altering decision, unless of course you get arrested, go to jail, and have it on your record for the rest of your life.

I'm all for making laws when real consequences are involved, but with things like MIP, almost all the consequences are artificially introduced by the law, NOT a danger of the behavior itself.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
So my friend just got an MIP at age 17. The police showed up at her own house while her parents were out of town and gave her an MIP.

They gave her 30 hours of community service and she loses her license for ONE WHOLE YEAR!!!

Now, if you're a minor and you get a DUI...you lose your license for 90 days. Can anyone shed some light onto why the license suspension is more for an MIP than a minor getting a DUI?

MIP = Minor in Posession (which is also written up for minors who have consumed alcohol).

You think this girl will like the new U.S. style of Government intrusion of running her life?

I'll add her to the growing list of Revolutionaries.

 

[nutxo]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: BlancoNino
So my friend just got an MIP at age 17. The police showed up at her own house while her parents were out of town and gave her an MIP.

They gave her 30 hours of community service and she loses her license for ONE WHOLE YEAR!!!

Now, if you're a minor and you get a DUI...you lose your license for 90 days. Can anyone shed some light onto why the license suspension is more for an MIP than a minor getting a DUI?

MIP = Minor in Posession (which is also written up for minors who have consumed alcohol).

You think this girl will like the new U.S. style of Government intrusion of running her life?

I'll add her to the growing list of Revolutionaries.

Yeh. The liberals in this state are freaking insane. I really wish they would butt out and let people try to live their lives.

 

[BlancoNino]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Thump553

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: MadRat
I'd argue the point the MiP had nothing to do with driving and the punishment is unnecessarily harsh.

Lots of states do that actually, I've always thought it was one of our dumber laws. MIP has got to be about the least harmful offense ever. But the nanny staters really feel the need to throw to book at kids who have a few beers and don't ask me why. I'm 100% positive that every single tightass that supported that law drank underage.
. . .

There is something about youth that blesses everyone with the perception that they are immortal, that if they really screw up they can get up, dust themselves off, hit the reset button and continue on their merry way.

It's no big surprise that many people well past their teen years did all sorts of dumb things themselves, and it's only through the grace of God or pure dumb luck that they survived (hopefully with no permanent results).

A substantial loss of driving privileges is an extremely effective punishment to teenagers and costs society in general very little (unlike incarceration). Maybe a few of your friend's friends will wize up because of what happened to her. It's better than wizing up at her funeral.

I tend to agree that we all did dumb crap when we were teenagers (I certainly did), but I don't think just drinking underage is one of those things. Is having a beer at 19 more dangerous than at 21? Maybe binge drinking is more likely underage (although I'd argue you don't remember being 21 that well), but that's not what the law was written for...you can get an MIP for having a few beers, something I would argue isn't going to send you to an early grave.

In any case, you are EXACTLY the type of nanny stater I was talking about. Look at the facts. As you suggest, most people did some dumb stuff as teenagers, but it's not just blind luck that they made it through ok, it's the fact that the stuff isn't really all that dumb, and the very few cases of people dying from alcohol poisoning are blown out of proportion by the safety police. Being a teenager is about making mistakes and LEARNING from those mistakes, but it works whether or not there are stupidly strict outside laws punishing your every wrongdoing.

Looking back through all my friends in high school and college, the ONLY cases I can think of where dumb teenage stuff had a significant negative impact on their lives was when it involved the police enforcing some stupid-ass law. Smoking pot in your own dorm room is hardly what I'd call a life altering decision, unless of course you get arrested, go to jail, and have it on your record for the rest of your life.

I'm all for making laws when real consequences are involved, but with things like MIP, almost all the consequences are artificially introduced by the law, NOT a danger of the behavior itself.

I agree 100% about the safety police blowing everything out of proportion.

The girl in this story had the police called on her a while before, and after she had gotten home...she showered, got ready for bed, and started to sleep for a while (probably around an hour to an hour and a half) and then officer showed up and her older brother (who was in charge at the time her parents were gone) let the officer in the house and she fessed up to everything and was really nice to the officer. The officer still wrote her an MIP and she didn't have to go to court. Instead she just had an assement. The assesment was that she was not an alcoholic, was not at risk, and was just a one-time deal. Basically, she scored as well as possible on the assessment. Well, after the assessment and the police report are done, they send it to the DOL...and the DOL decides what can hapeen to her license, if anything at all. They gave her the maximum possible punishment...1 year...along with her 30 hours of community service.

