Flooring help. Finishing nails to nail down engineered wood flooring? ** Fixed, with pics **

[Eug]

I had a very small water leak a couple of weeks back which cause a small part of my engineered wood flooring to bend a little bit so that it comes up. If I put a weight on it it flattens out just fine, but when I remove the weight it still comes up a bit (1 cm). I've had the weight there a week and no change.

Underneath the flooring is a bit of rubber, and underneath that is plywood.

Would finishing nails be strong enough to hold it down? I don't want to use real nails because they'd destroy the look.

EDIT:

Scroll down for pics.

 

[Ornery]

Would this do it for you?

 

[Eug]

Thanks for the post, but that wouldn't work. Engineered wood flooring is like laminate in that it comes in pieces that click together, and it's only about 1/4" thick I believe. See here. It's basically plywood or else laminate with wood on top. You can still sand the flooring, but it's not really true wood flooring in that there aren't true wood planks anywhere. I'd have nowhere to put those pins.

Furthermore, I can't access it from underneath. It seems my two options are to nail it down or else cut out that part and replace it unless someone has a better idea.

 

[Ornery]

How about this?

Can't get at it from underneath?

 

[Eug]

No, can't get at it from underneath. Underneath is a another floor, which has a drywalled ceiling. And remember, the engineered wood flooring is only about 1/4" or so thick.

 

[Ornery]

Actually, those floors are supposed to "float", so fastening it at all may not be a good idea. I assumed it was the joist or subfloor that swelled up. I'm surprised water affected it.

• How much water laid on there, and for how long?
• Are you sure the water is dry at this point?
• Did it not seep down to the drywalled ceiling below?
• The flooring is about 3/8" thick, and that's enough to screw to with careful measurements and/or tiny test holes.

 

[Eug]

It has come up right at the junction between my living room and kitchen (tile). So I can actually see it's just the flooring that's come up and the support structures underneath are just fine.

Fastening it may not be the best idea, but it's incredibly irritating to leave it as is as you may have guessed (given the location). I will try the finishing nail option, and nail it down at the edges and a few other places elsewhere, where there are knots in the wood. I'll wax over top with a coloured wax and then a lacquer on top to seal it. Or at least I think I will try it unless the Home Depot guys tell me I'm an idiot for even considering it.

EDIT:

I see you've edited your message.

Come to think of it, I think the flooring was a 1/2" thick, but you may be right.
It did seep into the ceiling/wall below. However, it's all dry now I've since fixed everything there. There was a patch of about 1 foot that needed repairing. In fact, I patched it a week ago, and haven't noticed anything since.

It wasn't a huge amount of water. The seepage was not from the heater itself. It was from the drain pan underneath it. I had been moving my washing machine a while back and unknowingly bent the drain hose spout, causing a very small leak.

 

[Ornery]

You'd have to nail at an angle to hold it down, then set the nail(s). A putty stick of the proper color is the best you could do, and no finish can be applied to that. Probably best to pre-drill the flooring as well.

 

[Eug]

Originally posted by: Ornery
You'd have to nail at an angle to hold it down, then set the nail(s). A putty stick of the proper color is the best you could do, and no finish can be applied to that. Probably best to pre-drill the flooring as well.

Hadn't thought of the angle part. Good point. However, I'm worried about the 1/4" of rubber underneath. That space between the plywood and the wood flooring might put too much strain on the nails if it's nailed at an angle, no?

I was thinking maybe just putting nail polish or clear polyurethane on top of the wax/putty.

The wood finish is clear. I've already tried clear polyurethane on another section I had sanded down. The colour is identical. (I had sanded it down because there were scratches all over it from a chair.)

 

[HomeBrewerDude]

How long has it been since you removed the water from the floor? Are you sure its completely dried out?

post a pic so we can see what you're talking about.

 

[Squisher]

I might try to inject some glue underneath if it wasn't a floating floor, but you're going to nail it any way. You should drill some very small pilot holes before you nail to keep from splitting the wood.


If you had a piece of scrap flooring, I might try to steam it to soften the wood, then try to hold it down with a very heavy weight, just as an experiment. Nailing into it when it's wet with steam probably would just splinter the wood.

 

[Eug]

Well, it's been over a week since I removed all the water.

Floor
Floor with a weight on it

BTW, I was wrong. It's not a 1 cm rise. It comes up about 4-5 mm.

EDIT:

I don't have a piece of scrap flooring. It was installed by the builder.

I will drill. Now to find some uber small drill bits...

 

[Kelemvor]

Call a flooring place and see what they recommend. THey might suggest pulling it up and replacing the sectoin that is damaged and then putting it all back down again.

 

[Ornery]

The wood won't split, because it doesn't have a grain. I'd drill it because it's so hard.

Too bad you already patched that section below. I'd screw up through the sub-floor, and pull it down that way. Drill a hole through the sub-floor the same diameter as the screw. From there you can measure how long the drywall screw would have to be, so it won't go through the flooring.

 

[Eug]

Originally posted by: FrankyJunior
Call a flooring place and see what they recommend. THey might suggest pulling it up and replacing the sectoin that is damaged and then putting it all back down again.

Heheh. I KNOW that's what they'll recommend. However, that's $$$$. It's also a major hassle.

I figure I can just do something like this to hold me over for a while for $20. Even it doesn't work, I can always just do what you suggest later, and remove the nails at that time.

 

[NascarFool]

Nail it through the trim pieces where it meets the tile. As mentioned before, pre-drill before you nail it.

 

[OffTopic1]

Quick fix solution is putting a nail through it, but it will buckle with time because it is a floating floor therefore it buckled when wet (glue, nails, stables can be use to fasten engineer floor boards).

