That would be a good answer to use as well if you doubted the existence of god or were not sure, or respected the fact your child was curious about it.
That would be a good answer to use as well if you doubted the existence of god or were not sure, or respected the fact your child was curious about it.
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I'm sorry I didn't spell out every last implication for you. You must have hated high school english with all the interpretation it required.
When you find a piece of athiest/hindu/buddhist/muslim/jewish children's literature that you find particularly amusing, feel free to post it.
Atomic Playboy
Lifer
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As an impartial observer, I'd have to say jonk's OP was pretty easy to interpret. I think given the topic title and summary (Faith through terror! happy reading kids!), and quoting "The punishment for sin is death," and "people continue to sin, so God will one day punish the world with fire," the message in the OP is clear. The Church uses frightening imagery of death and punishment through fire to convince people to behave in a particular way. This is propaganda based out of fear rather than an appeal to logic or reason. Jonk's further posts illustrate how the Church has historically used these same appeals to explain scientific phenomenon, even if there is no evidence to support such claims (the flood, the garden of Eden, the afterlife). It's not a thorough indictment of religion, but to claim that the OP states nothing is simply wrong.
Forsooth.
I guess High School English would have enabled me to use crappy video game references for a book with no actual comment on it?
As well as for your "amusement"
Sure looks like you just wanted a funny haha time instead of a flamewar doesn't it :roll:
Quit acting like an idiot. You wanted to attack religion and its ideas Quit trying to play the "oh I'm so innocent" card when someone talks back to you on it.
Besides, what exactly was my obvious elementary level of reading comprehension missing in the OP?
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One, I did not indicate your education stopped at high school. I merely made reference to high school English where students tend to read Catcher in the Rye, Old Man and the Sea, and other ridiculously oversymbolic works fraught with allusions and metaphor. I made such a reference because my post was clearly directed at the things which I later had to explain to you, but which were readily and easily interpretable. That you seem to have taken specific offense to the reference indicates your sensitivity to your education level, of which I have absolutley no knowledge.
Two, to answer your question, read AP's post above yours, I think it provides as clean an answer as I could provide you. And if there's one thing I learned about writing, if you can quote someone else to save yourself the time, go for it.
Of course I was attacking religion, specifically, the manner of indoctrination of youth through scare tactics. I don't see why religion should be safe from criticism any more than politics, philosophy, or economics, especially since it's really an amalgam of those three things.
DangerAardvark
Diamond Member
- Oct 22, 2004
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I can't believe someone's defending psychological child abuse just because it's religious in nature. It's amazing what you can get away with in the name of God.
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Again, an unnecessary clarification. Your fix is the equivalent of me taking your post and changing it to:
"I snipped the train [of back and forth posts], but I bolded where I fixed your statement [because I found your use of it to be overgeneralized]."
Of course I'm talking about this church, or any church that distributes the children's bible manual which I linked to. I'm not talking about churches that don't use this manual because the post was about this manual. By this manual I mean the one I linked to. In the OP. By OP I mean the first post in this thread. By thread I don't mean twine, I mean the conversation made up of statements and responses by different people. People of course means humans, but could mean sentient apes of the distant future, as I don't like to discriminate.
Holy crap.
Originally posted by: Fenixgoon
where are wind and earth?
Recouperating after busy few weeks in China and Myanmar. Sorry.
If you a tell a kid that commiting murder lands them in jail... does that mean your using terror as well?
::sigh::
::sigh::
Faith through terror. You have no clue.
Try Islam: "You're not Muslim? Head meet chopping block!" Then there's the good-ol' bomb trick.
Plus, the word terror is pretty loaded. Honestly you SHOULD be terrified; imagine God does exist and you laugh at what he says when he says you'll burn for eternity if you continue to reject him.
Terror isn't the goal of Christianity. It's an invitation to eternal life and redemption of your own life. There are consequences for rejecting God but not from us humans here on Earth (unlike the Muslims).
Try Islam: "You're not Muslim? Head meet chopping block!" Then there's the good-ol' bomb trick.
Plus, the word terror is pretty loaded. Honestly you SHOULD be terrified; imagine God does exist and you laugh at what he says when he says you'll burn for eternity if you continue to reject him.
Terror isn't the goal of Christianity. It's an invitation to eternal life and redemption of your own life. There are consequences for rejecting God but not from us humans here on Earth (unlike the Muslims).
As far as scaring kids goes, yes they should be scared because that's the basic truth of things. Once you're older and things don't scare you as easily, you can look into things more deeply for yourself.
And really, if you are tired of reading religion threads, why would you click on one and take the time to post in one? Genius.
OP, relgions often use uncertainty to cultivate fear in order to manipulate the feeble minded into blind belief systems.
