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fatal limo crash - opinions

rh71

rh71

No Lifer
Would like your opinion on this fatal event where 4 bridesmaids in wine country died as a result of being t-boned by a near-DWI pickup truck driver. They are indicting the limo driver for negligence in making a u-turn without sufficient time to do so. Meanwhile on the other side is the pickup driver who ran away after the crash fearing that the alcohol would get him in trouble.

Animation:
http://abc7ny.com/news/video-animation-shows-how-fatal-long-island-limo-crash-happened/867428/

Article:
http://tbrnewsmedia.com/limo-driver-indicted-in-cutchogue-crash-that-killed-smithtown-women/

The investigators give numbers like 200 ft to stop and 1.6sec of reaction time, etc. I think it's clear the collision would have happened regardless but what is important here is the point of impact since the 4 passengers died. Do you guys think a sober driver would have at least been able to acknowledge the developing situation and at least swerve in this case?
 
I know a lot of people that would likely drive 'just fine' with near-DWI limits. So realistically, the guy could have been as alert as ever and even if he was a little drunk maybe not so much that he couldn't react properly (especially if he was truly focused on the road).

The fact that he ran is bad news though.

However, making an illegal u-turn into oncoming traffic is bad too.

I'm not a lawyer. What I say doesn't matter.
 
TechBoyJK said:
I know a lot of people that would likely drive 'just fine' with near-DWI limits. So realistically, the guy could have been as alert as ever and even if he was a little drunk maybe not so much that he couldn't react properly (especially if he was truly focused on the road).

The fact that he ran is bad news though.

However, making an illegal u-turn into oncoming traffic is bad too.

I'm not a lawyer. What I say doesn't matter.
Click to expand...

They can still tag you as DWI even under the limit if they feel you are impaired.

Fuck drunk/buzzed drivers. My wifes 12 year old brother was killed by one so I have zero sympathy.
 
I think if you simply remove the DWI from the equation and look at the pure physics of things and understand that *NO ONE* under any circumstances could have avoided that crash you can understand the negligence of the limo driver.
 
RadiclDreamer said:
They can still tag you as DWI even under the limit if they feel you are impaired.

Fuck drunk/buzzed drivers. My wifes 12 year old brother was killed by one so I have zero sympathy.
Click to expand...

While I'm generally under the same opinion, it really does sound like it was the limo driver's fault in this case. If you're turning into someone else's lane, it is your fault.
 
There are conflicting reports that he was tested under the limit but the article says:

Romeo, the DA said, was operating the truck under the influence of alcohol and was charged with driving while intoxicated the day of the crash.
Click to expand...

If you're charged with DUI, I'm just not understanding how he isn't implicated in the deaths also. Anticipation, perception, and reaction have to be affected and the point of impact by doing nothing (judging from how the center of his hood hit square in the middle of the limo) seems he should be accountable at some level.

fatallimo1.jpg
 
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animation doesn't show whether or not there are traffic lights and what colour the traffic lights were at said intersection.
 
cbrunny said:
animation doesn't show whether or not there are traffic lights and what colour the traffic lights were at said intersection.
Click to expand...

According to the article there were no lights but they have been added since then.
 
Classic 'turned left in front of oncoming traffic' accident. This is on the limo driver 100%. Charge the pickup with leaving the scene, but he's not responsible for the deaths.
 
rh71 said:
There are conflicting reports that he was tested under the limit but the article says:



If you're charged with DWI, I'm just not understanding how he isn't implicated in the deaths also. Reaction and stopping distance have to be affected and the point of impact by doing nothing (judging from how the center of his hood hit square in the middle of the limo) seems he should be accountable at some level.

fatallimo1.jpg
Click to expand...

Again, look at the numbers in the article. Do you realize how far you travel in 1 second at 55 MPH? 80 feet. Half a second more and it's 120 feet. Something as race prepped as a Corvette takes almost 3 full seconds and 100 feet to go from 60-0. What if a perfectly sober person is doing a lane spot check to their right to see if it's okay to merge back to the right lane? The time it takes to do that and they've traveled almost 100 feet already.

This guy had 200 feet to react and stop. Even the most attentive and prepared drivers would have trouble doing that. Even more so in a pickup truck that's got a stopping distance of around 140 feet.
 
