EV + roof solar panels = Personal Energy Independence

[tmaestro]

Heard on the radio that some guy in Seal Beach has solar panels on his house and charged his GM EV1 every night and still came out positive, putting more power on the grid than he took off. The lease on the EV1 expired & GM wouldn't let him renew, so (last I heard) he had a EV RAV4 from Toyota (IIRC).

GM is now crushing their EV1s, and there's a protest/vigil in Burbank. People have offered to buy them for ~24k each w/ a signed waiver of liability, but GM continues to crush. I don't think it's the end of the EV* project at GM, but I don't see why GM won't at least let these hippies (lol) have their EVs.

I think it's pretty cool that the guy (and probably others) was (were) mostly energy independent. The setup wouldn't work outside of sunny areas like the southwest, but if were implemented (thru tax incentives or fed subsidized lower interest rates on equity loans), it would take stress off the grid, quiet the streets, and cut pollution all in one sweep.

Is there something I'm missing? It seems like a pretty good solution for the southwest if it were implemented on a large scale.

 

[sandorski]

Yup, getting HomeOwners to install Solar Panels, Wind Turbines, and other devices could have a dramatic impact on Energy Supply. Even in areas that are not particularly sunny Solar Panels can generate decent amounts of Energy. I'm all for it.

 

[tmaestro]

I don't think wind turbines are worth it, not if something as simple as roofing your house in solar panels allows you to come out ahead. Edison would have to operate only to supply industry & other ventures that consume more energy than their roof area can sustain. The look of wind turbines on every roof in the suburbs would probably suck, too.

How much does it cost to roof a house in solar panels? Can you imagine if a whole city (well, a small city, or maybe just a suburb) went ahead and did it, took themselves off the grid? Maybe suburban hippies (lol) should put their money where their mouth is and set up something like the libretarian 'free state project.'

 

[Aegeon]

Here's the basic answer, you can read more about the issues in the article.

For now, however, the bottom line motivates most builders, said Bob Yoder, president of the Inland Empire Division of Shea Homes, one of four builders offering solar technology at Terramor, a planned community at Ladera Ranch in south Orange County.

"Solar power is still expensive," Yoder said, "and you need higher-priced homes to absorb it." The average cost of a 2-kilowatt residential system is about $15,000 per home.

"It really doesn't work as an option," he said. "It doesn't get selected because of the cost."

http://www.latimes.com/classified/reale...ews/la-re-solar13mar13,1,6949421.story

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: tmaestro
I don't think wind turbines are worth it, not if something as simple as roofing your house in solar panels allows you to come out ahead. Edison would have to operate only to supply industry & other ventures that consume more energy than their roof area can sustain. The look of wind turbines on every roof in the suburbs would probably suck, too.

How much does it cost to roof a house in solar panels? Can you imagine if a whole city (well, a small city, or maybe just a suburb) went ahead and did it, took themselves off the grid? Maybe suburban hippies (lol) should put their money where their mouth is and set up something like the libretarian 'free state project.'

One of the problems with Solar Panels is that they are Low Current, so anything that uses a heating element, such as electric Stoves, Ovens, Clothes Dryers, etc do not work well with Solar Power. You can offset that by either using electricity off the grid or through Wind Turbines. You are right though, if Solar Panels do the job then Wind Turbines become redundant.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: tmaestro
I don't think wind turbines are worth it, not if something as simple as roofing your house in solar panels allows you to come out ahead. Edison would have to operate only to supply industry & other ventures that consume more energy than their roof area can sustain. The look of wind turbines on every roof in the suburbs would probably suck, too.

How much does it cost to roof a house in solar panels? Can you imagine if a whole city (well, a small city, or maybe just a suburb) went ahead and did it, took themselves off the grid? Maybe suburban hippies (lol) should put their money where their mouth is and set up something like the libretarian 'free state project.'

