Failed Predictions By Critics Of ACA

[Zorkorist]

It's pretty LEGION OF DOOM, to be 18 Trillion Dollars, in debt.

-John

 

[ivwshane]

It's pretty LEGION OF DOOM, to be 18 Trillion Dollars, in debt.

-John

I'm curious, exactly what happens when the US has too much debt? At what point will those issues happen? What percent or dollar amount would be considered ok?

 

[Zorkorist]

We've defaulted on our debt once before, and as the debt gets larger, our ability to pay it back gets smaller.

It's all fake money today.

We could crumble tomorrow.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

What are you going to do when someone shows up at your door and demands the $60,000 you owe him?

Pay him?

And then the $60,000 your child owes?

Pay him?

And then the $60,000 your wife owes?

Maybe you run out of money here... maybe you can pay him in some other way...

-John

 

[OverVolt]

It's Colbert's truthiness- if you believe it, then it must be true, right?

That pretty much covers all the negativity about the ACA, too, particularly among people who have employer sponsored plans & actually know only what they learned from Fox News...

Knowledge & truth not necessarily being the same at all.

Ugh. I enjoyed working without benefits. I sucked it up and went to a worse place just for the benefits. Because the ACA plan sucked. I had good individual coverage for my needs.

 

[Jhhnn]

Ugh. I enjoyed working without benefits. I sucked it up and went to a worse place just for the benefits. Because the ACA plan sucked. I had good individual coverage for my needs.

Standard non-specific declaration of Faith. If your old plan didn't actually suck more than an exchange plan, it would be ACA compliant, which it obviously wasn't. Your perceived "needs" are another matter entirely. Of course many employer sponsored plans are slightly better than exchange plans in terms of coverage. They're also less expensive for the employee- otherwise there would be no point to having them. That's the nature of it all.

 

[OverVolt]

Standard non-specific declaration of Faith. If your old plan didn't actually suck more than an exchange plan, it would be ACA compliant, which it obviously wasn't. Your perceived "needs" are another matter entirely. Of course many employer sponsored plans are slightly better than exchange plans in terms of coverage. They're also less expensive for the employee- otherwise there would be no point to having them. That's the nature of it all.

So for example in your 20's maternity care adds about $50-80/mo to a health insurance policy if you're female. So they mandated males have to carry maternity too for equality reasons. The price never really went down for females because it was ultimately redistributed to the old and sick anyway. I suppose I have to listen to you complain while you leech off me as well?

What I really should be doing (And had been doing anyway) was saving the difference for having a family one day but apparently I'll just join the ranks of the plummeting birthrate club. There are some pretty serious generational problems between millenials and boomers and the result of the ACA is but a mere symptom. The boomers got cheaper rates when THEY were younger, blew it, and voted themselves our money. You already had one chance to save your money and do something useful for once. I guess you'll be singing a different tune when the wellness programs start to bite you in the ass. The primary reason corporations wanted obamacare was to get the obese to lose weight and the smokers to quit. If the general health pool continues to decline the rates have nowhere to go but up. You can only make the hospitals bleed money for so long until they actually start closing. I'm expecting some type of hospital bail out eventually since the hospitals are running deep in the red.

 

[Jhhnn]

So for example in your 20's maternity care adds about $50-80/mo to a health insurance policy if you're female. So they mandated males have to carry maternity too. The price never really went down for females because it was ultimately redistributed to the old and sick anyway. I suppose I have to listen to you complain while you leech off me as well?

Want some cheese with that whine?

Can you substantiate the claim about maternity?

Can you not imagine a situation where you're the long term beneficiary of the provisions of the ACA? Or would you just prefer to be priced out of the market when you get older, maybe with some health problems of your own?

Your greedy, instantly self gratifying nose- look past the end of it.

 

[OverVolt]

Want some cheese with that whine?

Can you substantiate the claim about maternity?

Can you not imagine a situation where you're the long term beneficiary of the provisions of the ACA? Or would you just prefer to be priced out of the market when you get older, maybe with some health problems of your own?

Your greedy, instantly self gratifying nose- look past the end of it.

