FIOS HD Channel Expansion

[spidey07]

nm

I'm tired of people regurgitating what they read on the intarweb and taking it as truth, without any understanding of that of which they speak. If you have to use a forum to backup you point, you have fallen victim to the "it's on the intarweb, it must be true".

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

when is it coming to bergen!!!!!!???

 

[Lurknomore]

Just hope the workers reach a contract by Aug. 2.
Phone, internet, and hopefully Fios HD- are currently verizon so they'd better get this settled quickly.

 

[spacejamz]

here in north Dallas, Time warner just added these HD stations a few weeks ago:

CNN
WTBS
HGTV
A&E
FOOD
Vs
Fox Sports SW
National Geographic
History Channel
Animal Planet

I asked if Sci Fi was coming and they replied 'not anytime soon'...

 

[rh71]

Originally posted by: Sinsear
I :heart: my FIOS. Time to relearn the channels though.

this.

Sometimes on HDT they have serene scapes in full HD and sound, like oceans on an early morning and you can just wake up to it... it's great.

Now if FIOS can just get VS HD and NHL Center Ice packaging (which I think they may finally have), I'll be in heaven.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: spidey07
Very impressive. Would be concerned about compression.

Very little if any compression on the fiber.

Cable (Optimum online) however has a lot of compression.

They just within the last month dumped a bunch of local access channels so they can squeeze more compressed HD channels in.

Verizon requires contract and adds a shit load of fees to the final price.

Not worth it.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: ScottMac

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues

Originally posted by: Zorro

Originally posted by: spidey07
Very impressive. Would be concerned about compression.

no compression they transmit what the VHO receives.

yep. its not completely true when they say no compression because the providers of the channels do compress otherwise it would be insane bandwidth - but Verizon does not add ANY additional compression once they get it unlike some other providers.

I don't think that's true.

Even though they are on fiber, they transmit their "cable tv" using conventional cable TV signaling on 1550nm in "overlay mode." It's no different than any other cable provider's signaling (fiber or not). That mode of transmission has constraints just like any other cable TV signaling.

http://www.mocalliance.org/en/...he_next_Technology.asp

not traditional. Verizon has taken a very different approach, using a significantly higher frequency range on the moca network in the home. verizon can do this because it is fiber to the premises, therefore doesn't have to concern itself with distance considerations over fiber. whereas cable companies have to use the limited range of frequencies on the cable lines under 1000 mhz. verizon uses frequencies up to 1500 mhz. this range of frequencies up to 1500 is also verizons biggest problem because in order to get installs done in a timely fashion, most field techs are using existing coax networks in homes. that's why verizon tv menus are notoriously slow and VOD tends to have tiling, in homes where the coax networks are insufficient to handle the demands of fios tv. when i got fios, i had to go in and change out all the splitters in my home from 5 to 1000 mhz splitters to 5 to 1500 mhz splitters.

 

[ScottMac]

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues
i understood. he was implying that in the end they are all restricted by the same backbone.

but that is incorrect, they are not all on the same capability networks:

"An interesting thread over in the AVSForums discusses how Comcast is sacrificing HD image quality as it faces competitive pressure on the HD front from both DirecTV and Verizon. Verizon obviously has ample capacity thanks to their FTTH/coax network (with GPON upgrades and all-IP on the way), and DirecTV decided to dump broadband and focus their satellite capacity on MPEG-4 HD back in 2004. Comcast on the other hand, waiting for DOCSIS 3.0, has started cramming three HD channels into each 38.8Mbps QAM, reducing image quality"

http://www.dslreports.com/show...-Quality-Vs-FiOS-92969

bwahahahhahaahahahaahhaha

What is this magical "backbone" that you speak of? Beware of things you read on the intarweb and google. They are most likely not true.

it doesnt matter if i understood the exact technical nature of his post because i understood the gist of it. substitute backbone for format or whatever he meant, i got the gist of it.

turns out i was right, verizon does not compress things further while comcast, amongst some other major providers, does. i then gave links.

i suggest you read and edumacate yourself a bit.


cheers 🙂

The issue is not the backbone (at least in this case); it's the span from the DSLAM to the house. The issue is that the signal is delivered on a single lambda (wavelength of light, of three that are carried) which is modulated with essentially the same signaling used by cable companies ... so fiber or not, it's subject to bandwidth constraints the same as copper ("overlay" means it's essentially operating in "copper emulation" mode similar to "digital cable"...).

FIOS and U-Verse use *EXACTLY* they same infrastructure (Alcatel), for example, in their fiber-to-the-home (fiber to the prem, whatever). The ONLY difference is that FIOS uses overlay mode for video (on 1550nm), and U-Verse uses straight-up IPTV (video / audio delivered over Ethernet ... which appears as "fractional Gigabit Ethernet").