There is nothing to stop you from putting nails through it because you can always replace the damaged boards at another time if the nailing method doesn?t produce a desire result. Most people would try to flatten it with a heavy object as you have try and 1 cm rise isn?t that bad if it doesn?t make any noise when you walk across it.

PS. Most engineer floor boards are 3/8 to 5/8 thick and aren?t that expensive to replace (I have seen as low as $3.00 sq foot)

[Edit]
It is easy to replace the floor boards after looking at the pics you provided, because the boards are on the edge.

Gently remove the transition strip and nail down the boards edge with finishing nail or screws then re apply the transition strip. Your floor might buckle because one of the edge is fastened down, however it is unlikely to rise because it is old flooring (had time to climatized) and is engineered therefore it have minimal lateral movement.

 

[CycloWizard]

You might try putting the weight on it and wetting it again. Leave the weight there until it dries.

The reason materials deform when they're wetted is because it soaks in and causes internal stresses. If you offset these stresses with the weight until the water is gone, it should go back to the original shape. It might take a little while, but it's practically free.

 

[OffTopic1]

Originally posted by: CycloWizard
You might try putting the weight on it and wetting it again. Leave the weight there until it dries.

The reason materials deform when they're wetted is because it soaks in and causes internal stresses. If you offset these stresses with the weight until the water is gone, it should go back to the original shape. It might take a little while, but it's practically free.

By the look of the pics that the OP posted it shown that the boards are pre finish therefore it is likely that rewet the floor boards will produce undesire water stain markings.

 

[Ornery]

Use a small countersink drill bit to drill through the transition molding, then screw in these spots. Drill deep enough to countersink the heads.

 

[HomeBrewerDude]

http://pics.bbzzdd.com/users/homebrewerdude/FloorNoWeight.JPG

 

[Eug]

Hmmm... I just removed part of the transition pieces, and to my surprise there looks to be some sort of soft cement like substance underneath. There was no rubber foam. ie. The wood is flush against the rubber. (It is not glued down, because I can see the plastic later in between.)

This is not what I expected. I thought I had seen rubber, but I guess I made a mistake because it was so dark.

I KNOW there is rubber elsewhere since I've seen it at the edge where the floor meets the stairs. I also have seen the plywood underneath as the house was being built. I am getting progressively more confused.

Drilling thru the transition piece seems like a good idea. I think I may nail down the piece under the transition piece, and then will nail down the transition piece as well.

 

[OffTopic1]

Originally posted by: Eug
Hmmm... I just removed part of the transition pieces, and to my surprise there looks to be some sort of soft cement like substance underneath. There was no rubber foam. ie. The wood is flush against the rubber. (It is not glued down, because I can see the plastic later in between.)

This is not what I expected. I thought I had seen rubber, but I guess I made a mistake because it was so dark.

I KNOW there is rubber elsewhere since I've seen it at the edge where the floor meets the stairs. I also have seen the plywood underneath as the house was being built. I am getting progressively more confused.

Drilling thru the transition piece seems like a good idea. I think I may nail down the piece under the transition piece, and then will nail down the transition piece as well.

You don't need to nail down the transition piece because most are designed with groove to grip/hold down the transition strip. However, glue can be use if desire.

PS. Is it possible to have a pic of the "soft cement like substance"?
Is it plumbing puddy or is it broken down rubber?

 

[Eug]

Originally posted by: Eug
Hmmm... I just removed part of the transition pieces, and to my surprise there looks to be some sort of soft cement like substance underneath. There was no rubber foam. ie. The wood is flush against the rubber.

Ooops. I meant flush against the soft cement like substance.

Anyways it is now fixed. Thx guys.

When I put in the screws, I encountered resistance in the wood, then no real resistance, then resistance again. It seems the soft cement like substance provides no strength. It must be the plywood underneath providing the strength for the screws.

I also put in a few finishing nails, but they proved to be useless. Maybe they're too short. My wood screws are two inches long. The finishing nails are 1 & 5/8". Or maybe they're just too small/weak.

P.S. Good deal at Canadian Tire. 90 drill bits for CAD$30. (I go thru 1/16th inch drill bits quite quickly, and this deal had 14 of them.)

 

[OffTopic1]

Originally posted by: Eug

Originally posted by: Eug
Hmmm... I just removed part of the transition pieces, and to my surprise there looks to be some sort of soft cement like substance underneath. There was no rubber foam. ie. The wood is flush against the rubber.

Ooops. I meant flush against the soft cement like substance.

Anyways it is now fixed. Thx guys.

When I put in the screws, I encountered resistance in the wood, then no real resistance, then resistance again. It seems the soft cement like substance provides no strength. It must be the plywood underneath providing the strength for the screws.

I also put in a few finishing nails, but they proved to be useless. Maybe they're too short. My wood screws are two inches long. The finishing nails are 1 & 5/8". Or maybe they're just too small/weak.

P.S. Good deal at Canadian Tire. 90 drill bits for CAD$30. (I go thru 1/16th inch drill bits quite quickly, and this deal had 14 of them.)

1 5/8 inch nails should be long enough because most vapor/foam are 1/4 inch or less and engineer flooring are 5/8 inch or less. That make a total of 7/8 inch therefore you have 3/4 into the sub flooring, and the requirement for tack down is 1/2 inch or more. It could be that nails are common fishing nails (no twist/rings for grip) therefore it didn?t provide enough strength to hold down the warp boards. Another problem is that it could be the boards are particle boards therefore it provide very little grip for the nails, or the ply wood/OSB are breaking down due to moisture/etc...