Four dead after anti-American riots erupt in Afghanistan

[conjur]

If they're 3rd world...so are we.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: BBond
I knew a history professor whose favorite quote about the "assortment of many different types of cultures" that make up the supposed American "melting pot" was, "America isn't a melting pot, it's more like a beef stew."

It certainly has many more types of cultures and peoples than most other countries.

I have to disagree with you based on my own experience as well. Americans don't know any more about the many cultures right here at home than they do about the many cultures everywhere else in the world. I spoke to a man while travelling only 100 miles from home who admitted to me during friendly conversation that he had NEVER MET A BLACK PERSON OR A PERSON OF COLOR IN HIS ENTIRE LIFE. Only 100 miles from New York City. One of the most culturally diverse cities in the world. Can you imagine?

What a bunch of crap. NYC itself is hugely diverse. :laugh: This is one of the funniest things that I have ever read here.

Nice and hilarious anecdotal evidence!

Consider the attitude toward second or third languages of Americans and the American education system. Foreign languages are almost an afterthought. I meet people everyday who are fluently multi-lingual. English is their second, third, or fourth language. Yet I hear people criticize them for not speaking perfect English. How many native-born Americans can even speak a second language?

That doesn't say anything about understanding cultures and the differences. You can learn about a culture without learning the language. Look at the US itself and common celebration of European holidays, Mexican holidays, Chinese, etc.

Just because we have a multi-cultural nation doesn't mean those cultures mix, now does it? And do they mix? Do you venture into the various ethnic neighborhoods where you live? Assuming you live in an ethnically diverse area. I have observed the vast majority of people sticking to their own neighborhoods and interacting with people outside their realm only at work or entertainment.

I think you might have mis-read the second point. I talked to a guy only 100 miles from NYC who provided that anecdotal evidence. Not in NYC.

And the American attitude toward foreign languages is indicative of our attitude toward cultures, IMO.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: conjur
If they're 3rd world...so are we.

I think a country with a less than 60% literacy rate is in much worse shape than one of the richest countries in the entire world.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: BBond
Just because we have a multi-cultural nation doesn't mean those cultures mix, now does it? And do they mix? Do you venture into the various ethnic neighborhoods where you live? Assuming you live in an ethnically diverse area. I have observed the vast majority of people sticking to their own neighborhoods and interacting with people outside their realm only at work or entertainment.

Yes I do. In fact I am one of these ethnic people you speak of. Perhaps you should venture into these neighborhoods that you speak of. I'm sure that others do all of the time.

I think you might have mis-read the second point. I talked to a guy only 100 miles from NYC who provided that anecdotal evidence. Not in NYC.

I once met an Iraqi who had never met another human being before me. Isn't that crazy?

And the American attitude toward foreign languages is indicative of our attitude toward cultures, IMO.

Actually it's more indicative of the US dominance of the world, the size of the country, and its continent.

 

[BBond]

I've been in more ethnically diverse neighborhoods than you will likely visit in two lifetimes. And many of them, I would wager, you wouldn't venture into.

As for your ridiculous analogy I didn't say he never met another person. I said this guy told me he lived all of his life, and he appeared to be in his forties, only 100 miles from New York City, and he had never met a person of color. Believe it or not but don't make another inconsistent analogy.

American ignorance of cultures coupled with its obsession with dominance rather than cooperation is what got us into the mess we're in today in Iraq.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: BBond
I've been in more ethnically diverse neighborhoods than you will likely visit in two lifetimes. And many of them, I would wager, you wouldn't venture into.

I doubt it.

As for your ridiculous analogy I didn't say he never met another person. I said this guy told me he lived all of his life, and he appeared to be in his forties, only 100 miles from New York City, and he had never met a person of color. Believe it or not but don't make another inconsistent analogy.

It's true though.

American ignorance of cultures coupled with its obsession with dominance rather than cooperation is what got us into the mess we're in today in Iraq.

OK, but that doesn't really address my point. I don't really support the Iraq war so let's not let your extremism of the situation get in the way here.

 

[CanOWorms]

The US (and Canada) are pretty much accepting of other cultures, especially when compared to other socieites, even other developed countries such as in Europe. In Europe, they actively try to crush "foreign" cultures. They see it as an invasion. Multiculturalism has been declared a failure in Europe. Of course, this is because of the society, not the idea.

