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Evidence that Kerryites/Democrats hate America

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Originally posted by: conjur
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: conjur
Originally posted by: DealMonkey
Ummm, so where's the part where they ask "Do you hate America?" and then they respond?
Umm...yeah...where's that question??


This is so sad....so sad.

The Bush-God fanbois continue to stoop to lower and lower steps to dredge up the slightest bit of propaganda and exaggerate the hell out of it.
Ah, the master of obfuscation strikes again.

So what's your take on the poll results?
Oh, I am FAR from being Bush.


As for my take on the actual question (not your bullsh*t topic title), it makes a lot of sense. Kerry voters are Democratic and, typical, in the more urban areas were more poor are likely to live and in need of social welfare. They may feel as if they don't have the same opportunities as those born with silver spoons in their mouth.

IMO, that poll's results just indicate the stereotypes surrounding the two parties.

That's much better than your usual grandstanding.

Do you really believe that everyone who's successful was born "with a silver spoon in their mouth" and the only hope for the urban poor is government largess?

If so, you've been completey brainwashed by Democratic drivel and you're beyond hope.
 
riprorin, I suggest you take a community college course on statistics or just read anything on statistics. Hopefully that will help prevent you posting "fuzzy" statistics on this board.
 
I'm not too happy about the fact that the legitimate government of the US was overthrown by the Supreme Court. That was a major catastrophe leading to illegal war and world contempt massive budget deficits and joblessness. We have been slimed by a mafia operative. Other than that things are pretty good.
 
Originally posted by: Infohawk
riprorin, I suggest you take a community college course on statistics or just read anything on statistics. Hopefully that will help prevent you posting "fuzzy" statistics on this board.

Thanks for the advice.

Bush voters agree, by a 83 to 7% margin, that America is generally fair and decent. Kerry voters also agree but only by 46 to 37%. Fully 81% of Bush voters believe that the world would be a better place if other coutries were more like the US. Only 48% of Kerry voters agree.

So why do Kerryites/Dems/Libs have so much more disdain for America than Republicans?
 
Riprorin, where is you evidence that liberals have more disdain for America than conservatives? Your statistics show ONLY that fewer liberals believe America is less fair and decent and that fewer liberals think the world would be a better place if other countries were more like the US. It does not say ANYTHING about disdain.
 
Originally posted by: Riprorin
When polled, 64% of Amercians agrred that America is generally fair and decent, while 22% said that it was unfair and discriminatory. And 62% agreed that the world would be a better place if other countries behaved like the US, while 14% say it would be a worse place.

Here's where it gets really interesting:

Bush voters agree, by a 83 to 7% margin, that America is generally fair and decent. Kerry voters also agree but only by 46 to 37%. Fully 81% of Bush voters believe that the world would be a better place if other coutries were more like the US. Only 48% of Kerry voters agree.

Almost all Republican voters believe in US exceptionalism. Only about half of Democratic voters do.

Assuming the question: "America is generally fair and decent" --is really code-speak for:

Do you agree with the Bush administrations policies.

Then...

This to me shows that-- of the universe of polled voters in this excercice: 7% of Bush voters aren't easily mislead.
 
Originally posted by: Infohawk
Riprorin, where is you evidence that liberals have more disdain for America than conservatives? Your statistics show ONLY that fewer liberals believe America is less fair and decent and that fewer liberals think the world would be a better place if other countries were more like the US. It does not say ANYTHING about disdain.

This poll gets at people views on American exceptionalism, an idea shared by Democratic presidents FDR and JFK.

Many Democrats believe that the US is not special, nor especially good. To me that's disdainful.
 
"Many Democrats believe that the US is not special, nor especially good. To me that's disdainful."
That's a big leap. And it's not supported by the dictionary. Your view of "not special, nor especially good" is odd.
 
Originally posted by: Riprorin
Originally posted by: conjur
Oh, I am FAR from being Bush.


As for my take on the actual question (not your bullsh*t topic title), it makes a lot of sense. Kerry voters are Democratic and, typical, in the more urban areas were more poor are likely to live and in need of social welfare. They may feel as if they don't have the same opportunities as those born with silver spoons in their mouth.

IMO, that poll's results just indicate the stereotypes surrounding the two parties.
Do you really believe that everyone who's successful was born "with a silver spoon in their mouth" and the only hope for the urban poor is government largess?

If so, you've been completey brainwashed by Democratic drivel and you're beyond hope.
Where did I say that? I said "results just indicate the stereotypes surrounding the two parties"

I was not party to the poll so I cannot tell you how I would have answered as I have no idea what questions were posed.
 
