Free Hardware?

[sharq]

According to a few big wigs at MS (Bill Gates) and Sun (President and COO), computer hardware will be free in the future. Sun is saying that this will happen as soon as 2005. They say that you will have to pay for software as a service/subscription. What do you all think?
I think hurray for Linux, and I hope it doesn't fall into a "pay as you go" software.

 

[jagec]

lol, and you thought software piracy was bad NOW.

Maybe cheapy hardware (or servers where they can make SURE you don't pirate), but you'll have to pay for the good stuff.

 

[sharq]

I agree with you there jagec, if people had to pay per year to use windows, we are very likely to see more cracks and pirated software. And they will probably become more easily available even.
As for the cost of hardware, how cheap would it get? I would think a computer's price is not going to drop below the $200 mark. I could be wrong, but free? No, I don't see that happening.
Unless, price of software tripled or quadrupled to include the price of hardware. But still, if hardware was free, then chances of us getting newer and better hardware every 6 months is also slim, as the profit incentive would not be there as much as it is now. Just my 2 cents

 

[drag]

It's BS.

Complete BS. Pure and simple.

What they realy mean is that you pay for a computer and it includes both software and hardware.

You stop paying for the software and the software expires and the hardware is useless.

Think "DRM" and crap like that.

The hardware would become a vehicle to run the OS they sell you and without that subscription the hardware will be useless.

So they say your hardware is "free", not because it realy is free but more then likely it will simply be useless, so they won't include it's portion of the cost in the bill.

People pay for software anyway because they want service subscriptions. They need experts on call to answer questions and solve problems, with hardware and software. Not everybody has good enough experts or can't afford experts in-house so they depend on big companies for their help.

So instead of buying the computer + the software + service subscription, in your bill they will only have the charge for the service subscription and call it "software".

Of course the without the subscription, the software breaks, and without the software the hardware is useless.

But they are hoping the word "free" and "hardware" is shocking enough will get enough hype going that people fall for the marketspeak.

Personally I'd rather pay for the hardware once and own it forever. The software that I use is Free in both money and spirit. I pay for it sometimes, but only because I want to, not because I have to.

People who pay for useless hardware or otherwise volenteer for vendor lock-in are morons.

 

[acejj26]

sounds like they're trying to employ the cell phone business model.....give away the phone, or incredibly discount it, but lock someone into a long term contract for the service that hardware uses. that will never fly with computers because they can be used for so many things. you can develop applications, play games, render videos, run simulations, play music, etc. with a phone, you use one main service which one company charges you for. who would get licensing fees for computer hardware in the future when there are so many uses for a computer? what if i only run open source software? what happens if i want to upgrade? can i sell the hardware in the future when my license expires? i can't see any way this business model can work.

 

[Stunt]

hahaha....tell gates that he has no say over hardware's price...if he wants to "sell" his product for free...i encourage him...
Leave it to MS to think up stuff like that...Software is probably cheaper to make than hardware...im guessing on that...fabs/materials/tweaking.
There are like 10 person video game companies...no?

 

[Homerboy]

Originally posted by: Stunt
hahaha....tell gates that he has no say over hardware's price...if he wants to "sell" his product for free...i encourage him...
Leave it to MS to think up stuff like that...Software is probably cheaper to make than hardware...im guessing on that...fabs/materials/tweaking.
There are like 10 person video game companies...no?

get off the M$ bashing bandwagon... read the article Sun said it too

 

[drag]

Originally posted by: Stunt
hahaha....tell gates that he has no say over hardware's price...if he wants to "sell" his product for free...i encourage him...
Leave it to MS to think up stuff like that...Software is probably cheaper to make than hardware...im guessing on that...fabs/materials/tweaking.
There are like 10 person video game companies...no?

Hell ya. Software is trivially easy (on a individual program by program basis) to make compared to hardware.

Software you code it out, try it. If it doesn't work then you edit it and recompile it. If a bug shows up in useage you send a patch and it fixes it right up.

Plus with software you can recreate it over and over and over again. You can have a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy and it will still be one hundred percent if it's done correctly. It only costs to create not to distribute. Except maybe the bandwidth costs.

Practically speaking, except for disk space and/or bandwidth costs, it's costs almost exactly the same to produce 1 copy of a program as it costs to create a hundred thousand copies of that program, or a hundred million copies.

All that gets messed with is electrons and turning random ones and zeros on HD's to a specific pattern of ones and zeros.

