Existence of the "historical Jesus" increasingly questioned by scholars

[alkemyst]

http://ieet.org/index.php/IEET/more/pellissier20111125

Buffet is an agnostic which has nothing to do with Atheism.

Bill Gates is a Roman Catholic.

Soros is the only proclaimed Atheist on your list.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Do you want me to post some non-religious charities?

The problem is that you cannot post any Atheist groups that spend anywhere near......
Yet you try to change the parameters by attempting to include groups that are non - religious...not realizing that just because they are not religious does not make then Atheist groups........so sorry...now put your tail between your legs and get along....

 

[IronWing]

The problem is that you cannot post any Atheist groups that spend anywhere near......
Yet you try to change the parameters by attempting to include groups that are non - religious...not realizing that just because they are not religious does not make then Atheist groups........so sorry...now put your tail between your legs and get along....

That really wasn't the question. The question was : Are you saying that the only reason folks do good works is because of a belief in an historical Jesus?

 

[soulcougher73]

Im so glad im able to be loving, forgiving, charitable without baby Jesus. I feel sorry for duped ignorant people that have to be coax into doing good for the fear of being condemned from heaven for all eternity.

 

[Texashiker]

That really wasn't the question. The question was : Are you saying that the only reason folks do good works is because of a belief in an historical Jesus?

Not the only reason, no.

Where are the atheist food lines? Where are the atheist hospitals? Where is the atheist version of the salvation army?

Nobody has answered the question, why so much hate for a man who only taught love and peace?

Once you have that answer people will stop asking if Jesus existed.

Yes, he existed. We have numerous non-christian accounts of Jesus. For any other person in history that would be more than enough proof.

Im so glad im able to be loving, forgiving, charitable without baby Jesus. I feel sorry for duped ignorant people that have to be coax into doing good for the fear of being condemned from heaven for all eternity.

Please tell us what atheist charity groups you donate to.

 

[IronWing]

Not the only reason, no.

Very good.

 

[ElFenix]

Not the only reason, no.

Where are the atheist food lines? Where are the atheist hospitals? Where is the atheist version of the salvation army?

no real organization to atheism so why would you expect there to be organizations that are explicitly atheist rather than just secular?

Nobody has answered the question, why so much hate for a man who only taught love and peace?

I know of no one who has done more for humanity than Jesus. In fact, there is nothing wrong with Christianity … The trouble is with you Christians. You do not begin to live up to your own teachings.

 

[SlowSpyder]

So did they make the donations on behalf of atheists or an atheist group? My bet it never crossed their minds when they were donating.

Right, exactly... kind of the point of an atheist doing charitable work. When I do something for charity, that's exactly right, I don't think about how I don't believe in god so I'm going to do something nice for others.

The problem is that you cannot post any Atheist groups that spend anywhere near......
Yet you try to change the parameters by attempting to include groups that are non - religious...not realizing that just because they are not religious does not make then Atheist groups........

I don't see much difference... think about what atheism is. Atheism isn't a collective group of people who all do charitable work and live life as instructed from a central book of morals and instructions. Christians believe they are naughty imperfect sinners and need someone to take the wheel and show them right from wrong, tell them how to do good.

Atheism is different. If I donate my time or money to a charitable cause, religion or a lack of belief in a god doesn't cross my mind. Atheism doesn't have a central authority. In the context of this conversation, every time an atheist donates his or her time or money to a charitable cause, it is done for atheism as we didn't need the bible or religious book to tell us to do something good for our fellow man. We do so without hoping that helps gain us an eternal reward.

If you look at atheism as a collective religion, you're doing it wrong.

so sorry...now put your tail between your legs and get along....

No tail between my legs. I've been dropping deuces on your god's face all day long, why stop now? If you want to discuss this without the asshole comments, I'll be happy to do the same. But if you think you are going to show up and try and pull rank and make comments like the above, I'll play that game as well.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Not the only reason, no.