Originally posted by: Infohawk
"Many Democrats believe that the US is not special, nor especially good. To me that's disdainful."
That's a big leap. And it's not supported by the dictionary. Your view of "not special, nor especially good" is odd.

Substitute "The US" for those below, and you'd have it right:

"Many Democrats believe that Bush II is not special, nor especially good.
"Many Democrats believe that Bush I is not special, nor especially good.
"Many Democrats believe that Reagan is not special, nor especially good.
"Many Democrats believe that Ford is not special, nor especially good.
"Many Democrats believe that Nixon is not special, nor especially good.

Not that I'm a democrat--its just a guess on my part.
 
Originally posted by: Infohawk
"Many Democrats believe that the US is not special, nor especially good. To me that's disdainful."
That's a big leap. And it's not supported by the dictionary. Your view of "not special, nor especially good" is odd.

Disdain is a feeling of contempt and aversion: scorn. If you don't think that Kerryites/Dms/Libs aren't scornful of America, you must be a newbie here.

"Not special, nor especially good" is the approximate inverse to the view of American exceptionalism espoused by FDR and JFK. Can you tell me what happened to your party?
 
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
liberals are into self-loathing

Unfortunately that can be all too true. We all hate ourselves as if each of us were the worst in the world and first awareness of this can bring you down. To get to heaven, as is made clear in myth from the beginning of time one has to go through hell. It liberals that make that trek, those whose self hate is not so bad that it is totally sealed off from consciousness. That is why Jesus chose the meek and downtrodden. They already knew about their self loathing.
 
riprorn, your definition of disdainful doesn't make sense. It is totally possible that there could be a person who thinks that the US is no better than other countries and is not particularly special and yet still love their country.

If you are curious why people (including Republicans according to the poll) are beginning to think that we are not exceptional, it is probably because of the fact we have so many atrocities in our past: slavery, genocide of native americans, mistreatment of japanese americans. Most people recognize that they are fallible just like other people are. These same people are aware that the US is a country with good and bad aspects. This does not mean they hate America.

Anyway, of course presidents are going to say america is exceptional. Do you have any evidence Kerry does not believe the same? I would gamble he says he believes in American exceptionalism too.
 
I'm not a Democrat, but I've more frequently been labeled a liberal than a conservative. I am going to vote for Kerry.

I love America in the truest way I know how. I've studied her history for years, know her flaws and recognize that she's imperfect. I love her more for it. We've made a lot of mistakes along the way and history will inevitably say that we're making a great many now, just as every nation in any part of history. We are a land that has dealt with one of the greatest of evils of the modern world, and we've done it without the racial war and genocide so many of the brightest minds of the early 1800s prophecied. We are a land that has transferred power between men and parties who hate each other, many times. We are a land that has removed Presidents for deceiving the public.

America's strength isn't that she's perfect. The true beauty of America is that we can overcome out problems peacefully and through the rule of law balanced with public will.

Criticizing America in a civil manner is an act of great patriotism.
 
Riprorin -- The entire premise of your thread is full of crap. It reminds me of a twist on the title of a country song:

Don't It Make Your Blue Eyes Brown?
rose.gif
 
This thread is just another in a long line of BullSh!t that neocons like to foster when they have nothing of any worth to contribute, particularly when they have nothing postive they can say about their candidate that is now ruining(opps, I mean running) the country. Little does Riprorin know that we who are democrats, liberals, and true believers in fairness and justice see right through his pathetic diatribe for what it is, a poorly framed diversion from the real issues that affect Americans day after day. To feed this bafoon of the neocon right wing with argument is a waste of bandwidth. Ignore him and all his threads. He will only regurgitate his ignorance at every oppurtunity to sucker you in for debate. He is a pathetic loser, not worthy of your attention.
 
Here's the poll Riprorin ripped for his bloviating:

http://rasmussenreports.com/USA%20Role%20Model.htm

April 27, 2004--More than six-out-of-ten American voters believe the USA is a good role model for the rest of the world.
A Rasmussen Reports survey found that 64% of voters believe that American society is generally fair and decent. Additionally, 62% believe the world would be a better place if other countries became more like the United States.

However, while a solid majority views the nation in this way, there are significant differences of opinion among partisan, ideological, and political fault lines.

Among Bush voters, 83% say that American society is generally fair and decent. Just 7% say it is basically unfair and discriminatory.

While Bush voters are united behind this perception, Kerry voters are divided--46% say fair and decent while 37% say unfair and discriminatory.

Eighty-one percent (81%) of Bush voters also believe the world would be better if other nations were more like the United States. This view is shared by just 48% of Kerry voters.

