Explodin' MSI box--looking for cause

[spwango]

OK, I have the following system:

Athlon 64 3000+
MSI K8T NEO
Antec 380W PSU (3.3=35A 5=28A 12=18A)
Retail Radeon 9800 NP
512 MB PC2700 Samsung Cas2
512 MB pc2700 Corsair Cas2
80GB WD JB HD IDE (2)
Liteon DVD-Rom
Nu Tech 16x DVD Burner (Benq rebagde)
SB LIVE
Generic No Name modem
Aspire XDreamer II case

For the second time, it appears that I have blown the MSI motherboard. Over the weekend, I installed a second HD and the DVD burner. I had no issues at the time. I moved the files off the drive I was getting rid of to the new drive, no issues. Then, I powered down and removed the old drive. Put it together, touched the power button on the case and got a fairly signifigant static zap (thru the power button!). The mobo hasn't posted since. A very similar situation happened to me a few months back, turned out the mobo had died and didn't take any other components with it. I'm hoping at least that is the case this time. So, first order is to replace the mobo. Since they are down around $70, that seems fair, even though I'm not excited about ordering another MSI after this. It doesn't seem like the right time to do a full upgrade, unless other components are damaged (feel free to argue if you think I'm wrong)...

So, my question is this: Is it at all possible that the case or the PSU is responsible for this? It seems like whenever I move this box, something goes wrong. Asside from the expense, it sucks having your box go down.

thanks.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Have you checked for blown, leaking, bulging caps, and what do you have for power conditioning?

 

[Matthias99]

If you got zapped through the power button, either the motherboard fried/shorted out, or (more likely) you have a grounding problem. Check to make sure there aren't any loose screws or whatnot floating around in the case, and that your motherboard is properly secured on its standoffs and that the rear panel isn't shorting anywhere. You can also check with a multimeter; the case should have a voltage of 0.0 relative to the PSU's ground.

 

[spwango]

I'm using a CyberPower 883 ( http://www.cyberpowersystems.com/surge890.htm ). The model in the link doesn't match it, but the specs on the unit itself seem to and that model looks like it. Supressed voltage is 330 in both.

As far as the caps, I haven't seen any blown caps, but I've just done a fairly quick visual once over and I haven't extracted to mobo from the case yet.

 

[Matthias99]

Originally posted by: spwango
I'm using a CyberPower 883 ( http://www.cyberpowersystems.com/surge890.htm ). The model in the link doesn't match it, but the specs on the unit itself seem to and that model looks like it. Supressed voltage is 330 in both.

As far as the caps, I haven't seen any blown caps, but I've just done a fairly quick visual once over and I haven't extracted to mobo from the case yet.

Another obvious question -- did you check the grounding in the outlet you're plugged into? If you're having a ground problem there, nothing you do beyond that will fix it.

 

[Oyeve]

MSI is infamous for blowing out. I would NOT get another MSI board.


M=Motherboard
S=Starts
I=Igniting

 

[spwango]

Thanks Mattias..I'll give that a try. Hadn't really crossed my mind before, but I get zapped by the case on a fairly regular basis...we have a dry climate here, so it never struck me as unusual.

Another issue with the box, I did, when installing the board, accidentally break off a few of the grounding pieces (but not all) for the crappy little back plate the mobo manufacter ships for the ports on back...should I worry about that? I didn't break them all, just a couple..notably the one for the onboard LAN.

 

[Gothgar]

MSI have tons of problems...

allthough, it kinda sounds like a PSU problem, and everyone here will praise the Antec PSUs to thier grave, but I have had reliability problems with them before...

 

[spwango]

Well, I'm not a super huge fan of that PSU. I've been thinking about replacing it...that said, it is certainly better than the OEM 350 that came with the case. It is old, though. It's on it's second or third system now.

 

[LordPhoenix]

Tip: Do not buy an MSI Motherboard.

 

[nineball9]

Some of the posts in this thread seem to written with the presumption that the system is shocking you. I suspect that you are shocking the system instead.

The first scenario would lead one to suspect a faulty system which is unlikely. During dry winter months it is easy to develop a static charge in one's body; touching the power switch provides a discharge path for the charge. Alas, the path beyond the power switch is through the mother board. In short (no pun intended), your system is fine working order, but static electricity buildup in your body is destroying it.

As Matthias noted, ensure you have a working ground in the wall's power outlet. But this alone will not prevent static discharge through the mobo. Try discharging static charges by touching something else metalic before you touch the system's switch - the behavioral change will be the most difficult part.

