Former Lehman CEO sells million dollar mansion for $100

[freegeeks]

linky

he must be getting scared for potential law suits

 

[Genx87]

I could be wrong but believe something like this can be disregarded by the courts in a civil suit.

 

[Dari]

Any good lawyer should be able to undo that sale (I hope).

 

[Skitzer]

It's called arrogance!

 

[Lemon law]

Originally posted by: Dari
Any good lawyer should be able to undo that sale (I hope).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
But any good defense lawyer can milk that into two or three years of stalling at least.

 

[GTKeeper]

If this can be traced, then it will be fair game in the court system. Especially since its being done 'last minute'.

 

[Dari]

Originally posted by: Lemon law

Originally posted by: Dari
Any good lawyer should be able to undo that sale (I hope).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
But any good defense lawyer can milk that into two or three years of stalling at least.

Then Mr. Fuld needs to see who's actually benefitting: Him or the lawyer. In the end, he'll do the right thing (I hope).

 

[nobodyknows]

A "divorce" could sure complicate things.

 

[KB]

I don't understand how this protects him? If you sue him, you effectively sue the wife. Marriage means joint ownership of property unless they get divorced.

 

[TallBill]

Originally posted by: KB
I don't understand how this protects him? If you sue him, you effectively sue the wife. Marriage means joint ownership of property unless they get divorced.

Yeah, I was thinking this as well...

 

[smokeyjoe]

Originally posted by: Dari
Any good lawyer should be able to undo that sale (I hope).

Pretty sure this was not a "sale" but just this guy removing himself from the deed of trust, hence the nominal $ amount.. still it beckons the question why

edit: it looks like this is an investment property so they can't get FL homestead protection either.. I don't see what this guy is trying to do

 

[SSSnail]

Originally posted by: TallBill

Originally posted by: KB
I don't understand how this protects him? If you sue him, you effectively sue the wife. Marriage means joint ownership of property unless they get divorced.

Yeah, I was thinking this as well...

Next headliner "Lehman's CEO wife file for divorce"... yeah.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Thats what I Love about the internet.....

You need a Lawyer you have thousands of lawyers....
You need a Surgeon you have thousands of Surgeons....
You need a Nuclear Physicist you have thousanfs of them.....
You need advice from a 15 year old kid you can`t find a single one.....hahaaa

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: KB
I don't understand how this protects him? If you sue him, you effectively sue the wife. Marriage means joint ownership of property unless they get divorced.

No, at least not here in NC.

Civil suits are under state law. Here in NC, if I get sued but my house is owned jointly with my wife they can't touch it.

Suing me != suing my wife.

So, if he were in NC I don't see any reason for the transfer (the home was originally purchased jointly thus protected here).

Must be some reason under FL (or other state) law he transfered it soley to his wife's name?

Fern

 

[smokeyjoe]

FLORIDA ASSET PROTECTION - Homestead Protection In Florida, our home is truly our castle, a castle that is impenetrable by creditors. The Florida Constitution exempts homestead property from levy and execution by judgment creditors. Florida courts have liberally expanded definitions of homestead property which includes more than just a single family house. Condominiums, manufactured homes, and mobile homes are also afforded homestead protection. The Constitution defines homestead as one?s principal place of residence up to one-half acre within a municipality and up to 160 contiguous acres in any county in Florida . To qualify for homestead protection, a debtor must be a permanent Florida resident and the homestead property must be his primary place of residence. Property purchased as a future residence is unprotected until the property is occupied as a principal residence. A second home or investment property cannot be considered a Florida homestead. Only "natural persons" quailfy for homestead protection so properties titled in the name of irrevocable trusts, corporations, limited liability companies, or partnerships will not qualify. Property owned by a living trust can be homestead property. A newly-enacted Florida Statute provides that property owned by a land trust may be homestead property. What makes Florida?s homestead protection such a powerful asset protection tool is its unlimited monetary protection. A Florida resident can invest millions of dollars in large estate homes and farms and protect the full value of these luxury residences under Florida?s homestead law. Under a Florida Supreme Court ruling, a person can transfer unprotected, non-exempt assets to his homestead at any time by either buying a new home or reducing the principal balance of an existing mortgage and protect this money under the homestead umbrella, even if the asset transfer was clearly designed to hide money from creditor claims. There are limited exceptions to this general rule pertaining to money obtained by deceit, fraud, or other egregious means. The Florida Constitution does not protect homestead property against tax liens, mortgages, homeowner association assessments, or from mechanics liens associated with labor or materials to repair or improve the homestead property. Also, the asset protection benefits of homestead should not be confused with the homestated tax exemption; the tax exemption and creditor exemption are similar but different rules can apply to each. Homestead protection may not apply if the debtor files bankruptcy. Under the new bankruptcy law, homestead protection is available in bankruptcy up to $137,000 unless the debtor occupied his current Florida homestead property and previous Florida homestead properties for a continuous 40-month period. Joint bankruptcy debtors can protect $274,000 of jointly owned homestead. Also, transfers of cash into homestead within 10 years intended to defraud creditors may be challenged by the bankruptcy trustee. The new bankruptcy law has no effect on Florida's unlimited homestead protection outside of bankruptcy.

http://www.alperlaw.com/constitutional_protection.html

She would need to show it as a primary res to claim homestead exemption.

