for those who drive manual trans vehicles

[MasterAndCommander]

1st gear + e-brake FTW!

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Minjin
Proof? I've seen it happen? Anyone who has ever changed a timing belt can understand what I'm saying.

Mark

That car must have been well past the recommended change interval on the timing belt. Timing belts don't just skip a tooth.

How did you see it happen? Do you have a clear timing belt cover on your car?

By "seen it happen" he means that one of his friends has some idiot mechanic tell him that after his timing belt snapped.

ZV

That's what I'm thinking. I know how cars work and I've worked on my own cars for years and I can't for the life of me figure out how parking on a hill with the car in gear could do this. That must have been one old weak stretched out timing belt. More likely is that it was just waaay past the recommended change interval and was about to snap anyway.

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: Minjin
Proof? I've seen it happen? Anyone who has ever changed a timing belt can understand what I'm saying.

Mark

That car must have been well past the recommended change interval on the timing belt. Timing belts don't just skip a tooth.

How did you see it happen? Do you have a clear timing belt cover on your car?

By "seen it happen" he means that one of his friends has some idiot mechanic tell him that after his timing belt snapped.

ZV

That's what I'm thinking. I know how cars work and I've worked on my own cars for years and I can't for the life of me figure out how parking on a hill with the car in gear could do this. That must have been one old weak stretched out timing belt. More likely is that it was just waaay past the recommended change interval and was about to snap anyway.

A timing belt can skip a tooth. They usually break first though.

 

[wasssup]

depends on if i'm on a slope or not...when i park at work, i'm in neutral...with my driveway, which slopes up, i'm in 1st.

 

[Insane3D]

I usually put it in 5th, and use the parking brake. The higher the gear it's in, the harder it is for the engine to turn over by itself if the parking brake fails...

Little tip I learned when trying to take the balancer bolt out of the crank...

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: alkemyst
A timing belt can skip a tooth. They usually break first though.

No sh!t sherlock. But they do not skip teeth because of leaving the car in gear when it's parked. And that's what the claim was.

ZV

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Minjin
I've worked as a mechanic. I've seen and worked on the aftermath. Often the customer just comes in wondering why their car is running rough or doesn't have as much power as normal. Always check to make sure the marks are lined up. And yes, timing belts can just skip a tooth. Does it happen all the time? Obviously not. But its something that can and DOES happen.

Mark

Nobody is arguing that timing belts can't or don't jump teeth. However, they will _never_ jump a tooth from leaving the transmission in gear while parked on an incline. That is not a possible cause. Period.

ZV

 

I always put it in gear when I park.

 

[shilala]

I leave her in gear and set the parking brake.
If I'm parked on a hill, I turn the wheels so they'll run into the curb and keep her from rolling.

 

[Minjin]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Minjin
I've worked as a mechanic. I've seen and worked on the aftermath. Often the customer just comes in wondering why their car is running rough or doesn't have as much power as normal. Always check to make sure the marks are lined up. And yes, timing belts can just skip a tooth. Does it happen all the time? Obviously not. But its something that can and DOES happen.

Mark

Nobody is arguing that timing belts can't or don't jump teeth. However, they will _never_ jump a tooth from leaving the transmission in gear while parked on an incline. That is not a possible cause. Period.

ZV

It IS possible. Period.

Same thing when tightening down flywheel bolts. There's a reason why you make certain to not spin the engine backwards...

Mark

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Minjin

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt

Originally posted by: Minjin
I've worked as a mechanic. I've seen and worked on the aftermath. Often the customer just comes in wondering why their car is running rough or doesn't have as much power as normal. Always check to make sure the marks are lined up. And yes, timing belts can just skip a tooth. Does it happen all the time? Obviously not. But its something that can and DOES happen.

Mark

Nobody is arguing that timing belts can't or don't jump teeth. However, they will _never_ jump a tooth from leaving the transmission in gear while parked on an incline. That is not a possible cause. Period.

ZV

It IS possible. Period.

Same thing when tightening down flywheel bolts. There's a reason why you make certain to not spin the engine backwards...

Mark

The camshaft is not magically harder to turn when the engine is off. If spinning the engine with the ignition off causes the timing belt to jump a tooth, then running the engine will cause the timing belt to jump a tooth. There is absolutely no difference whatsoever as far as the timing belt is concerned whether the engine is being spun by the flywheel or running. It simply doesn't care.

The _only_ way what you describe could be possible is if the car has an automatic hydraulic tensioner that has failed and does not keep tension on the belt with the engine turned off. In which case, it's the failed tensioner causing the belt to jump the tooth.

ZV

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
There is absolutely no difference whatsoever as far as the timing belt is concerned whether the engine is being spun by the flywheel or running. It simply doesn't care.

ZV

that's not exactly true though, having the pistons turn the crank, is different than hand cranking at either end of the crankshaft. Mostly it would not make a difference though, but it's a different mechanism...different vectors if you are in that kind of math.

