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Faith and Reason. My thoughts on God, science and the world
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smackababy
Lifer
No, the assumption that something does not exist is based on the complete lack of facts or data to support it being real. The Bible makes outrageous claims that we have been completely unable to reproduce. Snakes do not talk, in fact, there is data against it. Snakes do not contain the organs to have the capability to talk, and we have not found a single instance of a snake that did. We have not found a way to instantly turn water into wine or walk on water.
smackababy
Lifer
The world is older than 6000 years. There, proved the Bible was a work of fiction. It can't be non-fiction, as it contains information that is known to be false.
You've met your burden. You said snake don't have organs to talk, a man can't walk on water...we only sink, wine has never been instantly produced from water.
Why are you still arguing "outrageous claims" then? For something to be so false, you sure spend a lot of time arguing against them.
Do you argue against the claims of Harry Potter this strongly?
randomrogue
Diamond Member
Angels, walking on water, turning water into wine, raising the dead, living in a whale, a talking donkey, stopping the rotation of the earth, etc.
I'm going to call bullshit. There I did it. Bullshit.
You can't just say it's true and then when I say it's bullshit tell me to prove it. It's absurd and clearly the burden of proof is on you.
It's a creation myth and a story.
The Bible never said the world was 6000 years old. If you knew anything, you'd know that's a religious claim -- not one made in scripture.
The Bible never specifies a length of time. The Hebrew word "day" wasn't in reference to a 24- hour period. There are many instances of this, as in the book of Peter were a day is "a thousand years" to God. Secondly, right after the creative "days" Genesis 2:4 says that all six days were created in God's "day" that he made heaven and earth. Is that 24 hours too?
Educate yourself, please.
The same question I asked above; why are you still here arguing against myths? Makes you look stupid.
smackababy
Lifer
Okay, how about this.
A woman cannot be created from a rib: Fact.
A man cannot live in a fish: Fact.
One cannot turn water into wine: Fact.
A flood that covered the entire world never happened: Fact.
Two of every animal cannot fit on a boat: Fact.
Now, still want to claim the Bible is not a work of fiction? Because I am not the one looking stupid here.
ivwshane
Lifer
You asked him to prove his claim, he did, and then you complain about him arguing against myths?
Are you being serious or just seriously trolling right now?
bradly1101
Diamond Member
I don't think there can ever be an absolute, single truth about the existence of God.
To those who don't believe, proof is probably required.
To those who believe, there probably is no greater truth.
Some people switch it up by not believing in a God, but remembering that there are higher powers than ourselves, like maybe love or nature. It helps to keep one humble.
To those who don't believe, proof is probably required.
To those who believe, there probably is no greater truth.
Some people switch it up by not believing in a God, but remembering that there are higher powers than ourselves, like maybe love or nature. It helps to keep one humble.
There isn't any incentive in trying to counter any of your points. It's obvious, based on how you just got owned on the 6000 year claim you thought was in the Bible, that (1) you've probably or most certainly haven't read the book for yourself, and (2) you just want to be right and win an argument.
I would love to have a rational debate, to be honest, but obviously it won't go anywhere.
So what? You are still making an assumption based on your personal view that the absence of evidence is also evidence of absence. This is an incorrect view to hold. Just because we have no proof of something does not mean that the something does not exist. You make the assumption there is no god(s), but you do it based on faith alone.
There is no problem with this, as theists base their assumption on the existence of god(s) using the same thing - faith alone. There is absolutely no supporting evidence for there being, or not being, a god(s).
The problem is when people deny doing it so they can hold yourself to a higher level than others.
Now you are saying that because we have not found something yet it means that something does not exist. This is untrue. At one time we thought atoms might exist but had yet to find them (as in see them). This does not mean they did not exist before we found them.
How do you know that snakes cannot talk telepathically to humans who also have the ability to talk telepathically?
You are very close minded when it comes to things we have not yet discovered - you say they cannot exist if have not yet discovered them. You should open your mind to the idea that things we have not yet discovered do exist but are not yet discovered.
Please quote the portion of the Bible that says the Earth is 6000 years old.
He did not. He made a bunch of unproven assumptions again, complete with the poor assumption that anything not yet discovered does not exist.
You have never heard of stem cell regression from adult cells and the creation of a zygote via this method, have you? We either can currently do it or will be able to do it soon.
url=http://www.asa3.org/ASA/PSCF/1991/PSCF12-91Davis.html]Yes, a man can live in a fish.[/url]
You cannot do it, this does not mean someone else cannot.
The Bible does not say the "entire world".
Not true. You also have the count wrong.
You are zero for four. As I understand it, the discussion club is where people do not call each other stupid, I am not sure if you are allowed to call yourself stupid, though.
Sci guy--
I am more inclined to agree with you on the fact that since we haven't seen sonething happen, or since science has yet to achieve it, it's impossible or folklore.
