Go to http://www.mmorpg.com and it will tell you how on the front page. Look for "perfect world beta key". I just got one, looks like an interesting game.
pontifex
Lifer
- Dec 5, 2000
- 43,804
- 46
- 91
Originally posted by: EricMartello
Originally posted by: destrekor
You could also provide some facts that state that you are correct.
Bottom line is, it's extremely tough to judge the potential for the US market considering the culture is vastly different.
Not to mention, the different styles between western and eastern MMOs. Eastern MMOs have a very different play style that most Western folk don't enjoy. NCsoft knows this, and is why they have even stated for their upcoming MMO Aion will be a blend of Eastern meets Western style. I actually look forward to that and hope I can get into the beta for it. NCsoft is really the closest company who can bring the Eastern style to us Westerners, but has to be careful or else it'll just flop.
What I stated are facts, and if you want to verify them then I'm sure you know how to use a search engine.
lulz
Now you're getting to the root of the issue. It's a cultural thing. In the US, people predominantly want to play simple, quick little games that they can get a quick thrill out of and put down after 20 minutes. Most US gamers do not like the idea of putting effort into gaming. Not just through grinding, but also maintaining relationships with other players.
Most gamers prefer the lone-wolf type of play, which is why first person shooters are the predominant game genre in the US, despite the fact that they're all the same. In Asia, you find many, many more roleplaying games and story-driven, which typically take a lot more time to play anyway...a natural progression to a multi-player role-playing game.
There are many people in the US who enjoy spending long hours hunting with their friends in a virtual world...but they are so far dwarfed by the numbers of people who name themselves EYEkeelJ00lolz and run around spraying machinegun fire throughout rooms in situations that are completely improbable that it's not even funny.
You can't have it go both ways. To cater to one crowd is to ignore the other. There are games that try to offer PvP and what not, but the very idea and makeup of a role-playing game dictates that items and character level has some impact on the outcome of a fight. That is in stark contrast to a first-person shooter, where everyone is on the same plane. The two modes of play are indeed mutually exclusive.
To expect that an MMO should cater to a majority of gamers is not just a pipe dream, it's flat out impossible. It cannot happen when the majority of players prefer games that give a fast, cheap thrill over an accomplishment-driven game, whether that accomplishment is in the form of items gathered, quests completed, monsters done, or time spent in a realm war effort. That type of gamer will never fully enjoy an MMORPG in the same way that a true fan of RPGs will never fully enjoy first-person shooter games.
You are right that it is not possible to make one game that pleases everyone, so the developer needs to tune it so it pleases as many gamers as possible...but I don't think that US gamers are averse to games which require character development. The thing is, the developmental process has to be FUN and right now it's just a chore. For example, let's take WoW since it's the most popular...you really cannot utilize the full potential of any class until you hit around level 50 and can max out one talent tree - BUT, don't forget that WoW makes your character's performance largely "gear dependent"...so even when you get the trainable skills after grinding to 50, you can't get good gear until level 60+. The point is that you really can't enjoy the game until you reach a higher level, and prior to that, many people may find it frustrating or just boring.
Another problem with MMOs is the lack of a persistent universe, where what you do (or don't do) matters. Sure, you finish a quest...nothing happens, it's no big deal. Where is the satisfaction in doing anything? Instead of hundreds of easy-to-do quests, maybe there should be 1 or 2 challenging quests per level. Or how about "dynamic" quests that are not exactly the same each time...I dunno...I'm not a game maker, but I think that attracting the "typical US gamer" to MMOs means MMOs are going to have to change their structure. MMO RPGs need to be fun from level 1, not ONLY at the final level.
You're missing the point. For people who truely enjoy MMOs and are not just looking for a quick, cheap thrill, they generally ARE fun from level one. Hell, a lot of times, that's the most fun in the game.
This is what I was talking about with accomplishment-driven games. The point of the game is to get the highest level, max your skills, find the best gear, and complete all of the quests. That's what the core audience of MMORPGs is looking for. If they change that to cater to the "majority of US gamers", they'll be losing their core croud...but, more importantly, their game will no longer be an MMORPG.
Those who do not enjoy RPGs (whether online or not) for what they are, are generally the types who will never enjoy them. For instance, which of the following games did you enjoy or have fun playing: Secret of Mana? Chrono Trigger? the Ultima games? Baldur's Gate/Neverwinter Nights/Icewind Dale games? Final Fantasy 1, 2, 4, 5, 6, Mystic Quest, Adventure? Castle of the Winds? the Elder Scrolls games? Super Mario RPG? Legend of Zelda games before Majora's Mask?
These are a lot of the most well known role playing games ever. They're all accomplishment-driven, feature some aspect of grind, and have rich, entertaining stories. It's from these types of games that MMORPGs get their origins. It's from this group of players that MMORPGs find their core audience.
To make an MMORPG not accomplishment-driven is to make it not an MMORPG. To put everyone on the same plane and not give any means of character advancement, whether that be from items or character levels or skills or whatever, is to forsake the genre. What you would have is no longer an MMORPG.
