Federal judge blocks Biden vaccine mandate for health care workers nationwide

[weblooker2021]

Your reading comprehension skills are severely lacking along with your logic. I’ll try and dumb it down for you: if OSHA has the power to regulate health care offices then they sure as shit have the power to regulate other workplaces. Feel free to prove me wrong though, find where in the law that says health care workers are to be treated differently than any other workplace.

OSHA didn't issue regulation requiring health care workers to get vaccinated. Health care mandate was issued by CMS

 

[NWRMidnight]

No but lets use hard hat as an argument for Covid. Say there was great danger of someone walking down the sidewalk and hitting them on the head . OSHA do not regulate the actual construction standard, would it be appropriate to require every single person in any company that employee over 100 to wear hard hat? What about those with 99 employees are they in less of a risk of getting injured from something falling on their head? How about those driving 18 wheeler, are they in much danger? The problem is the regulation that OSHA issued is too broad and congress didn't do great job in making it clear what they really mean when they wrote the law.

To broad is a bullshit argument. It's an excuse. The US Constitution is broad (for reasons), yet, you only have issues with a law being to broad when it doesn't serve your interests, and people like you like to manipulate the constitution and laws to serve your narrative.

You can't even grasp why there are employee limits (100 or more, 50 or more, etc) put in place for most regulations, including other OSHA regulations. Hell the cares act had such language, but it was 500 or less. It's because companies with 100 or less employees are usually considered small businesses, and in most cases, do not have the financial means to pay for such regulations. The purpose, which is why it appears to the uneducated idiots such as yourself as being to broad, is to protect many people in the workplace as possible, and at the same time, not put small businesses out of business.

There is also the multiplier factor. What I mean by this is the more employees you have the chances of exposure to such hazards increase exponentially. This includes COVID.

Just so you know, truck drivers are required to wear hard hats when they are loading/unloading, walking into any facility that OSHA requires hard hats. Even regular non employee guests, (a customer, an investor, etc) are also required to wear hard hats in such designated areas per OSHA standards.

What it comes down to is the only thing that was/is to broad is your knowledge on OSHA, the laws, and pretty much everything you try to argue. In short, you know very little about what you are trying to argue.

 

[NWRMidnight]

OSHA didn't issue regulation requiring health care workers to get vaccinated. Health care mandate was issued by CMS

Can you point us to where Congress has given CMS the authority to mandate such regulations for Health Care Workers?

 

[weblooker2021]

Can you point us to where Congress has given CMS the authority to mandate such regulations for Health Care Workers?

It's not regulation that require workers to get vaccinated. It's requirement to continue accepting medicare/medicaid. Any doctor that do not accept medicare/medicaid is not subject to this regulation and will not have to get vaccinated as result of CMS.

 

[NWRMidnight]

It's not regulation that require workers to get vaccinated. It's requirement to continue accepting medicare/medicaid. Any doctor that do not accept medicare/medicaid is not subject to this regulation and will not have to get vaccinated as result of CMS.

regulation/requirement/mandate, same thing, so again, can you direct us to where Congress has given the CMS the authority to issue such mandate? Why they issues the mandate was not my question. Don't pussy foot around the question I am asking, answer it, if you can.

 

[weblooker2021]

regulation/requirement/mandate, same thing, so again, can you direct us to where Congress has given them the authority to issue such mandate?