Overlay mode is (with rare circumstantial exception) constrained by protocol as well as bandwidth, where IPTV is pretty much only constrained by bandwidth.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: ScottMac

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues
i understood. he was implying that in the end they are all restricted by the same backbone.

but that is incorrect, they are not all on the same capability networks:

"An interesting thread over in the AVSForums discusses how Comcast is sacrificing HD image quality as it faces competitive pressure on the HD front from both DirecTV and Verizon. Verizon obviously has ample capacity thanks to their FTTH/coax network (with GPON upgrades and all-IP on the way), and DirecTV decided to dump broadband and focus their satellite capacity on MPEG-4 HD back in 2004. Comcast on the other hand, waiting for DOCSIS 3.0, has started cramming three HD channels into each 38.8Mbps QAM, reducing image quality"

http://www.dslreports.com/show...-Quality-Vs-FiOS-92969

bwahahahhahaahahahaahhaha

What is this magical "backbone" that you speak of? Beware of things you read on the intarweb and google. They are most likely not true.

it doesnt matter if i understood the exact technical nature of his post because i understood the gist of it. substitute backbone for format or whatever he meant, i got the gist of it.

turns out i was right, verizon does not compress things further while comcast, amongst some other major providers, does. i then gave links.

i suggest you read and edumacate yourself a bit.


cheers 🙂

The issue is not the backbone (at least in this case); it's the span from the DSLAM to the house. The issue is that the signal is delivered on a single lambda (wavelength of light, of three that are carried) which is modulated with essentially the same signaling used by cable companies ... so fiber or not, it's subject to bandwidth constraints the same as copper ("overlay" means it's essentially operating in "copper emulation" mode similar to "digital cable"...).

FIOS and U-Verse use *EXACTLY* they same infrastructure (Alcatel), for example, in their fiber-to-the-home (fiber to the prem, whatever). The ONLY difference is that FIOS uses overlay mode for video (on 1550nm), and U-Verse uses straight-up IPTV (video / audio delivered over Ethernet ... which appears as "fractional Gigabit Ethernet").

Overlay mode is (with rare circumstantial exception) constrained by protocol as well as bandwidth, where IPTV is pretty much only constrained by bandwidth.

the link i posted above shows it's not exactly as you say. fios has chosen to divide it up. the bulk of "traditional" television, broadcast stations SD and HD are sent on the 1550. however they send the VOD and Menus over the IPTV. so, it has some similarities to the uverse and it definitely has an advantage over cable.

 

[Reckoner]

FX HD? The Fuck?

 

[Goosemaster]

Originally posted by: PaulNEPats
FX HD? The Fuck?

 

[ultimatebob]

Heh... I'm still trying to figure out what Cable companies Spidey works for. No matter how lousy their service or support is, he can always find a kind word to say about them 🙂

 

[ScottMac]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: ScottMac

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues
i understood. he was implying that in the end they are all restricted by the same backbone.

but that is incorrect, they are not all on the same capability networks:

"An interesting thread over in the AVSForums discusses how Comcast is sacrificing HD image quality as it faces competitive pressure on the HD front from both DirecTV and Verizon. Verizon obviously has ample capacity thanks to their FTTH/coax network (with GPON upgrades and all-IP on the way), and DirecTV decided to dump broadband and focus their satellite capacity on MPEG-4 HD back in 2004. Comcast on the other hand, waiting for DOCSIS 3.0, has started cramming three HD channels into each 38.8Mbps QAM, reducing image quality"

http://www.dslreports.com/show...-Quality-Vs-FiOS-92969

bwahahahhahaahahahaahhaha

What is this magical "backbone" that you speak of? Beware of things you read on the intarweb and google. They are most likely not true.

it doesnt matter if i understood the exact technical nature of his post because i understood the gist of it. substitute backbone for format or whatever he meant, i got the gist of it.

turns out i was right, verizon does not compress things further while comcast, amongst some other major providers, does. i then gave links.

i suggest you read and edumacate yourself a bit.


cheers 🙂

The issue is not the backbone (at least in this case); it's the span from the DSLAM to the house. The issue is that the signal is delivered on a single lambda (wavelength of light, of three that are carried) which is modulated with essentially the same signaling used by cable companies ... so fiber or not, it's subject to bandwidth constraints the same as copper ("overlay" means it's essentially operating in "copper emulation" mode similar to "digital cable"...).

FIOS and U-Verse use *EXACTLY* they same infrastructure (Alcatel), for example, in their fiber-to-the-home (fiber to the prem, whatever). The ONLY difference is that FIOS uses overlay mode for video (on 1550nm), and U-Verse uses straight-up IPTV (video / audio delivered over Ethernet ... which appears as "fractional Gigabit Ethernet").