The ACA isn't going to stick around long term. The law is so unpalatable it has like an 8 year roll out. The best parts came first, like extending parent coverage to kids up to age 26, or not being dropped for pre-existing conditions. Now the fines are ratcheting up, the wellness programs are getting their teeth, the employer mandates and cadillac taxes kick in for 2018, the emergency funding for medicare expired. I think it'll be repealed around 2020.

Even the people who are pro-ACA realize its probably just the system we have in place until it fails and we get single payer.

The problems this tax season are nothing. Wait until the penalty is 3% of income. Pretty sure the oft-cited 4/5 are happy with their coverage was before anyone actually got penalized yet. Or their low-ball salary was getting them a subsidy they didn't deserve. The ACA taketh what it giveth 😉

http://www.galen.org/newsletters/changes-to-obamacare-so-far/

Thats a good gist of whats in store for you.

 

[sportage]

Ho ho He he.
I laugh because while ACA reforms, dare we call it Obamacare, have actually worked if for no other reason but to allow more people to have healthcare AND reduce those uninsured ER visits where the costs have always been passed onto everyone else that does have healthcare.
I laugh at that because all of this good news is a sitting duck for shutdown by the US Supremes.
And I don't mean Florence, Mary, Diana, and Betty.
I'm talking about the fools in the black robes. or at least most of them, the men.

Yep! Most likely the Supremes will ravage and destroy a good thing, not caring one rats ass about the consequences because damn-it why should they?

But there is a always the dark cloud to every silver lining.
Someday, way before we know it, Obama will be retired.
The republicans can then take us back to the future 1990.
More people will be sick and bankrupted.
Once again the banks will be free to screw us royally.
Stocks will dive. Bye bye 401K.
Unemployment will sky rocket.
The rich will get MUCH richer.
The poor will welcome in the middle class with open arms.
And you, at 85, with no longer the existence of any social safety net, you will have to go back looking for work.
85, sick, tired, poor, and would like fries with that?

Yes. The worst mistake people can make is assuming who is elected doesn't matter.
That the shit just... happens.
And republicans have made it quite clear come 2016 and beyond, they will gladly sling that shit.
.
.

 

[trenchfoot]

Well, Medicare and Social Security has been a great success for decades now, and so will the ACA if given the chance to mature and evolve.

Yet the GOP still tirelessly tries to get rid of them every chance they get. They've looked at these programs from every conceivable angle to kill them outright, to let them die a slow death, to hand it over to the private sector....you name it, the Repubs have tried it and are still at it, even despite countless millions of conservatives enjoying those very benefits.

The only folks that don't truly benefit from these programs are the very rich. Yep, the same folks who bought and own the Repub Party outright. They look at these social assistance programs as a piggy bank that they would simply love to exploit for fun and profit. Like the hostile takeover artists they are that exploit, dissect, dismantle and burn to the ground anything they can squeeze a profit out of, the only value they see in these programs are what kind of personal profit they can gouge from the folks who rely on these programs for essential needs, for some modicum of decent or subsistence living.

Who gives a shit for these folks struggling along to make something of their lives. To the very rich, who would very much like to drive every one of these folks into abject servitude for more power over them and the riches this power provides, they're simply worthless peasants that obstruct the very foundations of the cherished predatory capitalist principles that make these rich elites ever richer.

Small wonder that all these gov't programs are under constant attack from the rich and powerful.....and those gullible fools who side with the very folks that think nothing of driving them into poverty for more loot.

 

[OverVolt]

Well, Medicare and Social Security has been a great success for decades now, and so will the ACA if given the chance to mature and evolve.

Yet the GOP still tirelessly tries to get rid of them every chance they get. They've looked at these programs from every conceivable angle to kill them outright, to let them die a slow death, to hand it over to the private sector....you name it, the Repubs have tried it and are still at it, even despite countless millions of conservatives enjoying those very benefits.

The only folks that don't truly benefit from these programs are the very rich. Yep, the same folks who bought and own the Repub Party outright. They look at these social assistance programs as a piggy bank that they would simply love to exploit for fun and profit. Like the hostile takeover artists they are that exploit, dissect, dismantle and burn to the ground anything they can squeeze a profit out of, the only value they see in these programs are what kind of personal profit they can gouge from the folks who rely on these programs for essential needs, for some modicum of decent or subsistence living.

