First time OCing, building computer, need help

[CletusTheDwarf]

Hey, I've never really had overclocking experience before, and i'm looking to build a new machine. I'm going to get an AMD Mobile Athlon 2400+ or 2500+ since I heard they are so amazing at overclocking. I found the Speeze WhisperRock 2 fan and heat synk for $10, can move 38 CFM and got some pretty good reviews.
For the motherboard i was looking at a shuttle nForce2 ultra 400 for $64, a Biostar nForce2 ultra 400 for $64, and a Gigabyte KT600 for $75 and a Gigabyte nForce2 ultra 400 for $77. I want a board that will provide a lot of flexability with overclocking for me, obviously a temp sensor, and decent speed (i realize i won't have the fastest machine) but i don't have the money for that.
Then for ram I want 512 mb. Is it worth spending the little extra money to get 2x256 and use the dual channel over the 1x512? Also, the chip is running at 333FSB, so some people told me it's pointless to get more than PC2700 ram, but if i overclock i don't want the ram holding me back so PC3200 should be worth it, right? Also, are certain brands better at OCing than others? I found some Corsair 512mb 3200 for $104, Mushkin 512 3200 for $100, OCZ pemier 256 3200 for $51. I know i'm throwing a lot out there, but I really need some direction. Right now I have a P3 1Ghz w/ 384 mb ram. So anything will be a huge increase. But money is definitley a factor too. Thanks for the help.

 

[Soulkeeper]

get a much better heatsink
screw those 10 dollar hunks of aluminum
get one of thermalrights slk heatsinks and the highest speed adjustable fan you can

i recommend getting the mobile 2500+ low voltage cpu from newegg
and the abit nf7-s v2.0 or their newer nf2 ultra400 motherboard
those two are my personal favorites

yes dual channel is worth it
get 256x2 or 512x2
get something with good timings too if you can
memory is a very important part of an overclocking rig so don't be afraid to spend say 10 or even 40 bucks more on one kind of mem than another

 

[BlueWeasel]

(1) Definately go with one of the mobile chips if you want to overclock. They are the best bang for the buck right now.
(2) I've never used any of those boards, but I've heard good things about Shuttle and Gigabyte boards. Just do a little searching and try to find out which boards have the best overclocking features. If it were me, I'd lean toward the Gigabyte Nforce2 Ultra board
(3) Since you are OC'ing, DON'T even consider getting PC2700 - Go with the PC3200. Dual channel is nice, but whatever you decide, go with the quality manufacturers like Corsair or Muskin.

Combine one of the mobile chips with a Nforce2 Ultra board and some PC3200, you should be looking at 2.4ghz easy.

 

[CletusTheDwarf]

how about this for a shuttle board?
here

 

[CletusTheDwarf]

also, i really have no idea about what a good fan for the chip is. can someone point me to a decent one on newegg for no more than $20?

 

[Fricardo]

Like they said, mobile is the way to go for overclocking.

Sorry to say but that HSF won't cut it if you plan on hitting high speeds you can pick up a Thermalright SLK-948U and Volcano 9 for ~53 bucks and that will really improve performance.

As far as RAM, yeah, faster timings will speed up your rig but high end RAM really isn't worth the price premium if you are on a budget. RAM latency doesn't affect AMD processors nearly as much as P4s. Frequency rating, on the other hand is important. You should get at least Pc 3200 for overclocking headroom. Good luck.

 

[CletusTheDwarf]

wow, i had no idea heatsinks were that much...it's almost more cost efficient to just get a better cpu...rather than spend $50 on a heatsink, i'd rather just loose some OCing ability

 

[Fricardo]

You posted those last two while I was writing lol. I meant to say the Vantec Tornado, which should be about $13 for just the fan.

 

[Fricardo]

Well, yeah, at $40 the SLK-948U is pretty expensive, but it will give you a lot of room. You should be able to hit 3200+ speeds or better with the overclock. That means you're effectively getting a processor that costs $100 more for $40, so if you look at it that way it definitlely pays.