Good luck!

 

[CraigRT]

This is about the 4th time I have seen an exploding mobo... and sadly, not to scare you, but every time it's been an MSI... some P4, some AMD.. makes no difference.

I know I won't be buying another one....

 

[Jeff7]

Yes, do check that the outlet is properly wired and grounded. If it is ungrounded, AND the hot/neutrals are reversed, that could be potentially dangerous. If you are grounded, and the hot wire somehow shorts against the case, you'll become a conductor for 120VAC.

A hardware store/department will have a little tester, less than $5, which has three lights on it typically. Plug it in, and certain lights will go on, indicating the status of the outlet.

 

[Zebo]

It's your PSU. Get rid of antec altogether.

 

[DrCool]

Originally posted by: CraigRT
This is about the 4th time I have seen an exploding mobo... and sadly, not to scare you, but every time it's been an MSI... some P4, some AMD.. makes no difference.

I know I won't be buying another one....

that's one of the most absurd statments i've heard in a long time..

the title of this thread is very misleading, as nothing EXPLODED.

just because something stopped functioning (sparked) doesn't mean it exploded..

lets try to use the proper verb next time...

 

[Zebo]

Here some good reading

http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...33&highlight=antec
http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...p;highlight=antec+neo2

basically it's a very common problem with antec PSU's and neo

 

[spwango]

Thanks all for the advice. I tested the outlet, and it's fine. I reseated the backplate and it appears to be fine too. This leaves me with two more things to try out: swap PSUs for the crappy one that came with my case, see if it makes a difference, and reseat everything in the case. If that doesn't work, anyone have suggestions for a replacement mobo? I think I'm going to go on the assumption that it didn't take anything else in the system out, whatever happened.

 

[spwango]

So, I have my box all taken apart and in pieces. I went thru and blew most of the dust out of it while I was at it. Should I try to take the mobo out of the case, set it on an antistatic bag, and see if I can get it to post (leaving the PSU in the case and still using the case's power switches)--is this safe to do?

 

[Mrvile]

I think nineball9 makes the best point.

I was at Dick's today getting snowpants, and the area where the pants were was carpeted (as well as the fitting room). I was constantly being bitten at from anything metal I touched, it was very annoying. Anyway using my awesome computer-building skills I kept myself grounded by keeping a hand on a metal surface at all times. My little anecdote.

But anyway nineball's logic makes the most sense. I assume you were wearing socks, and your room is carpeted. That makes for some bad static, and if you didn't ground yourself by touching something metal and going straight for the mobo (through the power button) you probably nailed it. By then there's nothing you can do.

Check your standoffs, make sure there are no screws or anything behind the mobo next time you put it together.

 

[CraigRT]

Originally posted by: DrCool

Originally posted by: CraigRT
This is about the 4th time I have seen an exploding mobo... and sadly, not to scare you, but every time it's been an MSI... some P4, some AMD.. makes no difference.

I know I won't be buying another one....

that's one of the most absurd statments i've heard in a long time..

the title of this thread is very misleading, as nothing EXPLODED.

just because something stopped functioning (sparked) doesn't mean it exploded..

lets try to use the proper verb next time...

absurd? are you fscking kidding me.... everytime i see a charred mobo it's MSI.. THAT'S absurd... I still don't understand why what i have said is absurd, makes no sense to me..

I have NEVER ever seen another brand of mobo with these problems, yet this seems almost common with MSI.. I'm so sorry it's crappy products, but apparently the truth I speak is absurd... :roll:

 

[Mrvile]

MSI is just so damn popular.

 

[spwango]

So, I tried the video board and one of the hard drives in a different box, they were both working, so I'm hoping any damage is isolated to the mobo. I put a new PSU on my box, result is the same. It's the mobo. Is it necessary to swap the PSU out then? Is there a favorite you all have for socket 754 mobos other than the MSI?

thanks again for the help!

 

[Blazer]

look for name brand PSUs with at least 20 amps on the 12 volt rail.

did you go and buy the circuit tester that checks the polarity and open circuits,if not then this could happen again,walmart even sells them.

 

[Baked]

The funny thing is some people will make everything explode. Some people should just stick w/ a Dell.

Never had a problem with MSI mobos.

 

[CraigRT]

Originally posted by: Baked
The funny thing is some people will make everything explode. Some people should just stick w/ a Dell.

Never had a problem with MSI mobos.

neither have I, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't, if I chanced again.