Ford's Expedition SUV snubbed by Consumer Reports

[klah]

Originally posted by: Yield
I think I have only ever seen like 2 of those things in my life on the road...
wonder why though eh? cause they are a big ugly hard to maneuver pain in the ass of a vehicle.. bleh!!

You have only seen 2 Ford Expeditions on the road?

 

[CraigRT]

yes, and one was just last week.. i have only seen a couple in real life..
at least with most crappy vehicles you still see them around.. but with these, most people seem to be smart enough to stay away from them.

 

[LAUST]

Originally posted by: Quaoar
bahhhh a chevy couldn't make it once around my diameter without the starter or fuel pump going out.

Weird, my stock Fuel Pump has been just fine powering 10 injectors @ 70PSI
our starters do suck though, My friggin brothers went out at 170K miles :| dazm thing cost $60!! and took us like 20 minutes to replace!

How is your Power Steering pump doing? Oh wait I can hear it whining from here

BTW 5900lbs!!!!!!! What is going on, that is very Moparish

 

[UNCjigga]

Originally posted by: Tominator
As usual Consumer Reports has nothing to say. They use random sampling to get their data and it is often very wrong.

You will notice their reports receive very little press when compared to a few years ago.

Ford continues to set sales records with their SUV line.

Yep, I'd have to agree. Even with the tire recall fiasco, safety concerns, rollover concerns all the way back to the 80s, and reliability concerns over the past 12 years, Ford SUVs keep selling. The average American consumer feels they are getting their money's worth and they enjoy the vehicles. What's even more surprising is that they get a lot of repeat business from previous Explorer/Expedition owners. 'Built Ford Tough' is great marketing.

 

[LAUST]

Originally posted by: Yield
yes, and one was just last week.. i have only seen a couple in real life..
at least with most crappy vehicles you still see them around.. but with these, most people seem to be smart enough to stay away from them.

I think you are thinking Excursion, Expeditions are ALL over town

 

[BooneRebel]

Originally posted by: Yield
yes, and one was just last week.. i have only seen a couple in real life..
at least with most crappy vehicles you still see them around.. but with these, most people seem to be smart enough to stay away from them.

Are you sure you're not thinking of the Excursion (F250 platform)? The Expedition (F150 platform) sells like hotcakes, they're all over the road.

 

[Chadder007]

Originally posted by: NFS4

Who wrote that? Chevy? How exactly did Ford get "snubbed" or "smacked"? This is SOP for CR. This is a brand new vehicle, not based on any other platform therefore it does not get a reliability recommendation. The Honda, which is a new vehicle based on other platforms, gets a recommendation based on the reliability of those platforms. It is all clearly stated in the CR article and it is the way they have always done business. "Ace Reporter" indeed. How dissapointing.

There's another reason for that though. Ford, Chevy, and Honda ALL have recalls from time to time. Heck, Honda even recently had a recall on transmissions for some of their recent V6-equipped models. But those are a rather rare occurance. The reason why the Expedition wasn't looked upon favorably by CR is b/c:

1) The '02 Explorer was recalled 4 times within 4 months of being launched (breaking rear glass, cut tires due to misaligned production lines, etc.)
2) The Escape was recalled at least 6 times within the first year of production
3) Both the new Thunderbird and certain V8 models of the Lincoln LS had to be recalled (or at least delayed delivery) b/c of problems with the engine. This delayed the launch of the T-Bird
4) Ford's recall poster-child...the Ford Focus has been recalled at least 9 times in the past 2 years.

All of these were brand new models that were riddled with problems at launch.

All of these problems and recalls must be related to all the JOBS moving to Mexico somehow???.

....seriously, all american car companies seem to be moving off to Mexico while german and japanese are moving their productions here to the US. Soon more "foreign" cars will be made here than "domestic".

 

[CraigRT]

I barely ever see them.. either of them, expedition and excursion.. I'm not a fan of such ridiculously sized vehicles.. but I guess to some people they might be practical. I just don't like something that isn't nimble in any way.

 

[busmaster11]

Originally posted by: Yield
I barely ever see them.. either of them, expedition and excursion.. I'm not a fan of such ridiculously sized vehicles.. but I guess to some people they might be practical. I just don't like something that isn't nimble in any way.

I test drove the new Expedition, and I give it a 6/10 too.

pros:
- Big, roomy, comfy
- Tons of places to put things
- seats fold automatically with push of a button


cons:
- Felt like I was driving a bulldozer - big, lumbering, powerful, awkward
- Interior was very plasticky for a 50k vehicle
- mileage
- The middle row of seats don't fold completely flat, and the middle one isn't flush with anything.
- no indash DVD or GPS


I love the Pilot and Highlander. I got a Rodeo now, twin to its predecessor, the Passport, and and the Pilot is so much better. It's in-house Honda, its got three rows of seats, its car based for a cushy ride and better mileage...

