Question Fastest low TDP CPUs?

[paperfist]

I’m looking to upgrade my ’server’ which basically runs Quickbooks and is setup for my bookkeeper and I to log into. It usually runs Win10 and a desktop CPU.

Might seem silly, but I want to take advantage of a spare Samsung Evo m.2 drive I have and the current MB doesn’t support it.

It doesn’t look like there’s any ’modern’ 35 watt CPU with anything more then dual core. Is that correct or am I looking in the wrong places?

 

[Glo.]

I’m looking to upgrade my ’server’ which basically runs Quickbooks and is setup for my bookkeeper and I to log into. It usually runs Win10 and a desktop CPU.

Might seem silly, but I want to take advantage of a spare Samsung Evo m.2 drive I have and the current MB doesn’t support it.

It doesn’t look like there’s any ’modern’ 35 watt CPU with anything more then dual core. Is that correct or am I looking in the wrong places?

You are looking in the wrong places.

Every 35W TDP CPU from Intel is actually 35W if you will turn Turbo feature off. Its simple job in BIOS/UEFI.

You can buy any 35W TDP CPU from i7-7700T, 8700T, Core i5-8500T, i7 9700T and make it 35W TDP.

You can also go with Core i3-8100T which is 35W TDP, nas ho HT, and no Turbo mode.

For your needs you do not need higher clock speeds.

 

[Insert_Nickname]

It doesn’t look like there’s any ’modern’ 35 watt CPU with anything more then dual core. Is that correct or am I looking in the wrong places?

You'll want to look at the T-series Intel CPUs. There should be plenty of options for every generation since Sandy Bridge. Sourcing might be a bit difficult, since some models aren't available in retail.

There are even a few LGA-115x Xeons with a 25W TDP floating about, but you'll need a mainboard with integrated graphics or a discrete card for such.

As for the absolutely fastest 35W CPU, I'd think it to be the i9-9900T. But that might be a bit overkill.

 

[paperfist]

You are looking in the wrong places.

Every 35W TDP CPU from Intel is actually 35W if you will turn Turbo feature off. Its simple job in BIOS/UEFI.

You can buy any 35W TDP CPU from i7-7700T, 8700T, Core i5-8500T, i7 9700T and make it 35W TDP.

You can also go with Core i3-8100T which is 35W TDP, nas ho HT, and no Turbo mode.

For your needs you do not need higher clock speeds.

Thanks I didn’t know turbo could be turned off like that. I wasn’t necessarily looking for the fastest, but I figured more cores/threads would be helpful. QB runs like a dog on almost any system.

You'll want to look at the T-series Intel CPUs. There should be plenty of options for every generation since Sandy Bridge. Sourcing might be a bit difficult, since some models aren't available in retail.

There are even a few LGA-115x Xeons with a 25W TDP floating about, but you'll need a mainboard with integrated graphics or a discrete card for such.

As for the absolutely fastest 35W CPU, I'd think it to be the i9-9900T. But that might be a bit overkill.

Thanks. I also didn’t know there was a T series Intel. I’ll search around for them.

 

[Markfw]

Thanks I didn’t know turbo could be turned off like that. I wasn’t necessarily looking for the fastest, but I figured more cores/threads would be helpful. QB runs like a dog on almost any system.



Thanks. I also didn’t know there was a T series Intel. I’ll search around for them.

Well, now that you mention speed, and want low power, the new Rome CPUs are server chips, and low power. The least expensive is $500, but it may give you the speed and the low power you are looking for. 8 cores, and 8 memory channels.

 

[thesmokingman]

He could also test with a Ryzen cpu using eco mode.

 

[Markfw]

He could also test with a Ryzen cpu using eco mode.

He mentions they use it as a server, and its slow. The 8 core EPYC rome cpu will give him way better performance than almost any Ryzen, with the 8 memory channels (instead of 2) and high IO with that M.2

 

[thesmokingman]

He mentions they use it as a server, and its slow. The 8 core EPYC rome cpu will give him way better performance than almost any Ryzen, with the 8 memory channels (instead of 2) and high IO with that M.2

Sure, but that is a whole other ballgame you are suggesting.