One of the problems with Solar Panels is that they are Low Current, so anything that uses a heating element, such as electric Stoves, Ovens, Clothes Dryers, etc do not work well with Solar Power. You can offset that by either using electricity off the grid or through Wind Turbines. You are right though, if Solar Panels do the job then Wind Turbines become redundant.

Not true, most sytems have a bank of either 150 or 200 Amps worth of Battery reserve to augment power needs and for when there is a storm and cloud cover.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: tmaestro
Heard on the radio that some guy in Seal Beach has solar panels on his house and charged his GM EV1 every night and still came out positive, putting more power on the grid than he took off. The lease on the EV1 expired & GM wouldn't let him renew, so (last I heard) he had a EV RAV4 from Toyota (IIRC).

GM is now crushing their EV1s, and there's a protest/vigil in Burbank. People have offered to buy them for ~24k each w/ a signed waiver of liability, but GM continues to crush. I don't think it's the end of the EV* project at GM, but I don't see why GM won't at least let these hippies (lol) have their EVs.

I think it's pretty cool that the guy (and probably others) was (were) mostly energy independent. The setup wouldn't work outside of sunny areas like the southwest, but if were implemented (thru tax incentives or fed subsidized lower interest rates on equity loans), it would take stress off the grid, quiet the streets, and cut pollution all in one sweep.

Is there something I'm missing? It seems like a pretty good solution for the southwest if it were implemented on a large scale.

I heard about this crushing of perfectly fine vehicles.

A clear sign they didn't expect people to like and actually drive the vehicles and the Oil Cartel Operation has pressured them to take such drastic step in collecting the cars like a Repo and destroying them.

 

[Zedtom]

The widespread use of solar panels worldwide would be a good thing, but my cynical feelings about energy companies leaves me with doubts.

The day may come when the electric utility in your area will come out to your house, install panels on your roof. then hook everything up to your meter. That way they could charge you for using sunlight.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Zedtom

The day may come when the electric utility in your area will come out to your house, install panels on your roof. then hook everything up to your meter.

That way they could charge you for using sunlight.

Don't forget Politicians charging you a Usage Tax for the Sunlight too.

 

[Genx87]

GM is now crushing their EV1s, and there's a protest/vigil in Burbank. People have offered to buy them for ~24k each w/ a signed waiver of liability, but GM continues to crush. I don't think it's the end of the EV* project at GM, but I don't see why GM won't at least let these hippies (lol) have their EVs.

Because it is their property and they have technology in them that they dont want gettign into the hands of their competitors.

These people think becauase they took part in a beta they are entitled to the product.

Edit: On a side note I do like the idea of putting panels on peoples rooftops. This is a very good idea to conserve energy. The problem is I dont believe the costs are low enough for the avg person.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
A clear sign they didn't expect people to like and actually drive the vehicles and the Oil Cartel Operation has pressured them to take such drastic step in collecting the cars like a Repo and destroying them.

Dave:

You want to back the the bolded part of your statement, or is this just one of your liberal off-the-wall opinions.

 

[rahvin]

Originally posted by: Zedtom
The widespread use of solar panels worldwide would be a good thing, but my cynical feelings about energy companies leaves me with doubts.

The day may come when the electric utility in your area will come out to your house, install panels on your roof. then hook everything up to your meter. That way they could charge you for using sunlight.

One of the largest producers of solar panels is BP (That's British Petroleum), their panels are of consistently better quality and usually cheaper than everyone else. So why hasn't solar taken off? Because the typical solar array costs in excess of $20,000.

 

[markgm]

Living in CT, the state gives a $5/w/h rebate for solar installations up to 5kw/h ($25k). Even then up here it'll run you about 19k to get a system installed. As great as it would be to not pay an electric bill, it's hard to ignore that I'd make more money a month if I just invested the money. I can't wait until the technology gets a little better and comes down in price.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: markgm
Living in CT, the state gives a $5/w/h rebate for solar installations up to 5kw/h ($25k). Even then up here it'll run you about 19k to get a system installed. As great as it would be to not pay an electric bill, it's hard to ignore that I'd make more money a month if I just invested the money. I can't wait until the technology gets a little better and comes down in price.