 

[BBond]

Back to the topic.

Afghan president urges U.S. action over Koran

Seven die in Afghan riots over Koran claims

 

[beyoku]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: conjur
Oh, I wouldn't be surprised if there were a few that resorted to violent means.

You're missing the point, as are others. Americans avoid knowing of other cultures and rely upon stereotypes from Hollywood or propaganda from the government. The government, itself, is egregiously at fault for not fully understanding the culture of the people whose countries we've invaded and we've seen the consequences of that in many ways, usually involving the loss of blood.

While there may be a few that resort to violent means, I don't think as many would resort to violent means as we are seeing in this case.

Actually I would guess that Americans know more of many other cultures than Iraqis, as America is essentially an assortment of many different types of cultures. I would also guess that there are also likely to be many more extremists in Iraq with a certain hatred of certain lifestyles and cultures and more willing to be violent against it. Such is the way of a poor 3rd world country.

Doubt it. Most americans cannot even point out iraq or most ME countries on the world map, let alone know their cultures.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: beyoku

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: conjur
Oh, I wouldn't be surprised if there were a few that resorted to violent means.

You're missing the point, as are others. Americans avoid knowing of other cultures and rely upon stereotypes from Hollywood or propaganda from the government. The government, itself, is egregiously at fault for not fully understanding the culture of the people whose countries we've invaded and we've seen the consequences of that in many ways, usually involving the loss of blood.

While there may be a few that resort to violent means, I don't think as many would resort to violent means as we are seeing in this case.

Actually I would guess that Americans know more of many other cultures than Iraqis, as America is essentially an assortment of many different types of cultures. I would also guess that there are also likely to be many more extremists in Iraq with a certain hatred of certain lifestyles and cultures and more willing to be violent against it. Such is the way of a poor 3rd world country.

Doubt it. Most americans cannot even point out iraq or most ME countries on the world map, let alone know their cultures.

Well there's more to knowing and being tolerant about cultures than pointing out a country on a map...which I am sure that the people of a third world country are not very good at either.

 

[MidasKnight]

Originally posted by: raildogg
BBond you are fricking insane. So now Afghanistan is a illegal occupation as well?

Why don't we just surrender to these terrorists, huh? Lets just treat them like they were regular innocent people and let them loose.

It also says the US might have desecrated the quran. Is there a investigation? Why are you jumping to conclusions rather quickly? Oh right, its because US soldiers are evil in your sick, twisted radical leftist mind.

By the way, your link sucks.

But nice job of cheering on the violence against our brave soldiers.

:thumbsup: raildogg

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: conjur
If they're 3rd world...so are we.

I think a country with a less than 60% literacy rate is in much worse shape than one of the richest countries in the entire world.

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/iraq/facts.html

Education: Literacy rate, 58%; school enrollment, 49%. In 1989, school enrollment in Iraq was higher than the average rate for all developing countries, but over the last decade, the number of elementary school dropouts has increased by more than 30 percent.

Ayup. That 1991 Gulf War, the resulting UN sanctions and the new war have ravaged the social fabric of Iraq.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: conjur
If they're 3rd world...so are we.

I think a country with a less than 60% literacy rate is in much worse shape than one of the richest countries in the entire world.

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/iraq/facts.html

Education: Literacy rate, 58%; school enrollment, 49%. In 1989, school enrollment in Iraq was higher than the average rate for all developing countries, but over the last decade, the number of elementary school dropouts has increased by more than 30 percent.

Ayup. That 1991 Gulf War, the resulting UN sanctions and the new war have ravaged the social fabric of Iraq.

Ummm..you just proved my point. It was a third world country before. I'm not debating whether it was worse off or not as compared to now as that would be ridiculous. However, it was a third world country then and it is still a third world country.

Thanks for proving my point.

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: conjur
If they're 3rd world...so are we.

I think a country with a less than 60% literacy rate is in much worse shape than one of the richest countries in the entire world.

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/iraq/facts.html

Education: Literacy rate, 58%; school enrollment, 49%. In 1989, school enrollment in Iraq was higher than the average rate for all developing countries, but over the last decade, the number of elementary school dropouts has increased by more than 30 percent.

Ayup. That 1991 Gulf War, the resulting UN sanctions and the new war have ravaged the social fabric of Iraq.