Who gives a shit for these folks struggling along to make something of their lives. To the very rich, who would very much like to drive every one of these folks into abject servitude for more power over them and the riches this power provides, they're simply worthless peasants that obstruct the very foundations of the cherished predatory capitalist principles that make these rich elites ever richer.

Small wonder that all these gov't programs are under constant attack from the rich and powerful.....and those gullible fools who side with the very folks that think nothing of driving them into poverty for more loot.

If by great success you mean bankrupt by 2036 then sure. I don't plan on SS contributing much to my retirement as a millennial. Even some of the younger boomers are a little shaky on relying on SS. Its just the reality of the situation.

 

[OverVolt]

Ho ho He he.
I laugh because while ACA reforms, dare we call it Obamacare, have actually worked if for no other reason but to allow more people to have healthcare AND reduce those uninsured ER visits where the costs have always been passed onto everyone else that does have healthcare.
I laugh at that because all of this good news is a sitting duck for shutdown by the US Supremes.
And I don't mean Florence, Mary, Diana, and Betty.
I'm talking about the fools in the black robes. or at least most of them, the men.

Yep! Most likely the Supremes will ravage and destroy a good thing, not caring one rats ass about the consequences because damn-it why should they?

But there is a always the dark cloud to every silver lining.
Someday, way before we know it, Obama will be retired.
The republicans can then take us back to the future 1990.
More people will be sick and bankrupted.
Once again the banks will be free to screw us royally.
Stocks will dive. Bye bye 401K.
Unemployment will sky rocket.
The rich will get MUCH richer.
The poor will welcome in the middle class with open arms.
And you, at 85, with no longer the existence of any social safety net, you will have to go back looking for work.
85, sick, tired, poor, and would like fries with that?

Yes. The worst mistake people can make is assuming who is elected doesn't matter.
That the shit just... happens.
And republicans have made it quite clear come 2016 and beyond, they will gladly sling that shit.
.
.

Well the plan is to have a family so my kids can help me out when I'm old just like my parents helped out my grandparents and I'll be expected to help out my parents I'm sure.

 

[theeedude]

Great, let's abandon modern living and return to subsistence survival, just so we can cut taxes.

 

[rudder]

Well, Medicare and Social Security has been a great success for decades now, and so will the ACA if given the chance to mature and evolve.

Kind of like GM being a success when they have their debts expunged by the government. You have a very loose definition of success. As long as there is taxpayer money to be thrown at a broken program to make it appear as a success... why then all is good I suppose.

 

[Jhhnn]

The ACA isn't going to stick around long term. The law is so unpalatable it has like an 8 year roll out. The best parts came first, like extending parent coverage to kids up to age 26, or not being dropped for pre-existing conditions. Now the fines are ratcheting up, the wellness programs are getting their teeth, the employer mandates and cadillac taxes kick in for 2018, the emergency funding for medicare expired. I think it'll be repealed around 2020.

Even the people who are pro-ACA realize its probably just the system we have in place until it fails and we get single payer.

The problems this tax season are nothing. Wait until the penalty is 3% of income. Pretty sure the oft-cited 4/5 are happy with their coverage was before anyone actually got penalized yet. Or their low-ball salary was getting them a subsidy they didn't deserve. The ACA taketh what it giveth 😉

http://www.galen.org/newsletters/changes-to-obamacare-so-far/

Thats a good gist of whats in store for you.

Despite the fact (yes, fact) than none of the predictions of Doom! have come true, you're still projecting more of the same Doom! as ever, huh?

If you were half as smart as you think you are, you'd be looking at your own headset to figure out why you keep thinking the same way. Or not. Righties aren't any good at examining their own mental processes, anyway, making them suckers for gut level propaganda.

 

[Jhhnn]

Kind of like GM being a success when they have their debts expunged by the government. You have a very loose definition of success. As long as there is taxpayer money to be thrown at a broken program to make it appear as a success... why then all is good I suppose.