That tax credit would given to those upgrading their hvac systems than installing solar systems. HVAC upgrades would be cheaper and provide more conservation results.

 

[ntdz]

That's pretty cool what they guy did though, it's too bad GM wouldn't just let him keep the car if he wanted it. Energy independence will be huge for this country, hopefully it comes sooner rather than later.

 

[glenn1]

Is solar to the point yet where it's net energy positive? Meaning, a cell produces more energy over the course of its life than it takes to manufacture? IIRC, that was one of the hurdles of solar early on and might still be for all I know....

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
A clear sign they didn't expect people to like and actually drive the vehicles and the Oil Cartel Operation has pressured them to take such drastic step in collecting the cars like a Repo and destroying them.

Dave:

You want to back the the bolded part of your statement, or is this just one of your liberal off-the-wall opinions.

I stand behind it. If there was no pressure we would not still be driving the same ICE cars.

 

[charrison]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
A clear sign they didn't expect people to like and actually drive the vehicles and the Oil Cartel Operation has pressured them to take such drastic step in collecting the cars like a Repo and destroying them.

Dave:

You want to back the the bolded part of your statement, or is this just one of your liberal off-the-wall opinions.

I stand behind it. If there was no pressure we would not still be driving the same ICE cars.

The reason we still have ICE is because gas it the cheapest fuel source around.

 

[judasmachine]

I think the energy companies may be the ones stalling the tax subsidies. I don't have any proof but we all know their lobby is quite a bit more resourceful than our friendly hippies.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
A clear sign they didn't expect people to like and actually drive the vehicles and the Oil Cartel Operation has pressured them to take such drastic step in collecting the cars like a Repo and destroying them.

Dave:

You want to back the the bolded part of your statement, or is this just one of your liberal off-the-wall opinions.

I stand behind it. If there was no pressure we would not still be driving the same ICE cars.

The reason we still have ICE is because gas it the cheapest fuel source around.

That's been proven to be false a few trillion times over too. Try again :roll:

 

[ntdz]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
A clear sign they didn't expect people to like and actually drive the vehicles and the Oil Cartel Operation has pressured them to take such drastic step in collecting the cars like a Repo and destroying them.

Dave:

You want to back the the bolded part of your statement, or is this just one of your liberal off-the-wall opinions.

I stand behind it. If there was no pressure we would not still be driving the same ICE cars.

The reason we still have ICE is because gas it the cheapest fuel source around.

That's been proven to be false a few trillion times over too. Try again :roll:

Are you crazy? A gallon of gas is cheaper than a gallon of bottled water!!! How is it not the cheapest?!?!

 

[Cerb]

For everyone who thought we just didn't have enough infrastructure for freeer, cleaner energy, take a look at this. A good example of saving money (well, possible to in the long run if you're off the grid), severely cutting the pollution he added to the world...and what happens?

 

[Cerb]

Originally posted by: ntdz
That's pretty cool what they guy did though, it's too bad GM wouldn't just let him keep the car if he wanted it. Energy independence will be huge for this country, hopefully it comes sooner rather than later.

It will only come when we pry it from the energy companies' cold, dead, stocks.

 

[ciba]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: EagleKeeper

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
A clear sign they didn't expect people to like and actually drive the vehicles and the Oil Cartel Operation has pressured them to take such drastic step in collecting the cars like a Repo and destroying them.

Dave:

You want to back the the bolded part of your statement, or is this just one of your liberal off-the-wall opinions.

I stand behind it. If there was no pressure we would not still be driving the same ICE cars.

The reason we still have ICE is because gas it the cheapest fuel source around.

That's been proven to be false a few trillion times over too. Try again :roll:

Do you ever back up your statements?

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: ciba

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
That's been proven to be false a few trillion times over too. Try again :roll:

Do you ever back up your statements?

Only when he actually can to prove his point. Rest seems to usually be hersay, supposition and FUD.

As he would say, he has learned well from the opposition.