 

[Hitman928]

He mentions they use it as a server, and its slow. The 8 core EPYC rome cpu will give him way better performance than almost any Ryzen, with the 8 memory channels (instead of 2) and high IO with that M.2

He put server in air quotes, I don't think he's looking for server grade hardware, just a system to host his financial software. Intel T series or a Ryzen 3000 series 65 W CPU in eco mode should do the trick.

 

[paperfist]

Well, now that you mention speed, and want low power, the new Rome CPUs are server chips, and low power. The least expensive is $500, but it may give you the speed and the low power you are looking for. 8 cores, and 8 memory channels.

The current system is built on an Intel i5-4570t (lol I guess I have seen T series before) w/16GB RAM. The overall performance is good, but Quickbooks itself is a bit slow mainly because well it's Quickbooks. So I figured if I just throw a faster processor and I/O in the form of a m.2 drive I could improve performance.

I don't know a lot about server chips, but I'm assuming I'd then need Windows Server x and would have to get into licensing for both that and Quickbooks. What I have now is single user access meaning only 1 person can use it at a time which works fine.

He could also test with a Ryzen cpu using eco mode.

Is that like shutting down Turbo on the Intel side?

 

[Arkaign]

Sure, but that is a whole other ballgame you are suggesting.

LOL I love Mark, and his well founded enthusiasm for exceptional hardware, but as the OP clarifies there in the opening that this is a QuickBooks local server box running Windows 10 SMB, that EPYC is an order of magnitude beyond what is economically sensible.

OP, get a B450 and a Ryzen 1600AF if you can find it, or a Ryzen 3 3200G @ $91 on Amazon if you can't. Some budget DDR4 3200 will do fine. This will let you use your nVME, and be way way more than up to the task of the QB services. I have one running on a Phenom II x3 and a 180GB Intel SSD, with 8GB DDR2, and it's basically instant for all the QuickBooks hosting activities. These Ryzens will be way out ahead. And at stock, unless you load up some encoding, they indeed should consume less than 35W doing the regular Windows + QB + SMB + updates.

I specify B450 there mainly for the flexibility should you decide to upgrade later on, or repurpose the box after local QuickBooks goes EOL, or whatever. The A320 boards don't run higher end CPU models generally, and are mostly made fairly cheaply, so it is my feeling that stepping up to the 450 is worth it. 470 and 570 are completely overkill for the vast majority of users (not least of all is that Ryzen doesn't need any OC to be basically ideal, and doesn't respond well at best anyway to that path). Anyway, if you really want to, nothing would prevent an a320 from functioning here.

For peace of mind I'd also throw a $20-$25 budget tower heatpipe HSF on it. These CPUs run so cool that even a fan failing won't really make much impact, but the bigger cooler will give you extra peace of mind for years of reliable cool operation. And a cooler CPU means a cooler Mobo VRM and socket region.

That's my take. I assume you already have configured QuickBooks before, but if you have any questions lmk. If it's going to sit headless and you want less interruptions, you might consider altering the network properties to fool Windows into thinking there is no internet, while still being able to function as an SMB share and .net/MySQL host for the QB data and db engine.

 

[guachi]

You can turn any Zen 2 CPU into a 35W CPU in BIOS.

 

[thesmokingman]

Is that like shutting down Turbo on the Intel side?

No, but it is similar in that you can lower power consumption. You can take any 3rd gen Ryzen and squeeze it into a lower TDP envelope. This has the OP written all over it imo.

 

[Arkaign]

The current system is built on an Intel i5-4570t (lol I guess I have seen T series before) w/16GB RAM. The overall performance is good, but Quickbooks itself is a bit slow mainly because well it's Quickbooks. So I figured if I just throw a faster processor and I/O in the form of a m.2 drive I could improve performance.

I don't know a lot about server chips, but I'm assuming I'd then need Windows Server x and would have to get into licensing for both that and Quickbooks. What I have now is single user access meaning only 1 person can use it at a time which works fine.



Is that like shutting down Turbo on the Intel side?

Is the current rig running on a spinning HDD? I ask because QB file hosting, especially for a single user, is not really CPU intensive. I have that old Phenom II doing it for one customer who runs it to sometimes pull up old QBW files they come across in their line of work (along with Quicken and Peachtree), and as far as CPU usage, it's pretty marginal.