I will let CMS answer that

"Q: Why didn’t CMS include all health care settings?
A: CMS is using the authority established by Congress under the Social Security Act to regulate
Medicare and Medicaid-certified health facilities. Sections 1102 and 1871 of the Social Security
Act (the Act) grant the Secretary of Health and Human Services general authority to make and
publish such rules and regulations, not inconsistent with the Act, as may be necessary to the
efficient administration of the functions with which the Secretary is charged. Citations to the
relevant statutory authorities for each specific type of provider and supplier are set out in the
discussion of each provider- and supplier-specific provision of the regulation. This authority
does not extend to certain facilities nor independent physicians/clinicians. "
link

 

[fskimospy]

No but lets use hard hat as an argument for Covid. Say there was great danger of someone walking down the sidewalk and hitting them on the head . OSHA do not regulate the actual construction standard, would it be appropriate to require every single person in any company that employee over 100 to wear hard hat? What about those with 99 employees are they in less of a risk of getting injured from something falling on their head? How about those driving 18 wheeler, are they in much danger? The problem is the regulation that OSHA issued is too broad and congress didn't do great job in making it clear what they really mean when they wrote the law.

If every employee was at risk of having something heavy dropped on their heads then yes it would make sense.

You’re trying to have it both ways - before you said Congress should have given OSHA a blanket authorization for this sort of rule. Then when you found out Congress did exactly what you suggest, you claim it’s too broad.

You’re doing the same thing SCOTUS did - putting your preferred outcome first and the law second. Both you (and they) should just admit you don’t care what the law says.

 

[NWRMidnight]

I will let CMS answer that

"Q: Why didn’t CMS include all health care settings?
A: CMS is using the authority established by Congress under the Social Security Act to regulate
Medicare and Medicaid-certified health facilities. Sections 1102 and 1871 of the Social Security
Act (the Act) grant the Secretary of Health and Human Services general authority to make and
publish such rules and regulations, not inconsistent with the Act, as may be necessary to the
efficient administration of the functions with which the Secretary is charged. Citations to the
relevant statutory authorities for each specific type of provider and supplier are set out in the
discussion of each provider- and supplier-specific provision of the regulation. This authority
does not extend to certain facilities nor independent physicians/clinicians. "
link

Did you read what you posted? It says the secretary of health has the authority, not CMS as the CMS is not the secretary of health. To extend that clarification, CMS is Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services.

So, CMS is piggy backing off an authorization that Congress gave the secretary of health authority to do, but not the CMS, and the SCOTUS ruled in favor of such action. But ruled against OSHA, who Congress specifically gave the authority to make such regulations in the workplace.

Edit: section 1102 and 1871 of the social security act has nothing to do with mandating health and safety regulations of doctors or staff. Both sections have to do with administration of the insurance programs efficiently. So their hasn't been any authorization given by Congress for the secretary of health, or the CMS to issue any such mandate in regards to vaccinations or any other health and safety requirements.

So the SCOTUS ruled in favor of an institution that has no authority to make such a regulation, and against the very institution that has full authority granted by Congress. Yet, you can't seem to grasp the problem with their rulings and oblivious to why they had NOTHING to do with the law(s) or the constitution.

 

[DaaQ]

Honestly this whole thing could have been avoided and Biden could have avoided losing so much political capital with independents if they had done what I proposed several pages back:

-mandates where they are allowed or make sense (healthcare, military, travel?)
-go all out on other therapeutics while still pushing the vaccine (Biden's Operation Warp Speed)
-should have gotten the jump earlier on more testing kits for home
-start expanding surge capabilities of major medical centers (longer term goal)

His COVID approval rating is now also below 50% and I can't tell if it's because people think he hasn't done enough or because of mandates?

Stop trying to treat this like an acute issue that will pass. COVID is here to stay. We need to start thinking longer term instead of a simple minded "vax or else" mindset. And yes, a lot of that includes how we approach the unvaccinated - likel it or not we probably won't move the needle on vaccination any further, even if a truly deadly variant emerges. Time to be flexible and pivot to a new strategy that accounts for this.

Bold underlined part.

My work prior to this BS ruling, stated that home tests weekly would not suffice, the employees that won't get the shot would have to pass weekly tests administered at a health care facility.

They also tied the vaccine to our yearly healthcare discount, where in prior years, a biometric screening passing 3 of 5 metrics would grant the full discount, this year the biometric screening will only get us 50% discount, vaccine required for the full 100%.
Granted I am not saying 100% of our premiums, it really amounts to about 100 dollars a month.