^ acknowledged already that A collision was unavoidable. Turning the wheel (what most would do if a vehicle tries to occupy your space) is quicker and logically appropriate than applying pressure-sensitive brakes that still keeps you in the same path. Maybe (yes I'm using maybes) had it hit the front end of the limo instead, and maybe if he hadn't been impaired leading to these questions, those 4 women wouldn't have died and this would've been just another accident.

BTW, if you do online research - at 55mph, it takes about 60 feet to react (20 yards). It conflicts with the investigators too. My estimate is that he did nothing to mitigate the collision despite the time he did have and you may guess why.
pic3.jpg
 
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It's hard to say.

It doesn't really matter how drunk he was, ultimately I think this is on the limo driver.

Sure, drunk drivers are bad, but if I run out into the middle of traffic on the interstate and get hit by someone that happens to be drunk, you can't just put that on them. You kinda have to fault the person who ran out on the highway.
 
Forget the intoxication part, he could have been completely sober but looking at an interesting bird for .5 seconds. Nothing to do with a foolish maneuver by a 'professional' driver' that put everyone at risk. So lets just say if he is sober he is able to turn the wheel .1 seconds quicker and only kill 2 of them instead of 4. Is he now off the hook? Give me a break.
 
Insomniator said:
So lets just say if he is sober he is able to turn the wheel .1 seconds quicker and only kill 2 of them instead of 4. Is he now off the hook? Give me a break.
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Since you asked - absolutely not off the hook since people still died. And it does make a difference to the 2 who lived, and their families.

In no way am I saying the limo driver is innocent in all this.
 
rh71 said:
Since you asked - absolutely not off the hook since people still died. And it does make a difference to the 2 who lived, and their families.

In no way am I saying the limo driver is innocent in all this.
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I simply don't agree nor would I ever agree as a juror. Guy already has to live with deaths on his hands. Don't wreck his family over for it too. We call them accidents for a reason. Guy was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.
 
vi edit said:
I simply don't agree nor would I ever agree as a juror. Guy already has to live with deaths on his hands. Don't wreck his family over for it too. We call them accidents for a reason. Guy was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.
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I can respect that opinion - but this guy... this guy...

The Southold businessman was previously involved in a fatal accident in January 2014 at a construction site in Mattituck, where a 30-year-old worker was struck in the head and killed by a bucket that fell off of a skid-steer loader being operated by Mr. Romeo. He was not charged in that incident, but the U.S. Department of Labor’s Occupational Safety and Health Administration issued citations and fined the business, in part because Mr. Romeo had not been trained to use the equipment he was operating.
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It's up to the defense attorneys and science to determine if truck driver's alcohol influence could have changed the outcome.

Similar to the Flight movie with Denzel.
He was an amazing pilot and saved the lives of hundreds of people, BUT HE MIGHT have avoided the entire scenario if he was 100% sober.

Yes, the limo driver IS at fault, and SHOULD be charged as such.
And yes, the truck driver MIGHT be at fault and COULD be charged as such.
 
I served on a grand jury that was indicting pretty much everyone. One case was four kids in a car who admittedly had been drinking and smoking weed. They were driving west into the setting sun and a pedestrian stepped off a curb mid-block and was struck and killed. The prosecutor charged the driver with some type of vehicular manslaughter.

Surprisingly everyone agreed to completely disregard the intoxication because it was believed even the most sober an attentive driver couldn't have avoided the accident. The driver was only stuck with the original DUI charge.

If the physics show the truck driver couldn't possibly have avoided the collision I would disregard any intoxication. If there is any gray area and comparative negligence is TBD then I'd likely say the truck driver was somewhat negligent because it is unknown what miracle he could have pulled off had he been sober.
 
master_shake_ said:
so 2 things that have nothing to do with each other make this guy a super villain?
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I was responding to the line that asked not to ruin this poor guy's life because he has to live with 4 deaths...

Oops he did it again...
 
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rh71 said:
I can respect that opinion - but this guy... this guy...
Click to expand...

Yeah, I had an uncle killed by a drunk driver on a suspended license with 5 or 6 previous DUI convictions. So I totally understand. But given the evidence here...can't convict. Even if I wanted to.
 
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