Fareed (CNN): Threat to Democracy from the left

[UglyCasanova]

Great take by CNN's Fareed Zakaria about the erosion of democracy by the calls on the left to muzzle political speech they disagree with. His take comes from blowback he recieved after doing an interview with Steve Brannon recently. As with the cases of trying to silence speech in college campuses, he was facing criticism by giving a voice to someone who advocated a viewpoint they disagreed with. Fareed disagrees and states that the push to silence and suppress speech only serves to make it more potent, that trying to smother it out of existence is a fools errend.

https://youtu.be/KWy27Igd7PQ

It should be noted he’s not saying the only threat to democracy is coming from the left, but that it seems to be where this particular threat is coming from.

 

[ivwshane]

Wait, so criticism is now suppression of speech?

Lol!

I usually like fareed but that's just ridiculous. If you can't take the criticism then shut the fuck up because criticism from others is just as valid as a form of free speech as is whatever it is you are saying.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Watch the vid. Criticism is healthy and part of the dialogue needed for democracy to work. He’s not referring to criticism, he’s referring to actively trying to silence certain viewpoints.

 

[ivwshane]

Watch the vid. Criticism is healthy and part of the dialogue needed for democracy to work. He’s not referring to criticism, he’s referring to actively trying to silence certain viewpoints.

Sorry, I don't do YouTube from you. If he's not referring to criticism then you should update your op as that's exactly what you laid out.

So how exactly is he being silenced?

 

[Jaskalas]

These are the folks who will... some day, replace the Alt Right and sit atop our government. However, unlike Trump, they will be enabled and their fascist policy granted the legs to go further, in ways the Donald only dreams he could. Trump is more dangerous, but only as a person. In totality, they will have more reach as a group. They will act where he has failed.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Sorry, I don't do YouTube from you. If he's not referring to criticism then you should update your op as that's exactly what you laid out.

So how exactly is he being silenced?

He’s not, but he acknowledges there is a movement to do such which he encountered after the interview. I mean it’s a two min cnn vid, I can paraphrase him but it is better just to listen to what he has to say.

 

[Moonbeam]

In 1284, while the town of Hamelin was suffering from a rat infestation, a piper dressed in multicolored ("pied") clothing appeared, claiming to be a rat-catcher. He promised the mayor a solution to their problem with the rats. The mayor, in turn, promised to pay him for the removal of the rats. (According to some versions of the story, the promised sum was 1000 guilders.) The piper accepted and played his pipe to lure the rats into the Weser River, where all but one, which was deaf, drowned.

Despite the piper's success, the mayor reneged on his promise and refused to pay him the full sum (reputedly reduced to a sum of 50 guilders) even going so far as to blame the piper for bringing the rats himself in an extortion attempt. Enraged, the piper stormed out of the town, vowing to return later to take revenge. On Saint John and Paul's day, while the adults were in church, the piper returned dressed in green like a hunter playing his pipe. In so doing, he attracted the town's children. A hundred and thirty children followed him out of town and into a cave and were never seen again. Depending on the version, at most three children remained behind: one was lame and could not follow quickly enough, the second was deaf and therefore could not hear the music, and the last was blind and unable to see where he was going. These three informed the villagers of what had happened when they came out from church.

So what do you suggest we do in the case where the intention is to raise an army of Brown Shirt morons? Shall we break legs, deafen people or blind them so they can't see where they are going. Do parents watch who or what is influencing their children. Do we allow false claims about snake oil? Can propaganda destroy a society and is there an answer to it. The economy of the West is built on the gullibility of consumers who are trained to feel absurd emotional needs. Do you want to destroy the economy to create an American people immune to hypnotism? I think the !% would object to that. I think you will just have to get used to the fact that our nation is doomed by both-siders like you. Perhaps an authoritarian left is the spontaneous autoimmune response to a pathogen called creeping dictatorship.