Where are the atheist food lines? Where are the atheist hospitals? Where is the atheist version of the salvation army?

Nobody has answered the question, why so much hate for a man who only taught love and peace?

Once you have that answer people will stop asking if Jesus existed.

Yes, he existed. We have numerous non-christian accounts of Jesus. For any other person in history that would be more than enough proof.

Because the christian dogma is so much more than love and peace. Just look at your posts regarding lifestyles of people who have absolutely no effect on your life one way or another.

You are looking at atheism as a collective group like religious people of the same sect of christianity are, like say catholics. Atheism isn't like that, when you understand that you'll have answers to the above and as to why individual atheists do charitable work as opposed to 'sects' of atheists doing so in the name of atheism. It's not a religion.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Buffet is an agnostic which has nothing to do with Atheism.

What do you think the difference is between the two?

Bill Gates is a Roman Catholic.

This is a weird one, but I agree that he shouldn't be in this list, and I should have double checked the source before I posted it. But with that said, it doesn't sound like he's much of a believer in a christian god so much as he's for the moral lessons of christianity.

http://www.celebatheists.com/wiki/Bill_Gates

http://www.reddit.com/r/Christianity/comments/20q47x/bill_gates_it_makes_sense_to_believe_in_god/

 

[Texashiker]

no real organization to atheism so why would you expect there to be organizations that are explicitly atheist rather than just secular?

Then who will replace organizations like charity hospitals, food banks and missionaries?

As for the "other references" question:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crucifixion_of_Jesus#Other_accounts_and_references

An early non-Christian reference to the crucifixion of Jesus is likely to be Mara Bar-Serapion's letter to his son, written sometime after AD 73 but before the 3rd century AD.

Most modern scholars agree that while this Josephus passage (called the Testimonium Flavianum) includes some later interpolations, it originally consisted of an authentic nucleus with a reference to the execution of Jesus by Pilate

Early in the second century another reference to the crucifixion of Jesus was made by Tacitus, generally considered one of the greatest Roman historians.[70][71] Writing in The Annals (c. 116 AD), Tacitus described the persecution of Christians by Nero and stated (Annals 15.44) that Pilate ordered the execution of Jesus

Scholars generally consider the Tacitus reference to the execution of Jesus by Pilate to be genuine, and of historical value as an independent Roman source.

Another possible reference to the crucifixion ("hanging" cf. Luke 23:39; Galatians 3:13) is found in the Babylonian Talmud:

Chances are the haters of Christ will reject every reference to Christ.

Their heart has been hardened to the truth.

 

[soulcougher73]

Please tell us what atheist charity groups you donate to.

Childerns Hospital through Amazon over Christmas, and a local radio station does Hope for the Holidays for people down on their luck. I do about $500/y between those 2. Then i donate clothing to 2nd hard stores etc thoughout the year. I also donate my time to various causes through out the year. Cleaning up local streams with work people etc.

They are not athiest groups, they are just charities, but they are not religious charities etc.

 

[JEDIYoda]

They are not athiest groups, they are just charities, but they are not religious charities etc.

so you really did not answer the question....umm..ok...

 

[JEDIYoda]

This is a weird one, but I agree that he shouldn't be in this list, and I should have double checked the source before I posted it. But with that said, it doesn't sound like he's much of a believer in a christian god so much as he's for the moral lessons of christianity.

explain away....

 

[JEDIYoda]

You are looking at atheism as a collective group like religious people of the same sect of christianity are, like say catholics. Atheism isn't like that, when you understand that you'll have answers to the above and as to why individual atheists do charitable work as opposed to 'sects' of atheists doing so in the name of atheism. It's not a religion.

Didn`t you know that Atheism is the new religion of the millennium???

 

[JEDIYoda]

That really wasn't the question. The question was : Are you saying that the only reason folks do good works is because of a belief in an historical Jesus?

nice deflection....but that was the question.....it was a sub section of another question. Yet it was still a question...