 

[DaaQ]

No but lets use hard hat as an argument for Covid. Say there was great danger of someone walking down the sidewalk and hitting them on the head . OSHA do not regulate the actual construction standard, would it be appropriate to require every single person in any company that employee over 100 to wear hard hat? What about those with 99 employees are they in less of a risk of getting injured from something falling on their head? How about those driving 18 wheeler, are they in much danger? The problem is the regulation that OSHA issued is too broad and congress didn't do great job in making it clear what they really mean when they wrote the law.

Lets use hardhats again, do you think it is acceptable to wear a hard hat in an attic or crawlspace?

Now this most likely is NOT OSHA mandated, but I can tell you employers DO mandate it. Because you can put a nail in your head in an attic or crawlspace.

So employer mandated, is that still an issue too?

 

[UNCjigga]

Judge in Texas blocks enforcement of federal employee vaccine mandate nationwide

A Texas federal judge on Friday blocked the Biden administration from enforcing a vaccine mandate for federal employees, dealing another blow to President Joe Biden's campaign to increase the country's lackluster vaccination rate.

www.cnn.com

Meanwhile, some Trumpist Federalist piece of shit judge Judy blocked the vaccine mandate for all federal employees. Not contractors…employees. As in the Federal Government can’t blood test you anymore for service requirements, or make you pee in a cup. Oh but wait…judge says this only applies to COVID-19 vax requirements because of SCOTUS precedent that’s barely a week old.

"The President certainly possesses 'broad statutory authority to regulate executive branch employment policies,'" Brown wrote. "But the Supreme Court has expressly held that a COVID-19 vaccine mandate is not an employment regulation. And that means the President was without statutory authority to issue the federal worker mandate."

They’re not pretending to be constitutionalists any more.

 

[fskimospy]

Judge in Texas blocks enforcement of federal employee vaccine mandate nationwide

A Texas federal judge on Friday blocked the Biden administration from enforcing a vaccine mandate for federal employees, dealing another blow to President Joe Biden's campaign to increase the country's lackluster vaccination rate.

www.cnn.com

Meanwhile, some Trumpist Federalist piece of shit judge Judy blocked the vaccine mandate for all federal employees. Not contractors…employees. As in the Federal Government can’t blood test you anymore for service requirements, or make you pee in a cup. Oh but wait…judge says this only applies to COVID-19 vax requirements because of SCOTUS precedent that’s barely a week old.

"The President certainly possesses 'broad statutory authority to regulate executive branch employment policies,'" Brown wrote. "But the Supreme Court has expressly held that a COVID-19 vaccine mandate is not an employment regulation. And that means the President was without statutory authority to issue the federal worker mandate."

They’re not pretending to be constitutionalists any more.

I like how a few years back they ruled the CFPB director structure unconstitutional because the president was head of the unitary executive and must have the ability to hire and fire any member of the executive branch for any reason or no reason. Except this reason I guess.

Really though this is once again some loony district judge who doesn’t have much of any real power.

 

[nickqt]

Judge in Texas blocks enforcement of federal employee vaccine mandate nationwide

A Texas federal judge on Friday blocked the Biden administration from enforcing a vaccine mandate for federal employees, dealing another blow to President Joe Biden's campaign to increase the country's lackluster vaccination rate.

www.cnn.com

Meanwhile, some Trumpist Federalist piece of shit judge Judy blocked the vaccine mandate for all federal employees. Not contractors…employees. As in the Federal Government can’t blood test you anymore for service requirements, or make you pee in a cup. Oh but wait…judge says this only applies to COVID-19 vax requirements because of SCOTUS precedent that’s barely a week old.

"The President certainly possesses 'broad statutory authority to regulate executive branch employment policies,'" Brown wrote. "But the Supreme Court has expressly held that a COVID-19 vaccine mandate is not an employment regulation. And that means the President was without statutory authority to issue the federal worker mandate."