Eternal torture is defined as being apart from God. You are choosing your own torture by rejecting him. God is much closer to you now than you think.
Think of it this way.
You build a robot; it does what it's programmed to do, what you tell it to do, and everything is fine.
Now, you give it AI and it can do whatever it wants. Instead, you ASK it to do what you say. It does, and you have an infinitely better robot.
Now, say it decides to start killing kids in the local park. You have no choice but to stop it. Do you turn it off for good or give it a second chance?
That's what happened with us; we decided to make a mess of the world but God offers us a second chance (through Jesus). His last option if we insist on going our own way is to turn us off for good.
There still has to be justice for the kids killed, though. So, the robot's creator was sentenced to death and was killed in its place in order to give it a second chance.
With all that going for you, do you take the second chance or just ignore everything and continue going your own way?
You build a robot; it does what it's programmed to do, what you tell it to do, and everything is fine.
Now, you give it AI and it can do whatever it wants. Instead, you ASK it to do what you say. It does, and you have an infinitely better robot.
Now, say it decides to start killing kids in the local park. You have no choice but to stop it. Do you turn it off for good or give it a second chance?
That's what happened with us; we decided to make a mess of the world but God offers us a second chance (through Jesus). His last option if we insist on going our own way is to turn us off for good.
There still has to be justice for the kids killed, though. So, the robot's creator was sentenced to death and was killed in its place in order to give it a second chance.
With all that going for you, do you take the second chance or just ignore everything and continue going your own way?
Atomic Playboy
Lifer
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This is demonstrable through actual fact given our penal code. If a crime is committed, retribution is enacted through the courts, which can include serving time in prison. This is fact. It is not a fear tactic any more than telling someone that leaping from a building may kill them.
This is different than telling someone they will be punished through damnation or that God will purge the Earth with fire. These are not demonstrable facts; they may be true, they may not. Thus, this is not a matter of fact, but of faith, and this particular faith is using fear tactics for indoctrination. That's the difference.
Fenixgoon
Lifer
- Jun 30, 2003
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see, here's the thing that irks me about religions in general:
you cannot PROVE that you are right. you only BELIEVE that you are right.
this is why it is silly to think that there is only the "one true way" to God/heaven/etc.
there are elements of truth to all faiths, IMO, and i think it both foolish and close-minded to completely dismiss another set of beliefs on the basis that they are not "yours."
can you honestly tell me that just because another person is hindu, muslim, buddhist, jain, sikh, or jewish that they will eternally damned because they didn't believe? (with the ever present possibility that they grew up in a insert-religion-here community)
i personally cannot fathom God being so divinely omnipotent, omniscient, and merciful that he/she/it would discount a person solely on the basis of their path to truth/enlightenment, and this is why i believe what i do.
Do you discount someone because the believe the earth is flat and are willing to walk to the edge of it and jump off to prove it? (hint - you should) It's just not true. It's the same thing for God. Truth is absolute, whether it be physical laws that we can see or the spiritual realm.
If Christianity says it is right (and the only way) and Islam says Christianity is wrong and Islam is the only way, one or the other is right. You can't have it both ways.
If one sits down with an open mind and looks over the myriad of historical information available, not to mention scientific information and philosophical points, Christianity emerges as the unique and realistic explanation. At some point, though, faith DOES have to take over.
Fenixgoon
Lifer
- Jun 30, 2003
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i discount someone who believes the earth is flat because it has been scientifically PROVEN otherwise.
can you prove the existence of heaven in christianity/judaism/islam over the nirvana of buddhism or the equivalent in other religions? no.
can you prove that god exists, and that all other gods do not? no.
and why can't Christianity and Islam both be separate paths to the same goal? having one way is just as reasonable as many, given the completely different cultures that embody both.
My world history teacher once said "Christianity, Judaism, and Islam... we're all waiting for the same person, we just disagree on how many times they've been here before."
How does Christianity emerge as *the* unique and reasonable explanation over any other religion?
I'm not anti-religion, I just think it's absolute crap that any religion says "we're the *only* way"
Scarpozzi
Lifer
- Jun 13, 2000
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Religion and Politics have both been about fear. He who can drive fear into the masses can control the masses. It's not exactly a new concept. The public, in general, has a short attention span so every few years someone in power does something that only seems drastic at the time to gain power from it. Normally it's short-lived, but sometimes it lasts the lifetime of he in power.
For example, Henry VIII ousted the Pope from the Church of England....gee I wonder why. It might just be that he didn't like someone else taking a cut of the profits and having that kind of power over his people.
For example, Henry VIII ousted the Pope from the Church of England....gee I wonder why. It might just be that he didn't like someone else taking a cut of the profits and having that kind of power over his people.
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