 

[CletusTheDwarf]

well i'd need the heatsink too, right? the chip doesn't come with one, it's oem

 

[myocardia]

First of all, Cletus, Fricardo's confused. He's trying to talk you into buying a heatsink that won't fit on any Athlon XP. The Thermalright 948u is only for P4's and Athlon64's. If you do decide to go with the Shuttle AN35N, which I hear is a pretty decent board, this is the best heatsink you'll be able to use with it: Thermalright SLK-900a. I have one myself, cooling my mobile 2600 running at 2.5ghz, and have it paired with a 92mm Vantec Tornado. The 900a and the Tornado keep my processor at a maximum of 37C in a 70F room, and only 39C in a 78F room (forgot and turned the A/C off one day), under 100% load. But, you have no idea how loud that fan is, it makes roughly as much noise as a helicopter! And hey, I was the guy around here who always complained back to the people complaining about their computers making noise, it's not as if I'm a quiet freak, by any stretch of the imagination. As a matter of fact, I have four 12" subs in my car, and my car stereo only has two volumes (as far as I'm concerned)-- off and 153 spl. Anyway, if you aren't shooting for 2.5ghz, you should consider getting either the AN35N and an SLK-900a, or what I would buy if I were you, an Abit NF7: link and a Thermalright 947u: link, along with either the 92mm Vantec Tornado: link for outrageous, but loud cooling, or the Thermaltake A2017: link, which should move more than enough air at full speed to keep even a 2.5ghz Athlon cool when paired with a Thermalright heatsink, and also has a built-in speed adjustment. One last thing, if you aren't planning on pushing the chip you buy to it's limits, or just can't afford to spend more than $50 for a heatsink and a fan right now, with decent case airflow, this hsf seems to be good up to at least 2.3ghz: Speeze FalconRock. Good luck, whatever you choose, and welcome to the forums.

 

[CletusTheDwarf]

great post myocardia, very helpful, i appreciate it. my new questions are, since i'm not going to push it all the way, any reason not to save a few bucks and get the 2400 mobile as opposed to the 2500 mobile?
And as for motherboards, i'm just curious as to what your reasons are for recomending that abit mother board over like the Gigabyte nForce2 ultra 400 GA-7N400-L for $77 or the Shuttle one for $64. As far as i can tell specs are nearly identical. does the abit handle overclocking better or something?

 

[CletusTheDwarf]

and why is the speeze falconrock better than the speeze WhisperRock2, when the whisper rock2 pushes more air? is it the heatsink material?

 

[myocardia]

Okay, Cletus, I'm going to answer all of your new questions in one post. If you aren't looking for much more than 2.2ghz, there's absolutely no reason to waste your money on anything better (faster) than a mobile 2400. Even the new ones, which aren't overclocking nearly as high as the first ones with the best stepping did, they are still almost always making it to 2.3ghz. As far as motherboards, overclocking is an entirely different ballgame than not overclocking. The Abit motherboards (nearly all of them) are made specifically to overclock with. Therefore, if you want to overclock, that's what you should spend your money on. But, if you just can't bear to part with the extra $10 for the Abit NF7, you'd probably be fairly happy with the Shuttle AN35N. And the Speeze FalconRock has exactly the same fan as the WhisperRock II, but it has a copper core. Copper is very important for cooling, as you'll notice that all of the best heatsinks are made entirely of copper, which allows the best heat transfer and dissipation. If you have any more questions, feel free to ask.

 

[CletusTheDwarf]

ok, well since i'm not going to be overclocking to the full potential, will the Shuttle serve all my needs, or will it not have very many overclocking options at all? Also, this may be a stupid question, but is it standard for all boards to be able to tell you the tep of the cpu? For the processor, and if i were to get mobile 2400, do i have to worry with the slower fsb of 266 mhz as opposed to the 333 mhz of the barton 2500, or can i easily oc the FSB to the same as or more of the non-mobile. because that would be an issue in gaming, right?

 

[myocardia]

Okay, since you quite obviously have your mind made up on getting the Shuttle AN35N, I'm not going to try to talk you out of it, since that would just be a waste of my time. Just remember this, though: if you get it, and it doesn't have all of the overclocking options required (processor or ram voltage adjustments, etc), then it's going to cost you quite a bit more than $10 to send it back, after you insure the package and pay the 15% restocking fee. As far as increasing the fsb on the mobiles, the only reason they are quoted to run at a 133fsb is because the only Athlon XP chipset for laptops has a 133fsb. Most run much higher than 200mhz fsb. One guy around here runs his at 250 fsb! There's never been a "normal" Barton that got that high, without more than 2.0 or 2.2v.

 

[CletusTheDwarf]

no, i don't want to sound like i'm fighting you on the motherboard issue, i just want to see why you rate one over the other, make as educated of a purchase as possible. and since i'm not going all out on cooling, and won't be able to OC to the chip's full potential, woudl I even use the extra OC options made available on the abit board? and how about the gigabyte board? is the abit better in your opinion?

so from what you're saying, there is pretty much no reason to get the barton 2500 as opposed to the 2500 or 2400 mobile, correct?

also, how careful do I have to be about getting ram that is name brand? I'm going to be getting 512mb of PC3200 ram, probably 2x256, because i think that the 2 sticks for dual channel is worth the extra price. Do i need to get special ram to take advantage of the dual channel? or will any ram work? I found some OCZ premier series with cas 2.5-3-3-7 2T for $51 for a 256 stick. how would that suit me? would i end up OCing the ram too or will that probably remain stock?