They’re not pretending to be constitutionalists any more.

The more Republicans that get COVID, the sooner we can Make America Great Again.

Quit fighting it. They want COVID. Please, take a step back, relax, and let them get it and spread it amongst themselves.

 

[akugami]

Judge in Texas blocks enforcement of federal employee vaccine mandate nationwide

A Texas federal judge on Friday blocked the Biden administration from enforcing a vaccine mandate for federal employees, dealing another blow to President Joe Biden's campaign to increase the country's lackluster vaccination rate.

www.cnn.com

Meanwhile, some Trumpist Federalist piece of shit judge Judy blocked the vaccine mandate for all federal employees. Not contractors…employees. As in the Federal Government can’t blood test you anymore for service requirements, or make you pee in a cup. Oh but wait…judge says this only applies to COVID-19 vax requirements because of SCOTUS precedent that’s barely a week old.

"The President certainly possesses 'broad statutory authority to regulate executive branch employment policies,'" Brown wrote. "But the Supreme Court has expressly held that a COVID-19 vaccine mandate is not an employment regulation. And that means the President was without statutory authority to issue the federal worker mandate."

They’re not pretending to be constitutionalists any more.

Biden needs to grow a bigger pair. Do what Trump did. Just say screw this shit. Pass the mandate. And whichever worker defies it is fired. Revoke their access to the work place. Stop paying them. Then let the courts come. And give the finger to the courts. That's basically what Trump did. These conservative judicials aren't even bothering to read and understand the law. It's not even about interpretation of a vague law, it's the judges not even caring. So if that's the case, why should the executive branch care. Just fire everyone who doesn't follow their bosses orders. And ultimately (and within reason), the POTUS is the boss of the executive branch.

 

[NWRMidnight]

Biden needs to grow a bigger pair. Do what Trump did. Just say screw this shit. Pass the mandate. And whichever worker defies it is fired. Revoke their access to the work place. Stop paying them. Then let the courts come. And give the finger to the courts. That's basically what Trump did. These conservative judicials aren't even bothering to read and understand the law. It's not even about interpretation of a vague law, it's the judges not even caring. So if that's the case, why should the executive branch care. Just fire everyone who doesn't follow their bosses orders. And ultimately (and within reason), the POTUS is the boss of the executive branch.

We already have one party, and many of their constituents, who completely disregards the rule of law, I don't think both parties ignoring the rule of law, even when such rulings are not truly based on law or the constitution, would be a good thing. It would be the final step in this country turning into a full blown Anarchy. What we do need to do is hold these judges accountable, and start removing them (impeaching them), which includes the SCOTUS judges, when they make rulings that are not based on law, the constitution, and/or decades of set precedent. Specially when some of the SCOTUS judges are violating their oath, and their authority by making legislation, IE not applying the law, but changing the interpretation of what the language says in a law, and expecting that interpretation to be carried out going forward which equates to making legislation, which is per the constitution the job of Congress, not the SCOTUS.

 

[Zorba]

We already have one party, and many of their constituents, who completely disregards the rule of law, I don't think both parties ignoring the rule of law, even when such rulings are not truly based on law or the constitution, would be a good thing. It would be the final step in this country turning into a full blown Anarchy. What we do need to do is hold these judges accountable, and start removing them (impeaching them), which includes the SCOTUS judges, when they make rulings that are not based on law, the constitution, and/or decades of set precedent. Specially when some of the SCOTUS judges are violating their oath, and their authority by making legislation, IE not applying the law, but changing the interpretation of what the language says in a law, and expecting that interpretation to be carried out going forward which equates to making legislation, which is per the constitution the job of Congress, not the SCOTUS.

There is no way to hold these judges accountable. They can blatantly ignore the laws and constitution with zero recourse.

 

[NWRMidnight]

There is no way to hold these judges accountable. They can blatantly ignore the laws and constitution with zero recourse.