Depends on how you look at it. GM exists to make money for the stockholders, & the People let it exist because it provides jobs & automobiles. Sometimes the latter is more important than the former, at least for people who want to maintain & expand middle class jobs & the economy.

 

[Jhhnn]

Well, Medicare and Social Security has been a great success for decades now, and so will the ACA if given the chance to mature and evolve.

Yet the GOP still tirelessly tries to get rid of them every chance they get. They've looked at these programs from every conceivable angle to kill them outright, to let them die a slow death, to hand it over to the private sector....you name it, the Repubs have tried it and are still at it, even despite countless millions of conservatives enjoying those very benefits.

The only folks that don't truly benefit from these programs are the very rich. Yep, the same folks who bought and own the Repub Party outright. They look at these social assistance programs as a piggy bank that they would simply love to exploit for fun and profit. Like the hostile takeover artists they are that exploit, dissect, dismantle and burn to the ground anything they can squeeze a profit out of, the only value they see in these programs are what kind of personal profit they can gouge from the folks who rely on these programs for essential needs, for some modicum of decent or subsistence living.

Who gives a shit for these folks struggling along to make something of their lives. To the very rich, who would very much like to drive every one of these folks into abject servitude for more power over them and the riches this power provides, they're simply worthless peasants that obstruct the very foundations of the cherished predatory capitalist principles that make these rich elites ever richer.

Small wonder that all these gov't programs are under constant attack from the rich and powerful.....and those gullible fools who side with the very folks that think nothing of driving them into poverty for more loot.

The most unseemly part of it all is that money is just a power trip at the tippy-top. It's all about Winning! the game when winning or losing won't affect their lifestyle at all but rather the lives of millions who don't have it nearly so good.

It's all greed & ego.

 

[Fern]

Well, Medicare and Social Security has been a great success for decades now, and so will the ACA if given the chance to mature and evolve.

As regards Medicare, your definition of "success" would be interesting to hear.

Yet the GOP still tirelessly tries to get rid of them every chance they get.
-snip-

🙄

Nobody's trying to "get rid of" of anything. I really don't understand why you guys must continuously resort to blatant lying, it discredits any valid point you may have.

GOP has been trying to reform them one way or another. Medicare is of particular concern. Look up how many more people will be on Medicare in about 10 years. Medicare already contributes substantially to our deficit and debt. It's going to get much worse.

Fern

 

[Fern]

Great, let's abandon modern living and return to subsistence survival, just so we can cut taxes.

You're headed there anyway. Income taxes don't have anything to do with it.

Fern

 

[Moonbeam]

Conservatives haven't been right about anything since the Pleistocene.

 

[ccbadd]

OTOH, none of the predictions of Doom have come true. Reasonable people can acknowledge that, integrate it into their thinking & maybe even their attitude. Might even lead to a person wondering why they ever thought any of it might come true & why anybody would have said it in the first place.

Have you looked at the structure of the law? When you push all the bad stuff down the road so the ill effects are not seen until a new administration in running things its easy act like its all great and wonderful.

 

[ivwshane]

Have you looked at the structure of the law? When you push all the bad stuff down the road so the ill effects are not seen until a new administration in running things its easy act like its all great and wonderful.

I'm curious, what "bad stuff" is being pushed down the road and how big will their impact be?

 

[Jhhnn]

Have you looked at the structure of the law? When you push all the bad stuff down the road so the ill effects are not seen until a new administration in running things its easy act like its all great and wonderful.

Oh God! Be Afraid! Be very afraid of what might happen someday if my stubbornly skewed naysayer hunch might come true!

I have no idea how well it'll work out down the road & neither does anybody else. All I'm sure of is so far, so good. Given that, it's reasonable to hope for the best & to continue, make it better as we go along. Overall, it's better than the way it was.

 

[dank69]

...

Nobody's trying to "get rid of" of anything. I really don't understand why you guys must continuously resort to blatant lying, it discredits any valid point you may have.

GOP has been trying to reform them one way or another. Medicare is of particular concern. Look up how many more people will be on Medicare in about 10 years. Medicare already contributes substantially to our deficit and debt. It's going to get much worse.

Fern

Are we pretending Paul Ryan doesn't want to privatize Medicare?