 

[senseamp]

The left has a right to free speech too, and that includes criticizing giving platform to what they consider hate speech. Fareed is just trying to appear to be a "centrist" in a world where time has come to pick sides. I semi-sympathize, but not really. He also supported the invasion of Iraq, because you know that was a "centrist" thing to do.

 

[ivwshane]

He’s not, but he acknowledges there is a movement to do such which he encountered after the interview. I mean it’s a two min cnn vid, I can paraphrase him but it is better just to listen to what he has to say.

So basically, nazism could have been destroyed had it been given a platform to let itself peter out? That racism would be non existent had racists been more tolerant of speech from those against racism? That communism would have never failed had it let those that support democracy speak?

Lol sure

You, as well as your degenerate friend, jaskals, don't get it. Its not suppression of speech when a platform to speak isn't given to you. Do you guys complain when right wing websites like breitbart, drudge, or sub reddits delete comments or bans members whose views are different than theirs? I suspect not but your concern totally has me concerned.

The idea that communism was defeated because speech that opposed communism was suppressed is dumb. Communism failed because people could see that is was failing.

Racism hasn't gone away because people spoke out against it but it has been weakened precisely because such speech and actions have been shamed, shunned, and suppressed.

Nazi-ism didn't go away because we let it run its course, we actively killed, with bullets and bombs, that's how it went away.

Debate is fine and dandy when discussing new ideas but once those ideas are proven false, no platform should be given to them.

We don't need debates on settled matters. We don't need schools teaching kids that the world was created in 6 days just because that's an opposing view to reality. We don't need Congress debating the merits of climate change simply because a congressman holds a snowball in his hand. We don't need to debate whether or not trickle down as a policy works simply because it's apart of one party's platform.

In fact, I'd argue that speech isn't moderated enough, especially by the media. Their insistence of always having the other side on to discuss things, even though the other side of the argument is ridiculous and has been thoroughly debunked is the biggest issue because it legitimizes such ridiculous ideas.

There is a time and a place for debate, debating whether or not racism is good is not one of them. Debating the merits of nazi-ism, is not one of them. Debating whether or not communism is a good policy is not one of them.

 

[Jaskalas]

Perhaps an authoritarian left is the spontaneous autoimmune response to a pathogen called creeping dictatorship.

We've heard this tune before. Indeed, here is the next verse:

If the basis of popular government in peacetime is virtue, the basis of popular government during a revolution is both virtue and terror; virtue, without which terror is baneful; terror, without which virtue is powerless. Terror is nothing more than speedy, severe and inflexible justice; it is thus an emanation of virtue; it is less a principle in itself, than a consequence of the general principle of democracy, applied to the most pressing needs of the patrie.​

 

[rommelrommel]

Why the fuck is this serial plagiarist still given a platform by CNN?

 

[greatnoob]

The left has a right to free speech too, and that includes criticizing giving platform to what they consider hate speech. Fareed is just trying to appear to be a "centrist" in a world where time has come to pick sides. I semi-sympathize, but not really. He also supported the invasion of Iraq, because you know that was a "centrist" thing to do.

What is it with "centrists"? Sounds to me they're glorified Republicans who are slightly less moronic than their hardline peers. Still, though, they are incredibly stupid as we can see quite clearly from our resident centrist's posts in this thread, Jackass Jaskalas.

 

[mikeymikec]

aka. "taking anything to its extreme is a bad idea, who knew?", says potential Darwin candidate who nearly drowned after drinking too much water.

 

[Paul98]

Just because someone has free speech doesn't mean others have to give them a microphone for that speech. They can say what they want, the government isn't going to stop them. Doesn't mean they can make others listen, and if you are out there yelling in public, others have just as much of a right to yell back at you.

 

[Thebobo]

Sorry, I don't do YouTube from you. ...............................................

This caught my eye, why would you not watch a CNN video? Who cares who posted it?