Nothing comes close to Honda and Toyota...

 

[NFS4]

Originally posted by: busmaster11

Originally posted by: Yield
I barely ever see them.. either of them, expedition and excursion.. I'm not a fan of such ridiculously sized vehicles.. but I guess to some people they might be practical. I just don't like something that isn't nimble in any way.

I test drove the new Expedition, and I give it a 6/10 too.

pros:
- Big, roomy, comfy
- Tons of places to put things
- seats fold automatically with push of a button


cons:
- Felt like I was driving a bulldozer - big, lumbering, powerful, awkward
- Interior was very plasticky for a 50k vehicle
- mileage
- The middle row of seats don't fold completely flat, and the middle one isn't flush with anything.
- no indash DVD or GPS


I love the Pilot and Highlander. I got a Rodeo now, twin to its predecessor, the Passport, and and the Pilot is so much better. It's in-house Honda, its got three rows of seats, its car based for a cushy ride and better mileage...

Nothing comes close to Honda and Toyota...

Well, I FINALLY went to go look at the Pilot the other day at the Honda dealership. I drove there in the Highlander and pulled up to the Pilot in front of the dealership. The salesman saw the Highlander pull up next to the Pilot and he tasted blood in the water He promptly came out and talked with me and he said that he could go get the keys if I liked. I said of course and he went and got them. He opened 'er up and I sat inside. It was swathed in leather, but the interior didn't look as good and didn't seem as ergonomic as the Highlander. He then looked through the driver's side window and asked me how I'd liked the 4-Runner. I kinda laughed and said "That's a Highlander" I got out and looked at the rear accomodations and the fold-down third row seat...pretty nifty.

The sticker price on the thing was $31,335 but since it was a demo model, Honda made them tack on just about every dealer accessory (brush guards up front, running boards, wood grain trim on the dash, steering wheel, doors, console, etc) and a bunch of other crap. Final price was around $34,600. But of course, you couldn't buy the demo b/c the dealer has to keep it for 6 months for test drives. He also said that if you ordered one today, you wouldn't get it til late December.

They DID have an LX model sitting on the lot, but nobody wants that pile It had the grey bumpers, grey side trim, and steel wheels...no options. It'll be there for a while

 

[PsychoAndy]

Originally posted by: NFS4

Originally posted by: busmaster11

Originally posted by: Yield
I barely ever see them.. either of them, expedition and excursion.. I'm not a fan of such ridiculously sized vehicles.. but I guess to some people they might be practical. I just don't like something that isn't nimble in any way.

I test drove the new Expedition, and I give it a 6/10 too.

pros:
- Big, roomy, comfy
- Tons of places to put things
- seats fold automatically with push of a button


cons:
- Felt like I was driving a bulldozer - big, lumbering, powerful, awkward
- Interior was very plasticky for a 50k vehicle
- mileage
- The middle row of seats don't fold completely flat, and the middle one isn't flush with anything.
- no indash DVD or GPS


I love the Pilot and Highlander. I got a Rodeo now, twin to its predecessor, the Passport, and and the Pilot is so much better. It's in-house Honda, its got three rows of seats, its car based for a cushy ride and better mileage...

Nothing comes close to Honda and Toyota...

Well, I FINALLY went to go look at the Pilot the other day at the Honda dealership. I drove there in the Highlander and pulled up to the Pilot in front of the dealership. The salesman saw the Highlander pull up next to the Pilot and he tasted blood in the water He promptly came out and talked with me and he said that he could go get the keys if I liked. I said of course and he went and got them. He opened 'er up and I sat inside. It was swathed in leather, but the interior didn't look as good and didn't seem as ergonomic as the Highlander. He then looked through the driver's side window and asked me how I'd liked the 4-Runner. I kinda laughed and said "That's a Highlander" I got out and looked at the rear accomodations and the fold-down third row seat...pretty nifty.

The sticker price on the thing was $31,335 but since it was a demo model, Honda made them tack on just about every dealer accessory (brush guards up front, running boards, wood grain trim on the dash, steering wheel, doors, console, etc) and a bunch of other crap. Final price was around $34,600. But of course, you couldn't buy the demo b/c the dealer has to keep it for 6 months for test drives. He also said that if you ordered one today, you wouldn't get it til late December.

They DID have an LX model sitting on the lot, but nobody wants that pile It had the grey bumpers, grey side trim, and steel wheels...no options. It'll be there for a while

You're kidding me, right? December? I think my dealer has like 20 of them on the lot. Let me bring the digicam next time I go mooch lunch off of dad.

I'm blessed. My bank, ship center, staples, family restaurant, goat purveyor and honda dealer are all withinn a 5 minute drive.