HDD though, that will drag it down. QBWs and the way QuickBooks hosts and interacts with the file handles and database functions, it's very intensive with teeny tiny requests for data. Not big sequential data, just a lot of sparse little stuff that is put together to make all the connections and bring the data file up for the client.

Unless something is really off somewhere else, probably throwing a $25ish 120GB SDD in, fresh installing v1909 (UEFI should pick up your existing license) and QB, creating a share, setting up the credentials and dependencies, that should do the trick, and not be observably different for your use case vs a new rig.

Amazon sometimes has those Intel dual hardware-based PCIe Intel Pro Gbit Ethernet cards as well, that is a bit of a help as well if the onboard Network IC is typically just a lowest common denominator filler style model. Perhaps that is overkill as well, but I like them never seen faster local 1gbit transfers or lower latency.

 

[sdifox]

Does your QB server still run on spinners? Sticking more memory and adding a sata ssd for qb directory and swap should speed up current setup considerably.


That thing runs like a dog on my wife's Surface Pro 4 with an i5.

 

[Markfw]

LOL I love Mark, and his well founded enthusiasm for exceptional hardware, but as the OP clarifies there in the opening that this is a QuickBooks local server box running Windows 10 SMB, that EPYC is an order of magnitude beyond what is economically sensible.

OP, get a B450 and a Ryzen 1600AF if you can find it, or a Ryzen 3 3200G @ $91 on Amazon if you can't. Some budget DDR4 3200 will do fine. This will let you use your nVME, and be way way more than up to the task of the QB services. I have one running on a Phenom II x3 and a 180GB Intel SSD, with 8GB DDR2, and it's basically instant for all the QuickBooks hosting activities. These Ryzens will be way out ahead. And at stock, unless you load up some encoding, they indeed should consume less than 35W doing the regular Windows + QB + SMB + updates.

I specify B450 there mainly for the flexibility should you decide to upgrade later on, or repurpose the box after local QuickBooks goes EOL, or whatever. The A320 boards don't run higher end CPU models generally, and are mostly made fairly cheaply, so it is my feeling that stepping up to the 450 is worth it. 470 and 570 are completely overkill for the vast majority of users (not least of all is that Ryzen doesn't need any OC to be basically ideal, and doesn't respond well at best anyway to that path). Anyway, if you really want to, nothing would prevent an a320 from functioning here.

For peace of mind I'd also throw a $20-$25 budget tower heatpipe HSF on it. These CPUs run so cool that even a fan failing won't really make much impact, but the bigger cooler will give you extra peace of mind for years of reliable cool operation. And a cooler CPU means a cooler Mobo VRM and socket region.

That's my take. I assume you already have configured QuickBooks before, but if you have any questions lmk. If it's going to sit headless and you want less interruptions, you might consider altering the network properties to fool Windows into thinking there is no internet, while still being able to function as an SMB share and .net/MySQL host for the QB data and db engine.

His second post clarified it for me, yes, EPYC is beyond what he needs.

FYI, you can run windows 10 on EPYC I have it in dual boot on all my EPYC boxes. Its just that you can't make it a true server (2 simultaneous logins or more)

And I just saw the new post above this one. Faster IO and a faster CPU is the best you can do.

 

[paperfist]

He could also test with a Ryzen cpu using eco mode.

LOL I love Mark, and his well founded enthusiasm for exceptional hardware, but as the OP clarifies there in the opening that this is a QuickBooks local server box running Windows 10 SMB, that EPYC is an order of magnitude beyond what is economically sensible.

OP, get a B450 and a Ryzen 1600AF if you can find it, or a Ryzen 3 3200G @ $91 on Amazon if you can't. Some budget DDR4 3200 will do fine. This will let you use your nVME, and be way way more than up to the task of the QB services. I have one running on a Phenom II x3 and a 180GB Intel SSD, with 8GB DDR2, and it's basically instant for all the QuickBooks hosting activities. These Ryzens will be way out ahead. And at stock, unless you load up some encoding, they indeed should consume less than 35W doing the regular Windows + QB + SMB + updates.

