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Fooling polygraph tests

K

Krassus

Golden Member
What exactly does it take to fool polygraph tests? I heard some federal agents are trained to do this. What exactly does this training involve, how effective is it and is it available to civillians?
 
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Originally posted by: Evadman
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Click to expand...

LMFAO Evadman 😀
 
Your information is incorrect. Federal Agents are not trained to fool a polygraph, because it is one of the most common tools used against them in internal investigations. Why are you interested in fooling a polygraph? Your best bet is to grab some books on the subject and read their advice. If you can afford it, you could get an expert to teach you the tools of the trade. There is no real way to make the test give opposite answers, but rather you give answers that are unreadable(they can't tell either way).

Once again... Why?
 
Originally posted by: Millennium
Your information is incorrect. Federal Agents are not trained to fool a polygraph, because it is one of the most common tools used against them in internal investigations. Why are you interested in fooling a polygraph? Your best bet is to grab some books on the subject and read their advice. If you can afford it, you could get an expert to teach you the tools of the trade. There is no real way to make the test give opposite answers, but rather you give answers that are unreadable(they can't tell either way).

Once again... Why?
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So how difficult is this? What kind of success rates are we talking here?
 
All a polygraph does is measure heart rate, blood pressure and perspiration (AFAIK). If you can either artificially elevate or depress your physiological processes then you can render a polygraph essentially useless (not that a polygraph is particularly reliable anyway). For example, if you learned meditation you could suppress your physiological systems and "fool" the polygraph.

It's really a fairly useless technology aside from the psychological effect it has on people if they happen to believe that it's accurate.

ZV
 
A polygraph basically measure autonomic arousal by monitoring heart rate and galvanic skin conductivity. Essentially, when you are under stress (such as the stress of lying), your arousal goes up, and so does your heart rate and the activity of your sweat glands (the latter increases skin conductivity). My understanding is that methods of cheating polygraphs typically involve using concentration and physical props to elevate your heart rate with EACH question, thus masking the elevation that goes along with lying. I have heard of people keeping a thumbtack in their shoes and pressing a toe against it with each question. I am no expert, God knows, and I have no idea if this works.
 
the technique i use is to just not listen to anything the guy says. then just guess the answers. it always comes out inconclusive.
 
Originally posted by: Rkonster
First you want to beat federal drug tests, now fool the polygraph. Interesting. 😉
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/pulls out little black book and writes something down, then mutters "he knows too much" 😀
 
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
All a polygraph does is measure heart rate, blood pressure and perspiration (AFAIK). If you can either artificially elevate or depress your physiological processes then you can render a polygraph essentially useless (not that a polygraph is particularly reliable anyway). For example, if you learned meditation you could suppress your physiological systems and "fool" the polygraph.

It's really a fairly useless technology aside from the psychological effect it has on people if they happen to believe that it's accurate.

ZV
Click to expand...

They are fairly accurate if given by someone with experience and they are conclusive. If the test is inconclusive there is no chance to expect an opinion of the results to be accurate.

You would have to change your rates individually based on the question, because a wholesale change of the measured processes would still produce a valid test. The methods I am most familiar with are needles implanted in the cuff of a shirt, thumbtack under a toe, and manipulation of the control questions.
 
Originally posted by: Krassus
Originally posted by: Rkonster
First you want to beat federal drug tests, now fool the polygraph. Interesting. 😉
Click to expand...
/pulls out little black book and writes something down, then mutters "he knows too much" 😀
Click to expand...

Hahaha. I know nothing. Krassus who? 😀
 
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My God Man, By all accounts he IS Minendo....



...wait a minute, see if he has an underage drinking conviction. We'll know for sure then.😀
~wnied~
 
Originally posted by: Millennium
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
All a polygraph does is measure heart rate, blood pressure and perspiration (AFAIK). If you can either artificially elevate or depress your physiological processes then you can render a polygraph essentially useless (not that a polygraph is particularly reliable anyway). For example, if you learned meditation you could suppress your physiological systems and "fool" the polygraph.

It's really a fairly useless technology aside from the psychological effect it has on people if they happen to believe that it's accurate.

ZV
Click to expand...
They are fairly accurate if given by someone with experience and they are conclusive. If the test is inconclusive there is no chance to expect an opinion of the results to be accurate.

You would have to change your rates individually based on the question, because a wholesale change of the measured processes would still produce a valid test. The methods I am most familiar with are needles implanted in the cuff of a shirt, thumbtack under a toe, and manipulation of the control questions.
Click to expand...
If you could depress the rates sufficiently that they didn't raise in response to any question, or if you elevated the rates to such an extent that they didn't drop and couldn't raise I don't think it would be accurate. That's what I was thinking.

ZV
 
Don_Vido is correct. Very smart man. 🙂 THe following are measured in many polygraphs:

- Skin Conductance
- Respiration
- Heart Rate


One of my physiology classes dealt with polygraphs for about 75% of the semester. We got to play with one of the machines and had a licensed polygraphy expert come in and explain to us a lot of the ins and outs.

A polygraph is only as accurate as the person taking the measurements. Against a professional who's been in the business for 25+ years you can not really beat the system, even if you use one of those techniques.
 
Actually it's very easy to fool a polygraph . . . IF you can UNrelate the question with the answers you give (in other words, you prepare an answer based on a cued "response" instead of attaching any "meaning" to the question).

HOWITIS has the right idea . . . but if you want to PASS you have to do your "homework".
 
The primary idea behind a polygraph is not usually the physical data, but that the questioner will try to trick you into a lie. So get your story straight in your head and think before responding. If you get flustered, you're finished.
 
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
Originally posted by: Millennium
Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
All a polygraph does is measure heart rate, blood pressure and perspiration (AFAIK). If you can either artificially elevate or depress your physiological processes then you can render a polygraph essentially useless (not that a polygraph is particularly reliable anyway). For example, if you learned meditation you could suppress your physiological systems and "fool" the polygraph.

It's really a fairly useless technology aside from the psychological effect it has on people if they happen to believe that it's accurate.

ZV
Click to expand...
They are fairly accurate if given by someone with experience and they are conclusive. If the test is inconclusive there is no chance to expect an opinion of the results to be accurate.

You would have to change your rates individually based on the question, because a wholesale change of the measured processes would still produce a valid test. The methods I am most familiar with are needles implanted in the cuff of a shirt, thumbtack under a toe, and manipulation of the control questions.
Click to expand...
If you could depress the rates sufficiently that they didn't raise in response to any question, or if you elevated the rates to such an extent that they didn't drop and couldn't raise I don't think it would be accurate. That's what I was thinking.

ZV
Click to expand...

The problem is control rates are taken. It would be impossible for there not to be a change in rates between a control question and an actual question unless you were able to manipulate a variable each time.
 
Originally posted by: jaeger66
The primary idea behind a polygraph is not usually the physical data, but that the questioner will try to trick you into a lie. So get your story straight in your head and think before responding. If you get flustered, you're finished.
Click to expand...

Huh? Questions are made up way ahead of time and are not to trick you. They are looking for the response difference between a control positive, a control negative, and then the actual questions they want answers to.

 
Skully: "This is a simple lie detector test... we're going to ask you some questions, and you just answer them. Do you understand?"

Homer: "Yes."

*polygraph explodes*
 
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