Plus if you have access to the code to other programs, then you simply copy what somebody else has already done, and modify it or add to it and you have a better program at a fraction of the cost of creating a entirely new progam.

Now try to do the same for a motherboard or a video card!!!

 

[Stunt]

That's cuz Sun's hardware department is dead...holding on by its fingernails. I'll care when Sun is a hardware leader. Till then i want to hear intel/amd/ibm/samsung/hitachi etc... all the massive hardware companies say they want free hardware...then say i'm an MS basher all you want!
Till then have fun in your dream world of potential free hardware!...

 

[drag]

Originally posted by: Stunt
That's cuz Sun's hardware department is dead...holding on by its fingernails. I'll care when Sun is a hardware leader. Till then i want to hear intel/amd/ibm/samsung/hitachi etc... all the massive hardware companies say they want free hardware...then say i'm an MS basher all you want!
Till then have fun in your dream world of potential free hardware!...

The sad part is that Sun's company is based on free software. They used BSD as teh basis for there software that put them in business in the first place. Unix from the beginning was based on the collaberation of hundreds of different companies and individuals and it was unfortunate that people started suing each other for everything.

If it wasn't for free software (and very expensive hardware), Sun probably wouldn't of existed in the first place!

 

[sharq]

I agree that Sun is hoping to get paid for its software. It's hardware side is almost down the drain now, especially with Intel and AMD producing 64bit cpu's. They are also switching to Linux (I'm not sure as to what extent) but their life depends on providing service/support to their OS.
As for MS, well I'm sure there are a million different ways to point out the negative in that company, so I won't bore anyone.

 

[Maximilian]

Well i dont think hardware will be free, unless we all turn communist and the state gives everyone a free comp or somthing. As for pay as you go software, your right on with linux!! id never user pay & go windows its just a dumb idea.

 

[Corporate Thug]

NO

 

[cronos]

umm...no.

 

[AnitaPeterson]

Originally posted by: acejj26
sounds like they're trying to employ the cell phone business model.....give away the phone, or incredibly discount it, but lock someone into a long term contract for the service that hardware uses. that will never fly with computers because they can be used for so many things. you can develop applications, play games, render videos, run simulations, play music, etc. with a phone, you use one main service which one company charges you for. who would get licensing fees for computer hardware in the future when there are so many uses for a computer? what if i only run open source software? what happens if i want to upgrade? can i sell the hardware in the future when my license expires? i can't see any way this business model can work.

Ahhh...

But what people in the U.S. usually ignore is that in places like Europe, you can actually buy your cellphone, then use a prepaid card from whichever vendor/provider you want, and never have to worry about stupid subscription schemes.

I've said it before and I'lll say it again - ideas that look good in North America but have no chance to be adopted overseas will NEVER take off. I've predicted it with the divx format, it will happen again with things like these.

Actually, Bill Gates has been making these kind of claims for a while now - he really wants everyone to use Windows platforms on any appliances available - as he's becoming less PC-centric than before.

And Sun? Sun was the company that a few years ago - come one, doesn't anyone here have any memory? - was trying to promote the Netmachine - a cheap 'stupid terminal' running web-based applications on a 'pay-per-use' basis. Stupid morons... two thirds of the world lack the necessary infrastructure and economic systems flexible enough to support this.

Again, 'good luck' thumbsdown to both Sun and MS.... Why do you think they recently made peace? They may be trying to get together in such ventures. I hope they'll sink a few billions into this crap, before they realize it's not going to work.

 

[Bovinicus]

Nonsense. Why would someone give away hardware when people are willing to pay for it?

 

[randumb]

Complete crap. They're forgetting that there's a giant FREE software community.

 

[Schadenfroh]

software maybe free, but never hardware

 

[Cerb]

A bunch of crap.
Businesses will get on it once M$ gets their release schedule back on track, as it often does pay to be on the bleeding edge when you're getting new hardware or upgrading.
Home users want to pay for the hardware and be done. With $500 PCs you can actually use (Celeron/Duron), I don't see it becoming free. I can see it coming down to $300 by '06 or '07, but not free.
I can also see small cost payments for those update CDs, given how many people are still on dial-up. Frankly, such thing is a good idea even if costing slightly. $10-$15 for six months of updates puts it about where AV updates are.

When subscriptions have worthwhile uses, like security and driver updates (hint hint), we take them. When was the last time you complained about $30 a year for AV? Right before you got that trojan.