From an ideological perspective, 74% of conservatives say the world would be better if other nations were more like ours. Just 15% of conservatives believe it would be worse.

However, among self-identified liberals, the numbers are 49% better and 37% worse. A plurality of those who say they are very liberal believe the world would be in worse shape if other nations were more like ours.

Moderate voters, by a 3-to-1 margin think that having other nation's more like us would create a better world.

Similar differences of opinion were found on the question of the United Nations. Just 38% of American voters have a favorable opinion of that organization.

The survey also found that just 18% of voters believe most Americans are racist. Sixty-five percent (65%) disagree.

Rasmussen Reports provides a comprehensive Election 2004 polling service. We have recently released state polling data for the Presidential race in California, New Hampshire, New Jersey, West Virginia, Florida, and Colorado. Earlier surveys were conducted in Washington, Michigan, Minnesota, Pennsylvania, Iowa, Ohio, and Missouri.

On a national basis this time around, the Rasmussen Reports Presidential Election Tracking Poll updates the Presidential race on a daily basis.

The telephone survey of 1,000 Likely Voters was conducted by Rasmussen Reports April 25-26, 2004. The margin of sampling error for the full sample is +/- 3 percentage points, with a 95% level of confidence.
 
Originally posted by: conjur
Here's the poll Riprorin ripped for his bloviating:

http://rasmussenreports.com/USA%20Role%20Model.htm

April 27, 2004--More than six-out-of-ten American voters believe the USA is a good role model for the rest of the world.
A Rasmussen Reports survey found that 64% of voters believe that American society is generally fair and decent. Additionally, 62% believe the world would be a better place if other countries became more like the United States.

However, while a solid majority views the nation in this way, there are significant differences of opinion among partisan, ideological, and political fault lines.

Among Bush voters, 83% say that American society is generally fair and decent. Just 7% say it is basically unfair and discriminatory.

While Bush voters are united behind this perception, Kerry voters are divided--46% say fair and decent while 37% say unfair and discriminatory.

Eighty-one percent (81%) of Bush voters also believe the world would be better if other nations were more like the United States. This view is shared by just 48% of Kerry voters.

From an ideological perspective, 74% of conservatives say the world would be better if other nations were more like ours. Just 15% of conservatives believe it would be worse.

However, among self-identified liberals, the numbers are 49% better and 37% worse. A plurality of those who say they are very liberal believe the world would be in worse shape if other nations were more like ours.

Moderate voters, by a 3-to-1 margin think that having other nation's more like us would create a better world.

Similar differences of opinion were found on the question of the United Nations. Just 38% of American voters have a favorable opinion of that organization.

The survey also found that just 18% of voters believe most Americans are racist. Sixty-five percent (65%) disagree.

Rasmussen Reports provides a comprehensive Election 2004 polling service. We have recently released state polling data for the Presidential race in California, New Hampshire, New Jersey, West Virginia, Florida, and Colorado. Earlier surveys were conducted in Washington, Michigan, Minnesota, Pennsylvania, Iowa, Ohio, and Missouri.

On a national basis this time around, the Rasmussen Reports Presidential Election Tracking Poll updates the Presidential race on a daily basis.

The telephone survey of 1,000 Likely Voters was conducted by Rasmussen Reports April 25-26, 2004. The margin of sampling error for the full sample is +/- 3 percentage points, with a 95% level of confidence.
And this is the article he's basically plagiarizing instead of thinking for himself. 😛

As this is written, no one knows just what effect the gruesome photos from Baghdad's Abu Ghraib prison will have on George W. Bush's poll numbers. The Washington cognoscenti now chattering happily about whether Donald Rumsfeld will be forced to resign expect the numbers to plunge. But these same people also thought Bush's numbers would dip after fighting intensified in Iraq in April--and they didn't. Instead, since his much-panned April 13 press conference, Bush has run perceptibly better against John Kerry than he did before mid-April. Voters rallied behind the president even amid--or perhaps because of--the turmoil.

About the Abu Ghraib abuses there is not much divergence of opinion. Almost all Americans are as disgusted as Bush himself. Americans hold themselves to high standards, and if others hold us to those standards even while they excuse or ignore the far more evil acts of others--like the mass murders and torture of Saddam Hussein's regime--that's a price we must pay. It is essential to determine whether these were the isolated acts of a few miscreants or the result of actions of those higher in the chain of command. It is tragic that these abuses, at least for the moment, are overshadowing the bravery, resourcefulness, and generosity of tens of thousands of Americans in uniform in Iraq.