Science, for this reason, has been careful to not declare something impossible.
The second they do that, someone figures out a way to do it.
I am more inclined to agree with you on the fact that since we haven't seen sonething happen, or since science has yet to achieve it, it's impossible or folklore.
Science, for this reason, has been careful to not declare something impossible.
The second they do that, someone figures out a way to do it.
The problem with these so called absolute truth's that religion teaches is that they aren't absolute and most aren't truth.... Just because you say something doesn't make it real.
When we say science doesn't prove some of these things 100%, but that doesn't mean gravity is just going to stop working randomly. It's just to say we don't understand all aspects of things.
There are plenty of facts in science, like evolution, gravity, constant speed of light, sun comes up in the morning because of rotation of the earth,...
But science explores more than just saying gravity is a fact. Science tries to explain why and how gravity happens, that is the theory of gravity. Which has predictions, data, experiments all backing up a certain theory of gravity. So we know that gravity exists as I can drop something and it will fall to the earth. But the real question is why does that happen.
So in science you have both facts and theories on the same subject. The scientific theory is far more robust than a simple fact or "truth"
The problem with religion is that many of their "truth's" are shown to be wrong by science and you end up with people still believing something that is clearly incorrect.
When we say science doesn't prove some of these things 100%, but that doesn't mean gravity is just going to stop working randomly. It's just to say we don't understand all aspects of things.
There are plenty of facts in science, like evolution, gravity, constant speed of light, sun comes up in the morning because of rotation of the earth,...
But science explores more than just saying gravity is a fact. Science tries to explain why and how gravity happens, that is the theory of gravity. Which has predictions, data, experiments all backing up a certain theory of gravity. So we know that gravity exists as I can drop something and it will fall to the earth. But the real question is why does that happen.
So in science you have both facts and theories on the same subject. The scientific theory is far more robust than a simple fact or "truth"
The problem with religion is that many of their "truth's" are shown to be wrong by science and you end up with people still believing something that is clearly incorrect.
rudeguy
Lifer
I'd love to hear one truth from the Bible that science disproved.
PowerEngineer
Diamond Member
And this is why any arguments about "truth" or "facts" in the bible always go nowhere.
You bible defender know darn well that other believers have used the bible to establish a time line back to the creation that is claimed to prove the earth is roughly 6000 years old. Just as you also know that many believers do insist that the bible describes a worldwide flood. Etc.
It takes a lot of chutzpa on your parts to pretend that these claims are just baseless fabrications by non-believers.
Yes, I hear you know. That's not what the bible says ... to you. You interpret the bible differently and more correctly than those "young earth" and "world flood" believers. You're right and they're wrong. Okay...
And that's also a problem. After all, if the bible is written in way that believers can interpret its "truths" or "facts" pretty much any way they want then it really doesn't contain any "truths" or "facts" at all.
smackababy
Lifer
Haven't heard of a woman being created from a rib.
Glad you found the most unbias source you could find.
Impossible to do. Sorry, but you're "oh someone can do it" is a bunch of malarkey.
"The waters flooded the earth for a hundred and fifty days" Flooded THE EARTH.
"God also instructed Noah to bring into the ark two of all living creatures, both male and female" ALL LIVING CREATURES.
GG, sir, GG.
*source http://christianity.about.com/od/biblestorysummaries/p/noahsarkflood.htm
randomrogue
Diamond Member
The bible is real and everything in it is true. The bible says so.
justoh
Diamond Member
James Burke has the answers to the way the world works.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdB61lXonEY
"The series posits that when ones view of the universe changes, the universe itself effectively changes."
Yeah....... the bible is total bullshit. I can't believe anyone could believe in it.
Here is a nice video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RV46fsmx6E
DC is not P&N. You have to conduct yourself to another standard here. Much like the tech side of the forums.
No trolling. If you have nothing to add to the discussion, stay out of the thread.
Also no profanity allowed.
esquared
Anandtech Forum Director
Here is a nice video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8RV46fsmx6E
DC is not P&N. You have to conduct yourself to another standard here. Much like the tech side of the forums.
No trolling. If you have nothing to add to the discussion, stay out of the thread.
Also no profanity allowed.
esquared
Anandtech Forum Director
Last edited by a moderator:
Dr. Zaus
Lifer
rudeguy
Lifer
So let's re-focus here. We are not going to agree on getting a direct answer out of science. That's ok. We are allowed to disagree and I'm glad I understand how others think a little better. Thanks for that!
Now let's actually ask a question. If you don't have the answer, that's ok. I'm asking these questions because I surely don't have all the answers.
Has science disproved anything that is said in the Bible?
Now let's actually ask a question. If you don't have the answer, that's ok. I'm asking these questions because I surely don't have all the answers.
Has science disproved anything that is said in the Bible?
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