 

[colonel]

he still has couple houses here in Greenwich , CT. I dont know about this guy I still trying to understand why the gov did not save the bank, I' ve been reading a lot of finance magazines about the fall.

 

[sactoking]

Well, it was filed 11/10/08. All he has to do is wait another ~15 days and he can declare bankruptcy. Since the transfer will be >90 days old, it can't be considered for fraudulent reconveyance.

 

[WaTaGuMp]

I feel bad the housing market has dropped the value of it that much.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: colonel
he still has couple houses here in Greenwich , CT. I dont know about this guy I still trying to understand why the gov did not save the bank, I' ve been reading a lot of finance magazines about the fall.

While I can't say why, one reported fact to consider:

They were one of the 'big 5' and a competitor to Goldman Sachs. The person who made the decision is the former chairman of Goldman Sachs, he had a few months left in office, and the current chairman of Goldman Sachs was sitting in his office when he decided - someone who stands to benefit greatly from the fall of a competitot.

I'm saying this raises questions, not that it's proof, but proof is hard to come by.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: KB
I don't understand how this protects him? If you sue him, you effectively sue the wife. Marriage means joint ownership of property unless they get divorced.

Are you sure about that? What about non-community property states? In Alaska the asset belongs to the person who holds title to it. If my wife holds the title to our house and I'm not on that title and I get sued, they can't take the house. I have no ownership rights therefore it's not my asset. I know several wealthy families up there who do just this. The husband runs/owns the business but all the assets are in the wife's name.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp
I feel bad the housing market has dropped the value of it that much.

:laugh:

 

[Thump553]

Originally posted by: sactoking
Well, it was filed 11/10/08. All he has to do is wait another ~15 days and he can declare bankruptcy. Since the transfer will be >90 days old, it can't be considered for fraudulent reconveyance.

You are wrong. You have confused the concept of preferential transfers (the 90 day period-but if it is a transfer to an "insider"-which his wife would be-the look back period is one year, not 90 days) with the concept of fraudulent transfer.

An example of the difference. Debtors owes his brother in law $500 (assume a real debt) and repays him within one year of the bankruptcy filing. This is a preference and the trustee will get the $500 out of the brother in law (who becomes an ordinary creditor). Fraudulent transfer would be debtor gives property away for less than adequate consideration, like giving a $10,000 car for $100 cash. Depending on what law is applied, the lookback period on fraudulent transfers is several years (probably 3-7).

The news story is so sparse on facts I can't figure this out. Fuld has the bucks for top notch legal counsel and they did this transfer for a reason-so potential creditors should be very worried about it. I'm guessing that they will try to establish this house as his wife's primary residence, and thus take advantage of Florida's unlimited homestead exemption. I'm guessing the wife quitclaimed her interest in another house to him. Hopefully his primary residence is here in CT-we have a $75,000 homestead exemption for one person (in the equity).

 

[sactoking]

Originally posted by: Thump553

Originally posted by: sactoking
Well, it was filed 11/10/08. All he has to do is wait another ~15 days and he can declare bankruptcy. Since the transfer will be >90 days old, it can't be considered for fraudulent reconveyance.

You are wrong. You have confused the concept of preferential transfers (the 90 day period-but if it is a transfer to an "insider"-which his wife would be-the look back period is one year, not 90 days) with the concept of fraudulent transfer.

An example of the difference. Debtors owes his brother in law $500 (assume a real debt) and repays him within one year of the bankruptcy filing. This is a preference and the trustee will get the $500 out of the brother in law (who becomes an ordinary creditor). Fraudulent transfer would be debtor gives property away for less than adequate consideration, like giving a $10,000 car for $100 cash. Depending on what law is applied, the lookback period on fraudulent transfers is several years (probably 3-7).

The news story is so sparse on facts I can't figure this out. Fuld has the bucks for top notch legal counsel and they did this transfer for a reason-so potential creditors should be very worried about it. I'm guessing that they will try to establish this house as his wife's primary residence, and thus take advantage of Florida's unlimited homestead exemption. I'm guessing the wife quitclaimed her interest in another house to him. Hopefully his primary residence is here in CT-we have a $75,000 homestead exemption for one person (in the equity).

Ahh, thank you. I've never bene fully 'up' on bankruptcy.

 

[BassBomb]

Did you read citi apparently bought a 50 million $ plane