 

[IronWing]

nice deflection....but that was the question.....it was a sub section of another question. Yet it was still a question...

You silly.

 

[soulcougher73]

so you really did not answer the question....umm..ok...

Why does it matter if they are athiest groups or christian charities? What does it say about an athiest who donates time/money/energy to a Christian run charity?

 

[soulcougher73]

You silly.

Silly would be putting it gently. Too stupid to know he's stupid would be more accurate.

 

[alkemyst]

What do you think the difference is between the two?



This is a weird one, but I agree that he shouldn't be in this list, and I should have double checked the source before I posted it. But with that said, it doesn't sound like he's much of a believer in a christian god so much as he's for the moral lessons of christianity.

http://www.celebatheists.com/wiki/Bill_Gates

http://www.reddit.com/r/Christianity/comments/20q47x/bill_gates_it_makes_sense_to_believe_in_god/

Do you understand a lot of the groups claiming these things are atheist groups trying to build credibility or anti-groups trying to take away credibility from these ultra wealthy individuals.

Bill Gates was recently challenged about his Roman Catholic beliefs and he defended them, I know this because my family is all Roman Catholic and they thought he was an atheist as well.

Buffet is an Agnostic. He believes, but not sure what the story really is.

Soros is a well known Atheist and not well known for his humanitarian efforts. He is running a shell game IMHO.

 

[SlowSpyder]

explain away....

Huh? I said he shouldn't have been in that list. His own words should explain it for you. Not sure what you're for digging at here. If someone asked you if you believe in god, would you simply say yes or would you dance around it and say there are some good and moral teachings in religion?

Didn`t you know that Atheism is the new religion of the millennium???

You know how you can tell it isn't a religion? Because it isn't driven by fear.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Not the only reason, no.

Where are the atheist food lines? Where are the atheist hospitals? Where is the atheist version of the salvation army?



Please tell us what atheist charity groups you donate to.

" ‘Tis the season for giving — but not always for receiving. As the holiday season peaks, atheist and humanist groups around the country have seen their charitable impulses rebuffed by both Christian and secular organizations. Recent incidents of “thanks, but no thanks,” include:

• A group of Kansas City, Mo., nonbelievers was told their help was not needed after they volunteered to help a local Christian group distribute Thanksgiving meals.
• A $3,000 donation to a Morton Grove, Ill., park, collected by a local atheist group, was returned. Park officials said they did not wish to “become embroiled in a First Amendment dispute.”
• A group of Spartanburg, S.C., atheists was denied the opportunity to help at a Christian-run soup kitchen. The soup kitchen’s executive director told local press she would resign before accepting the atheists’ help and asked, “Why are they targeting us?”

http://www.religionnews.com/2013/12/19/season-giving-atheist-groups-charity-rebuffed/

 

[Texashiker]

Victorian Gray, even though this post is under yours, it is not directed at you.

Benjamin Franklin once wrote to an associate,

"to hate someone for no reason is a sign of a sick mind."

Those who rebuke, reject, and otherwise hate the name of Jesus should ask themselves why do they hate someone who taught love, peace, forgiveness and charity.

 

[SlowSpyder]

While I believe that some part of it is an honest yearning to help those who need it, a lot of the purpose in these religious charities and organizations is for commercial reasons. In the fight for souls, and consequently a healthier tithe, a christian organization is better appearing than a christian/muslim/atheist charity.

 

[Darwin333]

Thank you.





How is 4 years a long time?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Non-believers are proud to proclaim the United States was not founded on Christian beliefs.

What did the founding fathers continue? Slavery for one thing.

Take your pick:

Atheist who do not value human life, and have no compassion or charity.

Or the teachings of Christ with love, compassion and charity.

Might I ask what happened to you in your life that made you feel so little of humanity as to believe they need a book to tell them to value human life or have compassion or charity?

How do you suppose those things existed before your book did?