 

[HombrePequeno]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: Forsythe
The fact you can't drink untill you're 21 in some states is outright stupid. The fact that 16yo's can get a drivers license somewhere is even worse.

isn't 16 a little late to be getting your liscence? i got mine when i was 14 i think

I recall in Louisianna you could get your license at 15 but I think they changed that recently to 16. I'm not sure if there are any states left that have it still set under 16.

It's different in Europe though. I know in Germany you have to be 18 to get your license and you have to pay a sh!tload of money for it too (over $1000).

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: BlancoNino

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Thump553

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: MadRat
I'd argue the point the MiP had nothing to do with driving and the punishment is unnecessarily harsh.

Lots of states do that actually, I've always thought it was one of our dumber laws. MIP has got to be about the least harmful offense ever. But the nanny staters really feel the need to throw to book at kids who have a few beers and don't ask me why. I'm 100% positive that every single tightass that supported that law drank underage.
. . .

There is something about youth that blesses everyone with the perception that they are immortal, that if they really screw up they can get up, dust themselves off, hit the reset button and continue on their merry way.

It's no big surprise that many people well past their teen years did all sorts of dumb things themselves, and it's only through the grace of God or pure dumb luck that they survived (hopefully with no permanent results).

A substantial loss of driving privileges is an extremely effective punishment to teenagers and costs society in general very little (unlike incarceration). Maybe a few of your friend's friends will wize up because of what happened to her. It's better than wizing up at her funeral.

I tend to agree that we all did dumb crap when we were teenagers (I certainly did), but I don't think just drinking underage is one of those things. Is having a beer at 19 more dangerous than at 21? Maybe binge drinking is more likely underage (although I'd argue you don't remember being 21 that well), but that's not what the law was written for...you can get an MIP for having a few beers, something I would argue isn't going to send you to an early grave.

In any case, you are EXACTLY the type of nanny stater I was talking about. Look at the facts. As you suggest, most people did some dumb stuff as teenagers, but it's not just blind luck that they made it through ok, it's the fact that the stuff isn't really all that dumb, and the very few cases of people dying from alcohol poisoning are blown out of proportion by the safety police. Being a teenager is about making mistakes and LEARNING from those mistakes, but it works whether or not there are stupidly strict outside laws punishing your every wrongdoing.

Looking back through all my friends in high school and college, the ONLY cases I can think of where dumb teenage stuff had a significant negative impact on their lives was when it involved the police enforcing some stupid-ass law. Smoking pot in your own dorm room is hardly what I'd call a life altering decision, unless of course you get arrested, go to jail, and have it on your record for the rest of your life.

I'm all for making laws when real consequences are involved, but with things like MIP, almost all the consequences are artificially introduced by the law, NOT a danger of the behavior itself.

I agree 100% about the safety police blowing everything out of proportion.

The girl in this story had the police called on her a while before, and after she had gotten home...she showered, got ready for bed, and started to sleep for a while (probably around an hour to an hour and a half) and then officer showed up and her older brother (who was in charge at the time her parents were gone) let the officer in the house and she fessed up to everything and was really nice to the officer. The officer still wrote her an MIP and she didn't have to go to court. Instead she just had an assement. The assesment was that she was not an alcoholic, was not at risk, and was just a one-time deal. Basically, she scored as well as possible on the assessment. Well, after the assessment and the police report are done, they send it to the DOL...and the DOL decides what can hapeen to her license, if anything at all. They gave her the maximum possible punishment...1 year...along with her 30 hours of community service.

Being overly nice to the police hardly ever seems to work to your advantage. It costs you nothing to be polite, of course, but I tend to draw the line at helping them get me in trouble. Even though I have nothing to hide, any police that want to be inside my house better have a warrant in hand.

But I'm still curious, just why did the police get called on your friend? The whole thing sounds rather odd to me.

 

[MadRat]

The cops don't care about anyone except themselves.

The girl should appeal based on coersion of testimony. The whole confession gets thrown out and they have no case.