 

[BlindBartimaeus]

Here is my two cents and I hope it helps:

I have run the NF7-S, AN35 Ultra, Albatron KX18 II, 8RDA+, Biostar MC something or another pro, and the shuttle is as good as any of them IF...you don't care about soundstorm, or need to have monster overvolt for the ram, or serial ATA. The big issue with the shuttle which isn't all that big is that you must use some 2.5 volt ram for best mobo happiness. I had Corsair XMS that was 2.6 volt stuff that the board HATED in dual channel, single channel, or even English channel. Bought some cheap 2.5 volt Kreton 3200 and it was cruising along at 215 Front side bus. It may have a few less bios settings but it is very stable and a great buy for the buck. With a mobile it should be more than adequate.

I would look at SVC at this HSF:

http://www.svc.com/ac2mcopsil.html

It is cheap and it cools a regular barton to 2.4 gig @ 1.8 volts

Hope that helps

 

[myocardia]

Okay, Cletus, for the third time now, I and almost everyone else around here agrees that the Abit NF7's are the best overclocking boards, period. One or two people have DFI boards, and really like them, also. I personally think that you should spend the extra $10 on the NF7 non-S. If you don't want to, that's your business, since it's your money. IF you decide not to, you're crazy if you don't get the Shuttle AN35N; it's the only other motherboard in that price range worth buying. But, all of the people who have upgraded from an AN35N to an NF7-S are extremely happy that they did. Take it for what it's worth. Even if you aren't looking for an extremely high clockspeed (mhz), you get performance from having a higher fsb. Maybe you just don't understand overclocking. 10.5x210 will be faster than 11x200, always, in every situation, and not because of the 5 mhz clockspeed difference. And if you're sure that you won't ever want more than 512MB of ram, buy 2x256MB sticks. If you just can't afford two 512MB sticks of good ram now, you would be better off running one 512 stick until next month (or whenever), so you could run 2x512MB sticks in dual-channel, which is the optimum configuration these days. Last on the list, no, there's no need to buy a dual-channel kit. As long as you buy a second stick that's the same brand and same speed and same timings, you won't have problems.

 

[Verdant]

Originally posted by: Soulkeeper
get a much better heatsink
screw those 10 dollar hunks of aluminum
get one of thermalrights slk heatsinks and the highest speed adjustable fan you can

i recommend getting the mobile 2500+ low voltage cpu from newegg
and the abit nf7-s v2.0 or their newer nf2 ultra400 motherboard
those two are my personal favorites

yes dual channel is worth it
get 256x2 or 512x2
get something with good timings too if you can
memory is a very important part of an overclocking rig so don't be afraid to spend say 10 or even 40 bucks more on one kind of mem than another

these are great choices
but if you want to spend a little less
try the 2400+
with the NF7
and for the heatsink, i highly reccomend the vantec tmd aeroflow... its like 20$ or something and is actually one of the best hsf units i have used.

 

[Falloutboy]

I agree with verdant go with a Vantec Aeroflo great HSF i'm running one with great luck.

get a NF7 or a AN7 mb ther are the best overclockers on the cheaper side.

go with 3200 ram I made the mistake of going with 2700 and i'm stuck at 190FSB or so

If it was me I would get a 2400 thier a fair amount cheaper than the 2500 last I checked. and the 2500 doens't seem to have a any higher percentage for high overclocks

I'm currently running:
AMD 2400 Mobile 13.5x187 for 2.52ghz
Vantec Aeroflo HSF with AS5
Abit NF7-S
Crucial 2700 512mb (my weak link right now)
ATI 9500np 383core/315mem

I had a AN35 in my previous board and its ok. very few tweaking otions on the ram side which restricted me, only could get 170fsb out of my ram on that board. also the extra options ont he NF7-S are worth it because you don't really need any other cards for sound, sata, or firewire

 

[Rugger]

My 2 cents...

I just picked up an Abit NF-7 (non-S) rev 2, an XP-M 2500, and a gig of Corsair Value PC3200 RAM. I'm using that $10 Speeze HSF combo.

I'm running at 12x200 (2400mhz) with a 1.7v on the CPU and the RAM at full 400mhz Dual channel. I'm a tiny smidge from stable at 12.5x200 (2500mhz).

Seriously, spend the money and get the Abit board.

- Rugger