Ummm..you just proved my point. It was a third world country before. I'm not debating whether it was worse off or not as compared to now as that would be ridiculous. However, it was a third world country then and it is still a third world country.

Thanks for proving my point.

Uh, no, it wasn't. Iraq had reknowned colleges and universities. Not quite the thing of third world countries.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: conjur

Originally posted by: RabidMongoose

Originally posted by: conjur
If they're 3rd world...so are we.

I think a country with a less than 60% literacy rate is in much worse shape than one of the richest countries in the entire world.

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/iraq/facts.html

Education: Literacy rate, 58%; school enrollment, 49%. In 1989, school enrollment in Iraq was higher than the average rate for all developing countries, but over the last decade, the number of elementary school dropouts has increased by more than 30 percent.

Ayup. That 1991 Gulf War, the resulting UN sanctions and the new war have ravaged the social fabric of Iraq.

Ummm..you just proved my point. It was a third world country before. I'm not debating whether it was worse off or not as compared to now as that would be ridiculous. However, it was a third world country then and it is still a third world country.

Thanks for proving my point.

Uh, no, it wasn't. Iraq had reknowned colleges and universities. Not quite the thing of third world countries.

So does India, the 'leader' of the third world.

I think we have a fundamentally different definitions of third world between the two of us. Iraq is and was relatively poor when compared against developed nations.

 

[conjur]

IMO, this is what is considered third world:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Least_developed_countries

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: conjur
IMO, this is what is considered third world:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Least_developed_countries

For me there are many more than 51 third world countries. There are so many poor and undeveloped countries.

 

[conjur]

To me, a country with an admired system of universities, above average literacy rates, relatively low unemployment, healthcare, etc. is not a third-world country. Iraq pre-1991 then, imo, was not a third-world country. It may be now, but only because it's been ravaged by war.

Iraq was not a land of bedouins and camels, it was industrialized with cities, roads, universities, manufacturing, service industries, etc.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: conjur
To me, a country with an admired system of universities, above average literacy rates, relatively low unemployment, healthcare, etc. is not a third-world country. Iraq pre-1991 then, imo, was not a third-world country. It may be now, but only because it's been ravaged by war.

Iraq was not a land of bedouins and camels, it was industrialized with cities, roads, universities, manufacturing, service industries, etc.

But your own list does not have Iraq as a third world country now.

To me a third world country is a poor and somewhat undeveloped country. While Iraq is not completely undeveloped, as are countries like India, it was still poor and relatively undeveloped.

 

[conjur]

Maybe in the desert areas. Have you read much as to the history of Iraq? Sounds like you're going off of what you've been lead to believe from TV. As for India, the only reason some classify it as third-world is due to the tremendous size of its population lowers stats like per capita income and such. India is a very developed nation with some densely-populated poor areas.

 

[RabidMongoose]

Originally posted by: conjur
Maybe in the desert areas. Have you read much as to the history of Iraq? Sounds like you're going off of what you've been lead to believe from TV. As for India, the only reason some classify it as third-world is due to the tremendous size of its population lowers stats like per capita income and such. India is a very developed nation with some densely-populated poor areas.

I know that Iraq back then was not exactly what it is now, but it was still a relatively poor country when compared to the developed world.

India is a third world country to me, even if it is a country with huge extremes. I don't need a television to tell me that - I've been there myself.

 

[LTC8K6]

It looks like the only one who desecrated the Koran was a prisoner who flushed it's pages in an attempt to clog up the toilet in his cell. You'd think the MSM would be wary of sources writing books by now. That goes for much of the info coming out about GITMO from those 2 authors.



Beware of authors bearing news stories.....

 

[conjur]

HA! That site certainly is non-biased.


:roll:

 

[LTC8K6]

If you'll read the CNN linkin the Mudville article, you'll see that there is actually a log entry at GITMO recording a prisoner's attempt to clog a toilet with pages from his Koran.

 

[LTC8K6]

Myers said the only incident recorded in the prison logs was of a detainee tearing pages from a Quran and using them in an attempt to block a toilet as a protest, and even that incident, he said, was unconfirmed.

"It's a log entry that has to be confirmed," he said. "There are several log entries that show that the Quran may have been moved and detainees became irritated about it, but never an incident where it was thrown in the toilet."