-PAB

 

[NFS4]

Originally posted by: PsychoAndy

Originally posted by: NFS4

Originally posted by: busmaster11

Originally posted by: Yield
I barely ever see them.. either of them, expedition and excursion.. I'm not a fan of such ridiculously sized vehicles.. but I guess to some people they might be practical. I just don't like something that isn't nimble in any way.

I test drove the new Expedition, and I give it a 6/10 too.

pros:
- Big, roomy, comfy
- Tons of places to put things
- seats fold automatically with push of a button


cons:
- Felt like I was driving a bulldozer - big, lumbering, powerful, awkward
- Interior was very plasticky for a 50k vehicle
- mileage
- The middle row of seats don't fold completely flat, and the middle one isn't flush with anything.
- no indash DVD or GPS


I love the Pilot and Highlander. I got a Rodeo now, twin to its predecessor, the Passport, and and the Pilot is so much better. It's in-house Honda, its got three rows of seats, its car based for a cushy ride and better mileage...

Nothing comes close to Honda and Toyota...

Well, I FINALLY went to go look at the Pilot the other day at the Honda dealership. I drove there in the Highlander and pulled up to the Pilot in front of the dealership. The salesman saw the Highlander pull up next to the Pilot and he tasted blood in the water He promptly came out and talked with me and he said that he could go get the keys if I liked. I said of course and he went and got them. He opened 'er up and I sat inside. It was swathed in leather, but the interior didn't look as good and didn't seem as ergonomic as the Highlander. He then looked through the driver's side window and asked me how I'd liked the 4-Runner. I kinda laughed and said "That's a Highlander" I got out and looked at the rear accomodations and the fold-down third row seat...pretty nifty.

The sticker price on the thing was $31,335 but since it was a demo model, Honda made them tack on just about every dealer accessory (brush guards up front, running boards, wood grain trim on the dash, steering wheel, doors, console, etc) and a bunch of other crap. Final price was around $34,600. But of course, you couldn't buy the demo b/c the dealer has to keep it for 6 months for test drives. He also said that if you ordered one today, you wouldn't get it til late December.

They DID have an LX model sitting on the lot, but nobody wants that pile It had the grey bumpers, grey side trim, and steel wheels...no options. It'll be there for a while

You're kidding me, right? December? I think my dealer has like 20 of them on the lot. Let me bring the digicam next time I go mooch lunch off of dad.

I'm blessed. My bank, ship center, staples, family restaurant, goat purveyor and honda dealer are all withinn a 5 minute drive.

-PAB

Yup, not til December. I've only seen about 3 or 4 around here. Seems like a much better alternative to the Expedition...condsidering that the third row seats in both vehicles are for midgets Faster, more fuel-efficient, and cheaper.

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: BooneRebel
Just drove one of these last weekend (to get my AT $75 debit card!):

Likes (Eddie Bauer edition):
1. Sunroof
2. Climate control (like a home thermostat - set the temp) Cadillac was doing this 20 years ago but it's still a neat gimmick
3. Power folding third seat
4. Chrome trim around AC vents (think Audi TT)
5. Auto-tilting mirrors (shift to reverse and the side view mirrors tilt down about 20 degrees, go into drive and they swivel back up)

Dislikes:
1. Plastic bumpers instead of metal (like previous years)
2. 3rd seat headrests block seat from folding down (wait till the kids discover this one)
3. To get to the third row is a multi part process: Pull lever to fold down second row seat, pull tab to lift seat forward, and hold seat in place (doesn't catch automatically) to get into third row. If you don't hold the 2nd row seat 'up' while getting in it will fall back into place - a nuisance if you use the third row often. The dealer wanted to demonstrate how easily he could do it since I had trouble, and he bumbled it even worse, took him nearly a minute just to get the seat folded.
4. The chrome trim is just plastic.
5. The side view mirrors are rectangular instead of the rounded shape on older models, doesn't match up very well with the rest of the truck.

If I bought one I would remove the 'middle' second row seat (captains chairs) to permit easy access to the back. But the seats aren't designed to be removed so you have to remove trim, bolts, etc. to get it out.

BooneRebel, which model year do you test? I test the 2003 this weekend.

2. The 3rd row seat headrests do not block the seat from coming down, if the head rest is in it's lowest position.
3. The 2nd row seat I tested locked in place. In fact, when the seat was released the nice pneumatic arm put it gently back in place.

 

[Doggiedog]

If you ordered an '03 Acura MDX now you probably won't be able to get it until Jan '03 unless you want to get reamed by the dealer and even then it probably won't come in until Nov.

I can see the Pilot taking that long to come in.

 

[LAUST]

Originally posted by: Yield
I barely ever see them.. either of them, expedition and excursion.. I'm not a fan of such ridiculously sized vehicles.. but I guess to some people they might be practical. I just don't like something that isn't nimble in any way.