More so for some than others. One of the basic divides in public opinion is over American exceptionalism, the idea shared by Franklin Roosevelt and Ronald Reagan, John Kennedy and George W. Bush, that ours is a special, and especially good, nation. The divide is illustrated by two questions recentlyput by pollster Scott Rasmussen. In response, 64 percent agreed that America is generally fair and decent, while 22 percent said it was unfair and discriminatory. And 62 percent agreed that the world would be a better place if other countries behaved more like the United States, while 14 percent say it would be a worse place.

There is an interesting difference between Republicans and Democrats. Bush voters agree, by an 83-to-7 percent margin, that America is generally fair and decent. Kerry voters also agree but only by 46 to 37 percent. Fully 81 percent of Bush voters believe that the world would be a better place if other countries were more like the United States. Only 48 percent of Kerry voters agree. Almost all Republican voters believe in American exceptionalism. Only about half of Democratic voters do. We have seen this same pattern on the war in Iraq--Republicans united in support of Bush and Democrats divided.

I think we are seeing, or will see, this same pattern of response to Abu Ghraib. Most Americans, including a large majority of Republicans and about half of Democrats, will see this as aberrant misconduct, a betrayal of the high standards we hold ourselves to and usually uphold. Other Democrats, unbelievers in American exceptionalism, will seize on Abu Ghraib as evidence that this country is not special and especially good. And so, of course, will our critics and enemies around the world.

Dignity. This has two implications, one for the campaign and one for governance. For the campaign, it is a structural disadvantage for Kerry. In a year when both candidates are trying to rally their supporters to get out and vote, Bush can appeal to voters of one mind, and Kerry must appeal to voters of two minds. This helps to explain why he voted for the Iraq war and against the $87 billion supplemental appropriation. Or, as he put it March 16, "I actually did vote for the $87 billion before I voted against it." He has to appeal to those who want us to win and those who think we deserve to lose.

For governance, Bush has the task of leading a country that believes in American exceptionalism in a world in which that idea is, for many, off-putting if not repugnant. This is why Bush has taken pains to explain that the "nonnegotiable demands of human dignity" are not just American but universal, the gift of God or, if you will, imperatives imposed by secular ideas of liberty and equality. America's specialness has been its good fortune in asserting and trying to uphold those ideals earlier than others and having the strength, and therefore the obligation, to advance them around the world. Abu Ghraib makes that message harder to sell, but we must persevere.
 
I was going to say I doubt I ever had an original thought, but I heard that somewhere. Don't be too hard on the guy. It's a very interesting subject.
 
Hehe....this is brilliant.

Rip:"When polled, 64% of Amercians agrred that America is generally fair and decent, while 22% said that it was unfair and discriminatory. And 62% agreed that the world would be a better place if other countries behaved like the US, while 14% say it would be a worse place."

Actual Article: "In response, 64 percent agreed that America is generally fair and decent, while 22 percent said it was unfair and discriminatory. And 62 percent agreed that the world would be a better place if other countries behaved more like the United States, while 14 percent say it would be a worse place."



Rip: "Here's where it gets really interesting:"

Article: "There is an interesting difference between Republicans and Democrats"



Rip: "Bush voters agree, by a 83 to 7% margin, that America is generally fair and decent. Kerry voters also agree but only by 46 to 37%. Fully 81% of Bush voters believe that the world would be a better place if other coutries were more like the US. Only 48% of Kerry voters agree."

Article: "Bush voters agree, by an 83-to-7 percent margin, that America is generally fair and decent. Kerry voters also agree but only by 46 to 37 percent. Fully 81 percent of Bush voters believe that the world would be a better place if other countries were more like the United States. Only 48 percent of Kerry voters agree. "



Rip: "Almost all Republican voters believe in US exceptionalism. Only about half of Democratic voters do. "

Article: "Almost all Republican voters believe in American exceptionalism. Only about half of Democratic voters do. "



Rip: "FDR and JFK shared the idea of American exceptionalism. What happened to today Dems/Liberals that they've turned so sour on America? "

Article: "One of the basic divides in public opinion is over American exceptionalism, the idea shared by Franklin Roosevelt and Ronald Reagan, John Kennedy and George W. Bush, that ours is a special, and especially good, nation. "



Rip (repeating himself....er...the article): "This poll gets at people views on American exceptionalism, an idea shared by Democratic presidents FDR and JFK."


Etc, etc, etc. Good job Rip! Your avatar suits you rather well, I'd say. 😀

Raaaawwkkk!!! Liberals are bad!! Rippy wanna cracker!!! Raaaawwwwkkk!! 😛
 
It's a very interesting subject.

Yeah, really interesting how the partisan hacks take any given set of data and twists it into their bizarro world vision of what they believe the other side thinks. I guess the leftistas will have their turn next.
 
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