 

[qaa541]

I leave my car in gear and I use the e-brake when I park. I just dont trust the e-brake alone.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: alkemyst

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
There is absolutely no difference whatsoever as far as the timing belt is concerned whether the engine is being spun by the flywheel or running. It simply doesn't care.

ZV

that's not exactly true though, having the pistons turn the crank, is different than hand cranking at either end of the crankshaft. Mostly it would not make a difference though, but it's a different mechanism...different vectors if you are in that kind of math.

There's zero functional difference at the crankshaft pulley. It still rotates about the same axis and encounters no additional resistance that would cause the belt to go slack. And even if there were an significant difference, rotating the crank pulley would be _less_ likely to cause the belt to jump because there is less ancillary vibration involved.

ZV

 

[BCYL]

I always put it in gear in case the e-brake fails...

 

[thedarkwolf]

Originally posted by: Xionide
I leave it in neutral so if someone hits my car while its parked. I still have a transmission.

As pointed out earlier that won't hurt the trans find a new excuse.

 

[spanky]

good god what have i started!

 

[Raduque]

Since my driveway points slightly downward when you pull in, I leave my car in reverse. I don't usually use the parking brake.

Originally posted by: TBone48
The remote starters won't work on a car w/a manual trans because you need to depress the clutch pedal or the car won't start. There is an interlock. CAn it be (legally) disabled to allow remote starting?

The interlock is on newer cars. I don't know what year they became required. My '88 Escort had it.

My 88 Accord doesn't have one. I can start the car without pressing the clutch. I think that you can bypass it on a remote-starting system, ONLY if the car is NOT in gear. It's even possible that they replace the switch with a different one, or put a switch on the shifter, maybe?

 

[tw1164]

Originally posted by: spidey07
I always leave it in neutral although you should keep it in gear.

-edit- if I'm on a steep incline I'll put it into first to help prevent car from taking a trip without the driver.

Me too I do the exact same thing

 

[thedarkwolf]

Originally posted by: Insane3D
I usually put it in 5th, and use the parking brake. The higher the gear it's in, the harder it is for the engine to turn over by itself if the parking brake fails...

Little tip I learned when trying to take the balancer bolt out of the crank...

You have that backwards. With it in 5th its easier to turn the engine over with the wheels like if you were pushing the car but much harder to turn the wheels with the engine like if you have a wrench on the balancer. 1st/reverse is the opposite. Pretty easy to test. Go park on a hill and leave the parking brake off and put it in 5th and see if it holds it and then put it in 1st and repeat.

 

[AmdEmAll]

Originally posted by: spanky

Originally posted by: Phil

Originally posted by: spanky

Originally posted by: Jzero

Originally posted by: spanky
i was unaware of this and when i started the car, he jumped forward and stalled. i was like "WTF!" :|

Of course, you're supposed to step on the clutch when you start the car to prevent this possiblity no matter what gear it was left in.

since park in neutral, i step on the clutch, start the car, let go of the clutch. i never have a problem with this routine, until that one time. i guess i should make a habit of checking the shiftknob (or wiggle it around) before starting the car. meh.

You don't check if it's in neutral before letting go of the clutch?

no, becuz 99.9999% of the time, i drive my car, and i always put it in neutral after i park (it's almost a reflex for me that after i park, i put the car in nuetral, pull e-brake, then pull key). i guess when i was taught, no one mentioned putting the car in gear after parking.

Thats what I do, just put in neutral and pull the ebrake. Whenever someone else drives it and they put it in gear I never notice and I stall it and look like an idiot lol.

 

[Pacfanweb]

You should always leave the car in either 1st or reverse when parked. The emergency brake is exactly what it means...for emergencies. It is not meant to be the only thing holding the car still when parked.

And it is easier for the car to roll in the higher gears, as someone mentioned, so don't leave it in 4th or 5th thinking it won't roll down a hill....it will.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: Pacfanweb
You should always leave the car in either 1st or reverse when parked. The emergency brake is exactly what it means...for emergencies. It is not meant to be the only thing holding the car still when parked.

And it is easier for the car to roll in the higher gears, as someone mentioned, so don't leave it in 4th or 5th thinking it won't roll down a hill....it will.

It's not the "emergency" brake, it's the "parking" brake. It's what should be holding the car in place. The transmission is the fail-safe just in case the parking brake fails.

I always set the parking brake, put the car in neutral, let the brake take a set and make sure it holds the car, then I put the transmission in gear (if manual) or in park (if automatic). The transmission is _not_ supposed to be what holds the car.

ZV

 

[alkemyst]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
It's not the "emergency" brake, it's the "parking" brake. It's what should be holding the car in place. The transmission is the fail-safe just in case the parking brake fails.
ZV

damn you are the asshat. semantics really doesn't fit in motorsports.

You one of those guys that preach it's not an accident, it's a wreck?

On top of that, you don't understand how turning an engine at the crank is any different than at the connecting rods even when I added 'most of the time it doensn't matter'

wear your geek crown proud, you earned it.

 

[Whitecloak]

gear.