Overlay mode is (with rare circumstantial exception) constrained by protocol as well as bandwidth, where IPTV is pretty much only constrained by bandwidth.

the link i posted above shows it's not exactly as you say. fios has chosen to divide it up. the bulk of "traditional" television, broadcast stations SD and HD are sent on the 1550. however they send the VOD and Menus over the IPTV. so, it has some similarities to the uverse and it definitely has an advantage over cable.

That article you linked doesn't describe which of the available features of GPON that FIOS actually uses; it describes what's available, and where MoCA comes into play. Good link by the way, thanks.

Don't assume that because the facility is available that it is being used.

Either FIOS or U-Verse (or DirecTV or DISH, for that matter) generally outperform cable (certainly for HD, and likely SD as well) in many / most markets, especially at the highest urban / metro densities.

I don't have any info about what / who FIOS uses for the gateway / set-top, so I can't really address the point-of-use capabilities / features.

 

[metalmania]

My TWC has FREE HD channels including Animal Planet and CNN.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: ScottMac

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: ScottMac

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: idiotekniQues
i understood. he was implying that in the end they are all restricted by the same backbone.

but that is incorrect, they are not all on the same capability networks:

"An interesting thread over in the AVSForums discusses how Comcast is sacrificing HD image quality as it faces competitive pressure on the HD front from both DirecTV and Verizon. Verizon obviously has ample capacity thanks to their FTTH/coax network (with GPON upgrades and all-IP on the way), and DirecTV decided to dump broadband and focus their satellite capacity on MPEG-4 HD back in 2004. Comcast on the other hand, waiting for DOCSIS 3.0, has started cramming three HD channels into each 38.8Mbps QAM, reducing image quality"

http://www.dslreports.com/show...-Quality-Vs-FiOS-92969

bwahahahhahaahahahaahhaha

What is this magical "backbone" that you speak of? Beware of things you read on the intarweb and google. They are most likely not true.

it doesnt matter if i understood the exact technical nature of his post because i understood the gist of it. substitute backbone for format or whatever he meant, i got the gist of it.

turns out i was right, verizon does not compress things further while comcast, amongst some other major providers, does. i then gave links.

i suggest you read and edumacate yourself a bit.


cheers 🙂

The issue is not the backbone (at least in this case); it's the span from the DSLAM to the house. The issue is that the signal is delivered on a single lambda (wavelength of light, of three that are carried) which is modulated with essentially the same signaling used by cable companies ... so fiber or not, it's subject to bandwidth constraints the same as copper ("overlay" means it's essentially operating in "copper emulation" mode similar to "digital cable"...).

FIOS and U-Verse use *EXACTLY* they same infrastructure (Alcatel), for example, in their fiber-to-the-home (fiber to the prem, whatever). The ONLY difference is that FIOS uses overlay mode for video (on 1550nm), and U-Verse uses straight-up IPTV (video / audio delivered over Ethernet ... which appears as "fractional Gigabit Ethernet").

Overlay mode is (with rare circumstantial exception) constrained by protocol as well as bandwidth, where IPTV is pretty much only constrained by bandwidth.

the link i posted above shows it's not exactly as you say. fios has chosen to divide it up. the bulk of "traditional" television, broadcast stations SD and HD are sent on the 1550. however they send the VOD and Menus over the IPTV. so, it has some similarities to the uverse and it definitely has an advantage over cable.

That article you linked doesn't describe which of the available features of GPON that FIOS actually uses; it describes what's available, and where MoCA comes into play. Good link by the way, thanks.

Don't assume that because the facility is available that it is being used.

Either FIOS or U-Verse (or DirecTV or DISH, for that matter) generally outperform cable (certainly for HD, and likely SD as well) in many / most markets, especially at the highest urban / metro densities.

I don't have any info about what / who FIOS uses for the gateway / set-top, so I can't really address the point-of-use capabilities / features.

actually, i happen to work for verizon fios and i know that indeed, fios does use as i posted above the 1550 overlay for sd and hd broadcasts and the 1390 for data, vod and program info.

fios, is so far ahead of the rest in technology, it's not even close, having fiber to the premises is a HUGE step. if there is one beloved patriot in the fios armor it's the in house implementation. but, if you have good clean wiring in your home for coax and all your splitters are up to par, fios is without question, the best available option.

 

[RagingBITCH]

I'm still waiting for my damn new HD channels on FIOS, still don't have it. :| Tired of watching some of this crap in regular SD...it looks like arse on my TV.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
I'm still waiting for my damn new HD channels on FIOS, still don't have it. :| Tired of watching some of this crap in regular SD...it looks like arse on my TV.

ya, i don't have it yet here in east pa. waiting for channel realignment.

 

[Sho'Nuff]

Just got the notice in the mail up here in Boston. We're getting the new lineup on August 26.