While we're on the subject, you could say that one day, TVs would be free, and you'd just pay for cable. Oh, wait, no, but you'd pay for cable and not get ads. No, no, you pay for cable and get ads, but rgeuylated heavily. No no, we lied, you're paying for the hardware, service, and getting ads where you could have 50% more content instead.

Linux will be a competitor on the desktop. Not the home, but corporate. Still too much crap for home use, but for business use, it's basically here, and needs marketting and trials to get management on the bandwagon. Novell is making insanely big pushes to this as well.

For home use, XP is where it's at. I'm afraid that's basically all there is to it. If your video doesn't work right, you get dropped to anything from 512x384x4* to 800x600x8, and can try again...not dropped to a command line. Simple things like that are hurdles that MUST be dealt with.

* I know 512x384x4 shouldn't exist, but it happened to me once in XP with a bum video card, so don't be saying it doesn't .

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: drag

Originally posted by: Stunt
hahaha....tell gates that he has no say over hardware's price...if he wants to "sell" his product for free...i encourage him...
Leave it to MS to think up stuff like that...Software is probably cheaper to make than hardware...im guessing on that...fabs/materials/tweaking.
There are like 10 person video game companies...no?

Hell ya. Software is trivially easy (on a individual program by program basis) to make compared to hardware.

Software you code it out, try it. If it doesn't work then you edit it and recompile it. If a bug shows up in useage you send a patch and it fixes it right up.

Plus with software you can recreate it over and over and over again. You can have a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy and it will still be one hundred percent if it's done correctly. It only costs to create not to distribute. Except maybe the bandwidth costs.

Practically speaking, except for disk space and/or bandwidth costs, it's costs almost exactly the same to produce 1 copy of a program as it costs to create a hundred thousand copies of that program, or a hundred million copies.

All that gets messed with is electrons and turning random ones and zeros on HD's to a specific pattern of ones and zeros.

Plus if you have access to the code to other programs, then you simply copy what somebody else has already done, and modify it or add to it and you have a better program at a fraction of the cost of creating a entirely new progam.

Now try to do the same for a motherboard or a video card!!!

...or even with software. Windows XP is how old and still being updated? Office? Games? Maintenance costs $. Not as simple as "this chip costs $30, the board costs $50, memory $80, and we need to makes 20%," but hardly cheap.

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: randumb
Complete crap. They're forgetting that there's a giant FREE software community.

Yes, but there is also a huge closed community, too.
Even closed software that works with free software.
Good software will never be free. As long as programmers must eat and find shelter, it will not be free.

Now, frameworks (and I use this term very broadly, not in a technical sense) will probably become more free. Even MS, under pressure, is helping in that.

But you're not going to download the next great FPS for free, legally. Also, many people are now being paid to do free software work. People like those at IBM are seeing that furthering the likes of Apache might be a better way to go than ignoring it. Sure, they don't make money off it...but if you want any hardware out now, other than Sun's dying breed, they offer it. Nice, huh?

Greedy Capitalist Pigs? will rule the day--they just have to get used to a few different business models.

This is not to say there won't be truly free software. As long as programmers can get together with an itch to scratch, there will be truly free stuff. But already the costless and costing software models are merging with free software (free in this case just meaning GPL-type free).

 

[AnitaPeterson]

Originally posted by: Cerb
But you're not going to download the next great FPS for free, legally.

hmmm... RTCW: ET, anyone?

I know that's stretching it, but come on. Besides that, people still play old games that are freewares...

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: AnitaPeterson

Originally posted by: Cerb
But you're not going to download the next great FPS for free, legally.

hmmm... RTCW: ET, anyone?

I know that's stretching it, but come on. Besides that, people still play old games that are freewares...

Or new ones. Gunbound is addictive, man! But still, that is stretching it. It costs a lot for that development, so you must pay for it. Good but short games like SS, SS2, Mafia for like $20-$35 are great. Even poor friends I know have no problems paying for them. I had no problems with all it cost to keep up with MW4 until about eight months ago, either .
Meanwhile, they'll have few issues paying ~$50 for HL2 and Doom3, assuming the reviews have more than eye and sound candy to talk about...because like old HL, good games will be able to captivate us for longer than bad ones.
We will have rising minimums for GFX and sound, but even just making them, a gwell designed game will be better than the newest eye candy release.