 

[brycejones]

Again the OP is very concerned about "the left" and some potential "threat to the democracy", while ignoring the actual actions taking by the right wing in this country to reduce voter turnout and manipulate districts to allow the GOP to retain power while attracting a minority of voters.

Its almost like he isn't actually concerned about democracy.

 

[Starbuck1975]

This caught my eye, why would you not watch a CNN video? Who cares who posted it?

Not sure how you can knee jerk to a video you haven’t seen.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Again the OP is very concerned about "the left" and some potential "threat to the democracy", while ignoring the actual actions taking by the right wing in this country to reduce voter turnout and manipulate districts to allow the GOP to retain power while attracting a minority of voters.

Its almost like he isn't actually concerned about democracy.

It’s almost as if you didn’t even read my post.

 

[Starbuck1975]

Again the OP is very concerned about "the left" and some potential "threat to the democracy", while ignoring the actual actions taking by the right wing in this country to reduce voter turnout and manipulate districts to allow the GOP to retain power while attracting a minority of voters.

Its almost like he isn't actually concerned about democracy.

The erosion of democracy predates Trump. Fareed focuses on Steve Bannon, which weakens his argument because Bannon is someone we should censor, but Fareed is right that the “tolerance of intolerance” argument should not extend to people like Condoleeza Rice.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...3fbb72-b790-11e8-94eb-3bd52dfe917b_story.html

 

[fskimospy]

I am consistently amazed at the amount of ink spilled clutching our pearls about the threat to free speech posed by college students or ideas festivals while at the same time the president of the United States, you know... someone with actual power, is trying to regulate and/or revoke the licenses of news organizations that criticize him.

Like seriously, who gives a flying fuck about college students. Focus on the threat to democracy from the right as it has actual power.

 

[brycejones]

The erosion of democracy predates Trump. Fareed focuses on Steve Bannon, which weakens his argument because Bannon is someone we should censor, but Fareed is right that the “tolerance of intolerance” argument should not extend to people like Condoleeza Rice.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...3fbb72-b790-11e8-94eb-3bd52dfe917b_story.html

Its almost like you didn't read my post. Since I didn't mention Trump at all.

 

[brycejones]

It’s almost as if you didn’t even read my post.

I did and noted your usual concern for "the left".

 

[Starbuck1975]

Its almost like you didn't read my post. Since I didn't mention Trump at all.

You are correct. You didn’t mention Trump. You whatabouted to gerrymandering and voter suppression. My point still stands.

 

[Starbuck1975]

I am consistently amazed at the amount of ink spilled clutching our pearls about the threat to free speech posed by college students or ideas festivals while at the same time the president of the United States, you know... someone with actual power, is trying to regulate and/or revoke the licenses of news organizations that criticize him.

Like seriously, who gives a flying fuck about college students. Focus on the threat to democracy from the right as it has actual power.

WhatabouTrump

You do realize that part of the appeal of Trump was a stigginit rejection of snowflake safe space cry wolf alarmism. Most of the blue dog Democrats I know who voted for Trump did so out of frustration that the Democrats abandoned the working class in favor of 1st world problem dogmatic Crusades.

 

[fskimospy]

WhatabouTrump

Yes exactly, what about Trump, the actual threat to free speech? If college kids want to protest against people whose views they dislike that IS free speech, unlike censoring news organizations critical of the government.

You do realize that part of the appeal of Trump was a stigginit rejection of snowflake safe space cry wolf alarmism. Most of the blue dog Democrats I know who voted for Trump did so out of frustration that the Democrats abandoned the working class in favor of 1st world problem dogmatic Crusades.

Nah, that was always an excuse, not a real reason. After all, who is a bigger group of snowflakes than modern American conservatives? If a black person even so much as kneels during the national anthem (free speech!) it’s a twelve alarm fire that must be suppressed. People that hate political correctness should run screaming from Trump but they don’t, they just want political correctness that favors the right.

Conservatives don’t care about free speech and they never have. They care about conservatives being free of criticism and consequences for their speech. The ultimate snowflakes.