Yes there is, but it does require getting people in office who will hold them accountable. Which means we have to stop voting in the corrupt people who refuse to remove them.

 

[Zorba]

Yes there is, but it does require getting people in office who will hold them accountable. Which means we have to stop voting in the corrupt people who refuse to remove them.

There is a mechanism, yes, but I don't think the senate is going the have 67 sane people in it any time soon. There have only ever been 8 judges convicted on impeachment charges, 4 more resigned after being impeached.

Not saying we should start ignoring them, but we also shouldn't be forced into following their completely unconstitutional rulings forever either. The real problem is most of the constitution requires government officials to act in good faith, and that has completely failed. In the past a judge knew if they issued stupid rulings all the time they'd never get promoted, but now that is a prerequisite for conservative judges.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Yes there is, but it does require getting people in office who will hold them accountable. Which means we have to stop voting in the corrupt people who refuse to remove them.

Climate change will kill us long before we educate and convince enough people in the US to vote in candidates that will actually form a cadre of 67 senators willing to remove a SC justice.

 

[fskimospy]

Climate change will kill us long before we educate and convince enough people in the US to vote in candidates that will actually form a cadre of 67 senators willing to remove a SC justice.

Yeah even attempting to remove them is pointless. You need 50 senators + VP to add a justice, 67 to remove one. Better to just add like ten.

 

[akugami]

We already have one party, and many of their constituents, who completely disregards the rule of law, I don't think both parties ignoring the rule of law, even when such rulings are not truly based on law or the constitution, would be a good thing. It would be the final step in this country turning into a full blown Anarchy. What we do need to do is hold these judges accountable, and start removing them (impeaching them), which includes the SCOTUS judges, when they make rulings that are not based on law, the constitution, and/or decades of set precedent. Specially when some of the SCOTUS judges are violating their oath, and their authority by making legislation, IE not applying the law, but changing the interpretation of what the language says in a law, and expecting that interpretation to be carried out going forward which equates to making legislation, which is per the constitution the job of Congress, not the SCOTUS.

I completely understand your sentiment. However, I have no confidence that we can do the right thing. People are actively voting in judges and politicians who are expected to do the wrong thing.

 

[DaaQ]

The Occupational Safety and Health Act of 1970 states that “Each employee shall comply with all occupational safety and health standards, rules, regulations, and orders issued under the Act that apply to his own actions and conduct on the job.”

Nothing you do on the job is worth jeopardizing your life, health, or well-being, or that of the public. Let safety considerations guide you in everything you do. Since you often work unsupervised, your safety becomes your responsibility. This module provides a foundation of industry-approved safety practices upon which you can begin to build safe working habits and safety skills.

Wow this is from a class I just currently started.

Edit: Second paragraph, plus bold and underlined for the illiterate.

Your company establishes policies, provides equipment, and conducts safety training to help you establish good safety habits. However, you are responsible to ensure that good safety practices are followed. As with any part of your job, ask your supervisor if you are unsure about how to perform a particular task safely.

 

[uclaLabrat]

Buddy told me this morning GA is introducing a bill to ban all school vaccine mandates. Cause nothing is prolife like causing kids to die of preventable diseases.

 

[DaaQ]

Buddy told me this morning GA is introducing a bill to ban all school vaccine mandates. Cause nothing is prolife like causing kids to die of preventable diseases.

Why not kill em early instead of deathrow right. As long as hey are birthed all shall be well.

Did I do that right?

 

[Jaskalas]

Buddy told me this morning GA is introducing a bill to ban all school vaccine mandates. Cause nothing is prolife like causing kids to die of preventable diseases.

Bans the... mandate, not the Vax.
So anyone who feels the need to protect them can do so.

This, on the start of COVID's third year and the subject is kids. Who the heck hasn't already been vaxed or exposed? Repeats will probably face a minuscule risk.