I specify B450 there mainly for the flexibility should you decide to upgrade later on, or repurpose the box after local QuickBooks goes EOL, or whatever. The A320 boards don't run higher end CPU models generally, and are mostly made fairly cheaply, so it is my feeling that stepping up to the 450 is worth it. 470 and 570 are completely overkill for the vast majority of users (not least of all is that Ryzen doesn't need any OC to be basically ideal, and doesn't respond well at best anyway to that path). Anyway, if you really want to, nothing would prevent an a320 from functioning here.

For peace of mind I'd also throw a $20-$25 budget tower heatpipe HSF on it. These CPUs run so cool that even a fan failing won't really make much impact, but the bigger cooler will give you extra peace of mind for years of reliable cool operation. And a cooler CPU means a cooler Mobo VRM and socket region.

That's my take. I assume you already have configured QuickBooks before, but if you have any questions lmk. If it's going to sit headless and you want less interruptions, you might consider altering the network properties to fool Windows into thinking there is no internet, while still being able to function as an SMB share and .net/MySQL host for the QB data and db engine.

I was just looking at the EPYC stuff... Very nice hardware, but yeah Porsche for my Prius needs.

Thanks, you did my shopping for me

EOL? Online you mean? I'm trying to avoid that till I can't.

Yeah, I would definitely get upgraded cooling. I want to limit headaches.

Quickbooks has been running for several years, but it's just a basic install with each of us using the same account. It sounds like you have a better, more advanced method for installation. You're over my head with altering the network properties As it sits, there's a Sonic Wall between it and the Internet and then a basic Win10 install. Though I'd love to strip it down to the essentials and remove the bloatware that comes with it.

 

[paperfist]

No, but it is similar in that you can lower power consumption. You can take any 3rd gen Ryzen and squeeze it into a lower TDP envelope. This has the OP written all over it imo.

Sweet, thanks!

Is the current rig running on a spinning HDD? I ask because QB file hosting, especially for a single user, is not really CPU intensive. I have that old Phenom II doing it for one customer who runs it to sometimes pull up old QBW files they come across in their line of work (along with Quicken and Peachtree), and as far as CPU usage, it's pretty marginal.

HDD though, that will drag it down. QBWs and the way QuickBooks hosts and interacts with the file handles and database functions, it's very intensive with teeny tiny requests for data. Not big sequential data, just a lot of sparse little stuff that is put together to make all the connections and bring the data file up for the client.

Unless something is really off somewhere else, probably throwing a $25ish 120GB SDD in, fresh installing v1909 (UEFI should pick up your existing license) and QB, creating a share, setting up the credentials and dependencies, that should do the trick, and not be observably different for your use case vs a new rig.

Amazon sometimes has those Intel dual hardware-based PCIe Intel Pro Gbit Ethernet cards as well, that is a bit of a help as well if the onboard Network IC is typically just a lowest common denominator filler style model. Perhaps that is overkill as well, but I like them never seen faster local 1gbit transfers or lower latency.

Yes, spinning old school HDD. Thanks, that's good to know! I do also run Norton A/V, MS Office suite and Fujitsu SnapScan for documents.

hmm that's a good idea. The bookkeeper has had some log-in issues before whereas me on the internal network has not.

 

[Arkaign]

I'm a definite 'fresh install' kind of guy, which sounds like what you may end up doing if you go the new Mobo/CPU/etc route, vs dropping an SSD into the Haswell rig.

Honestly that's probably a better idea. If you want it to be dead simple, just check your used disk space on the QB box. If it's smaller than 200GB, a 256GB model will suffice after some cleanup (most W10 installs are sitting on 30+GB of previous build old files). If it's smaller than 80GB, you can get away with a 120GB model. Either way you can use Acronis or similar to image over the entire thing if you just go from HDD to SSD on the existing box.

Modifying network properties, by that I mean give the thing a bogus DNS address manually in the lan adapter settings. This keeps SMB local file access working, but keeps the thing from potentially grabbing a new build of Windows 10, then you can choose a quarterly or whatever routine for setting DNS back to stock, which will immediately put it back online for updates/internet.