Most kids that like "Nimble" cars drive like fuggin crazy, so I hate that too. I like the idea of gutless Metro's and Civic's running around town

 

[BooneRebel]

BooneRebel, which model year do you test? I test the 2003 this weekend.

2. The 3rd row seat headrests do not block the seat from coming down, if the head rest is in it's lowest position.
3. The 2nd row seat I tested locked in place. In fact, when the seat was released the nice pneumatic arm put it gently back in place.

The new 2003.

The issue with the headrest is that there is no sensor or switch to check to see if the headrest is up, so if you hit the button to lower the seat it will start to come down, even if the headrest has been raised, and then catch on the seat in front. And you have to be a double-jointed acrobat if you're trying to lower one of the headrests from the tailgate area.

At least on the model we drove, the driver's side second row seat didn't lock in place, but I did notice the pneumatic arm that keeps the seat from 'slamming' back down. It still doesn't give you much room to get back there, although (NFS4) I wouldn't say the back seat is midget sized. I sat back there after dropping the second row back into place and it was comfortable enough. Typical bench seat, two adults are OK, three would be pushing it but doable for short distances.

 

[Zenmervolt]

What's even more surprising is that they get a lot of repeat business from previous Explorer/Expedition owners.

This is surprising why? We've had three Explorers. A 1991 that we put 160,000 miles on, and traded in on a 1998. When the 1991 was traded in, it was in perfect shape, ran as well as it had when it was new. We put 140,000 miles on the 1998 Explorer, and would have put more on it had a motorhome not rear ended it at about 45 mph. Sandwitched the Explorer between a semi-trailer and the motorhome. Neither my father nor the single passenger were injured. We currently have a 1999 Explorer, and while it has had bearing problems, it's been otherwise rock solid. I personally feel that the bearing problems are related to the AWD system in the current Explorer, because all the failures are unique to the Eddie Bauer's AWD system, and the previous two Explorers (XLT's) were bulletproof. Also, it's sort of off-topic, but we averaged 75,000+ miles per set of those supposedly dangerous Firestones. So far there has been nothing that comes close to the performance of the old Firestones. Truth be told, the tires were perfectly safe so long as people kept them inflated.

ZV

 

[Pacfanweb]

Originally posted by: NFS4

Who wrote that? Chevy? How exactly did Ford get "snubbed" or "smacked"? This is SOP for CR. This is a brand new vehicle, not based on any other platform therefore it does not get a reliability recommendation. The Honda, which is a new vehicle based on other platforms, gets a recommendation based on the reliability of those platforms. It is all clearly stated in the CR article and it is the way they have always done business. "Ace Reporter" indeed. How dissapointing.

There's another reason for that though. Ford, Chevy, and Honda ALL have recalls from time to time. Heck, Honda even recently had a recall on transmissions for some of their recent V6-equipped models. But those are a rather rare occurance. The reason why the Expedition wasn't looked upon favorably by CR is b/c:

1) The '02 Explorer was recalled 4 times within 4 months of being launched (breaking rear glass, cut tires due to misaligned production lines, etc.)
2) The Escape was recalled at least 6 times within the first year of production
3) Both the new Thunderbird and certain V8 models of the Lincoln LS had to be recalled (or at least delayed delivery) b/c of problems with the engine. This delayed the launch of the T-Bird
4) Ford's recall poster-child...the Ford Focus has been recalled at least 9 times in the past 2 years.

All of these were brand new models that were riddled with problems at launch.

The above is all true, but doesn't tell the whole story. What is doesn't tell you is that nearly all of the recalls mentioned above were on very few of the vehicles, only the first ones produced. (except Focus, which has had 11 recalls, but again, mostly on the first 1-2 years they were made-those continue to have recalls, but are the same old cars)
The first Escapes arrived here on the truck with either 4 or 6 recalls. Since then, they have been relatively trouble-free.
Same with the Explorers.
T-Bird, who cares, limited production, completely useless other than as a toy. They delayed production, rather than release it and recall at the same time. Good move, especially for how much you have to pay for them.
Ironically, they had to do the exact same thing with the 1989 Thunderbird Super Coupes. They had a problem with the crankshafts breaking, and had to delay production until they were reliable. They never had an engine problem when finally released.

The 03 Expeditions have been probably the most trouble-free of any new model that Ford has introduced since I have been working at a Ford dealership. They are extremely nice, and are a far cry from the old Expeditions.
I can understand them not recommending them YET, since they don't have a long track record, but I disagree that CR's not recommending the Expedition is a smack to Ford. It makes perfect sense to wait and see if they hold up or not.

 

[Angrymarshmello]

PFW laying it down

Oh and for everyone saying Expeditions are selling like hotcakes - Tahoes outsell them fyi