Now, again, I'm not saying that one type of gaming is better than the other type. Only that they are different and cannot coexist in the same game. It's just not possible to make an MMORPG that caters to the "majority of US gamers" when those gamers prefer a game that's completely the opposite of what an MMORPG is supposed to be.
Certainly, there have been some MMORPGs that have done some things wrong (FFXI was terrible with land movement speeds, DAoC was awefully unbalanced), but even the ones that got it right still would not have been liked by the "typical US gamer". Ultima Online, for instance, before the UO:R patch was about as perfect an MMO as one could want. It was challenging, it was character-driven, it was free-form (no classes), and it combined player skill with character skill levels. It was by far the best MMORPG I ever played, yet it peaked out at about 250K subscribers. It happened early in the life of MMOs, but still. Typical US gamers simply do not look for the same elements in a game that the core audience of an MMORPG looks for, and thus the two cannot coexist.
Note: I do not currently play WoW, but I have played nearly every major market MMORPG out there starting with Ultima Online (missed Meridian 59, unfortunately) and some of the smaller ones. Also, I dislike first-person shooters so much that I cannot make it out of the first level of Half Life before I exit the game in disgust.
This is what I was talking about with accomplishment-driven games. The point of the game is to get the highest level, max your skills, find the best gear, and complete all of the quests. That's what the core audience of MMORPGs is looking for. If they change that to cater to the "majority of US gamers", they'll be losing their core croud...but, more importantly, their game will no longer be an MMORPG.
Those who do not enjoy RPGs (whether online or not) for what they are, are generally the types who will never enjoy them. For instance, which of the following games did you enjoy or have fun playing: Secret of Mana? Chrono Trigger? the Ultima games? Baldur's Gate/Neverwinter Nights/Icewind Dale games? Final Fantasy 1, 2, 4, 5, 6, Mystic Quest, Adventure? Castle of the Winds? the Elder Scrolls games? Super Mario RPG? Legend of Zelda games before Majora's Mask?
These are a lot of the most well known role playing games ever. They're all accomplishment-driven, feature some aspect of grind, and have rich, entertaining stories. It's from these types of games that MMORPGs get their origins. It's from this group of players that MMORPGs find their core audience.
To make an MMORPG not accomplishment-driven is to make it not an MMORPG. To put everyone on the same plane and not give any means of character advancement, whether that be from items or character levels or skills or whatever, is to forsake the genre. What you would have is no longer an MMORPG.
Now, again, I'm not saying that one type of gaming is better than the other type. Only that they are different and cannot coexist in the same game. It's just not possible to make an MMORPG that caters to the "majority of US gamers" when those gamers prefer a game that's completely the opposite of what an MMORPG is supposed to be.
Certainly, there have been some MMORPGs that have done some things wrong (FFXI was terrible with land movement speeds, DAoC was awefully unbalanced), but even the ones that got it right still would not have been liked by the "typical US gamer". Ultima Online, for instance, before the UO:R patch was about as perfect an MMO as one could want. It was challenging, it was character-driven, it was free-form (no classes), and it combined player skill with character skill levels. It was by far the best MMORPG I ever played, yet it peaked out at about 250K subscribers. It happened early in the life of MMOs, but still. Typical US gamers simply do not look for the same elements in a game that the core audience of an MMORPG looks for, and thus the two cannot coexist.
Note: I do not currently play WoW, but I have played nearly every major market MMORPG out there starting with Ultima Online (missed Meridian 59, unfortunately) and some of the smaller ones. Also, I dislike first-person shooters so much that I cannot make it out of the first level of Half Life before I exit the game in disgust.
ViviTheMage
Lifer
I wish there was a REALLY hard mmo out there...it took days/weeks of playtime to get certain gear, not just grinding BGs or grinding 10 games in arenas to get the best set in the game....
I was not really disagreeing with you. The basic point of any RPG is to develop your character - but I do think there are ways of doing that which are more fun than monster grinding on repetitive quests. The reason classic RPGs like Zelda, FF and Chrono Trigger are fun to play is that everything is tied into the story. IMO Chrono Trigger is THE best RPG ever made for any system, period...some say it was too easy, but nobody will say it was not fun. Sure, in CT the basic grind on monsters to level element was there, but that was not the main focus of the game - it was something you did along the way to the greater goal, which was moving the story forward.
There is somewhat of a paradox between RPGs and MMORPGs when it comes to storytelling - because all good stories have an end, with MMOs, it's not possible to "end" the story. Solution? Let the story unfold as the players play the game...and when one story ends, another can begin.
I am an avid WoW player, but my favorite MMO has always been Earth & Beyond -given the choice between elves and spaceships, I'll go with the latter.
There are, you just aren't/haven't played them. Everquest is still much more difficult than WoW. FFXI almost requires you to know people or to make friends quickly. FFXI being the more difficult of the two by far.
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