For set purpose boxes not used for anything else, like an old WinXP box I have running some weird industrial 25-year old hardware for a client, I find that keeping them offline is a decent idea, either permanently or by a set schedule. That way you're not as likely to be inconvenienced by some update which has rebooted your headless network PC, knocking your QB offline until you go poke around to click yadda yadda complete on what it's asking, and then you hope the feature update didn't reset some default that affected your SMB, .NET, or MySql functionality lol.

 

[Arkaign]

I should restate for clarity :

If you have at least 8GB in the existing QB box, but no SSD, then getting it upgraded to a basic SATA SSD will be as much as it can really take advantage of just running W10 and a QB host.

If it already has at least 8GB and is running on a SATA SSD, I'd have to say something is catastrophically wrong with it. Haswell i5 + 8GB + SSD is more than enough for the task to not be noticably slow in any way.

Clonezilla and Acronis True Image are two options to make that upgrade extremely painless.

Building the new rig will result in a better unit, but not one that will be perceivably better for such a low/low medium kind of utilization which QB hosting represents with just a single concurrent user.

 

[Arkaign]

Ah, I see the info up above where you specify some other uses, so scratch the whole placeholder DNS setting part of this, it's only a technique for keeping fixed purpose 'headless' stuff and things that need either no internet access or only planned maintenance sessions, to make them safer and less prone to getting bogged by stupid updates.

Norton AV, I'm happy to say, doesn't really serve a purpose with Windows 10. The integrated AV is more than up to the task, and if combined with either Chrome or Firefox + the Ublock Origin plugin makes for an incredibly dependable level or practical protection. The Norton is only bogging you down and costing you $. The combo of going to SSD and saying goodbye to the old dog AV will represent a true whirlwind level of an upgrade for you.

 

[Arkaign]

Why you can stop paying for antivirus software

Microsoft's Windows Security (formerly Windows Defender) is now on a par with paid solutions such as McAfee and Norton, meaning you could protect your PC for the price of free.

www.pcworld.com

For the price of 'free', yet with much less intrusive system resource impact. Win!

 

[sdifox]

check if current mb has spare pcie slot, you can just use pcie carrier for your nvme

 

[paperfist]

I should restate for clarity :

If you have at least 8GB in the existing QB box, but no SSD, then getting it upgraded to a basic SATA SSD will be as much as it can really take advantage of just running W10 and a QB host.

If it already has at least 8GB and is running on a SATA SSD, I'd have to say something is catastrophically wrong with it. Haswell i5 + 8GB + SSD is more than enough for the task to not be noticably slow in any way.

Clonezilla and Acronis True Image are two options to make that upgrade extremely painless.

Building the new rig will result in a better unit, but not one that will be perceivably better for such a low/low medium kind of utilization which QB hosting represents with just a single concurrent user.

Thanks for all your help!

I do have Acronis. I typically run Norton for the built in backup though. I didn't know Win10 was good as a A/V tool, but I'm super concerned about my data being hacked so not sure I'd roll without Norton. I disable all web browsers as best as possible, since it's headless I can split the screen and browse from my main PC if needed. I'm not sure the bookkeeper does that though

It's a shame it seems like I could have a socket 1150 MB that natively supported m.2, but those are mostly used buys now and only seem to support 16 GB on the mATX format.

I've been looking at your Ryzen recommendations and just keeping what I have if I can outfit the m.2 drive with a card.

 

[EliteRetard]

Thanks for all your help!

I do have Acronis. I typically run Norton for the built in backup though. I didn't know Win10 was good as a A/V tool, but I'm super concerned about my data being hacked so not sure I'd roll without Norton. I disable all web browsers as best as possible, since it's headless I can split the screen and browse from my main PC if needed. I'm not sure the bookkeeper does that though

It's a shame it seems like I could have a socket 1150 MB that natively supported m.2, but those are mostly used buys now and only seem to support 16 GB on the mATX format.

I've been looking at your Ryzen recommendations and just keeping what I have if I can outfit the m.2 drive with a card.

Can you not use an M.2 to PCIE adapter with your current system?

Here's some random one I just found on newegg with a search:

Are you a human?

www.newegg.com