Europeans 'Consider US as Threat'...

LeadMagnet

Platinum Member
Mar 26, 2003
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Article

ONLY THEY ADDED a couple of nations to join the ranks of the world?s greatest evildoers. Precisely the same number of Europeans said America was a threat to world peace, ranking the Bush administration alongside Kim Jong Il?s tyranny in Pyongyang and the hard-line theocracy of Tehran.
In fact, the United States was only beaten into joint second place by a country that has never sponsored terrorist attacks on European soil. A staggering 59 per cent of this huge poll?released this week?placed Israel at the top of the list of world threats. That was 22 points ahead of Syria, 23 points ahead of Libya and Saudi Arabia, and 43 points ahead of Somalia.
Shocking as they are, these numbers are not an excuse to beat up our favorite European stereotypes. There was a time when it was easy to dismiss the rest of the world as a bunch of spineless and spoiled children, hiding under America?s security umbrella while throwing hissy fits at the adults in Washington. (That was around the same time when it was easy to dump on anyone who cared about the rest of the world by branding them a weak-willed internationalist.)
That time is long gone. The European poll shows this dispute has gone far beyond name-calling. What started out as a little overheated rhetoric has grown into a full-blown crisis that threatens U.S. policy across the world. And we?re not just talking about Iraq.
In Latin America, the warning signs about U.S. policy are lit up across the continent. In Bolivia, the pro-American president Gonzalo Sanchez de Lozada was toppled after a month of street protests and violent clashes. One of his biggest political weaknesses: his support for U.S. policy on energy and drugs. In Colombia, the ardently pro-American president Alvaro Uribe took a beating in the polls last week, leading to the election of a former communist as mayor of the capital Bogota. And in Brazil, President Luis Inacio Lula da Silva effectively torpedoed U.S. trade policy by forcing the collapse of the world trade talks in Cancun two months ago. As in Europe, political leaders in Latin America are finding it costly to support Washington while the critics of the Bush administration are prospering.
So how can the White House turn this around?
It needs to start thinking of world politics in domestic terms, for a start. When faced with opposition in Congress, the Bush administration doesn?t talk about dreaming up new propaganda, as it does with the rest of the world. It goes to work on the individual politicians that support or oppose them.
In global terms, that means helping the leaders that are helping the United States?by spending more money to help farmers grow alternative crops, for instance. ?We need to make sure that the people doing the right thing are getting the money and the ability to deliver that we want them to have,? says a senior State Department official. ?We need to give them some other livelihood if we want to keep them out of coca.? Does that mean more money? Well, not any time soon. One other country is swallowing up $87 billion of U.S. cash, and there isn?t a whole lot left to go around correcting the problems faced by U.S. policy elsewhere in the world.
Which brings us back to our European friends and their thoughts on Iraq. As in America?s backyard, anti-Bush feeling has gone far beyond a knee-jerk reaction to U.S. policy. It now feeds into domestic politics and has grown into one of the biggest obstacles to what Washington wants to do next.
It lies behind the agonies of Tony Blair, the British prime minister, who is being punished for his support for Bush. And it constricts other governments that have been almost as supportive. For instance, Spain withdrew most of its diplomats from Baghdad this week citing security concerns. Why such sensitivity? It?s true that one Spanish intelligence official was killed in Iraq last month. But it?s also true that, according to the European poll, 79 per cent of Spanish people believe the war in Iraq was unjustified. Only France, Greece and Austria oppose the war in greater numbers.
The Bush administration runs the risk of a total collapse in political support in Europe. And like all political problems, it needs to think quickly and creatively if it wants European help to deal with a wide range of security and economic challenges around the world.
Take the problem of rebuilding Iraq. One of the biggest disappointments at the recent Madrid conference on Iraq was the meager sum offered by the European Union countries. The E.U. and its members gave pledges of around $800 million, while France and Germany offered nothing on their own. Small wonder when you consider that two thirds of Europeans believe the United States should pay for the rebuilding of Iraq.
Yet like all good domestic polls, the E.U. numbers offer a way out. The majority of Europeans?by a margin of 54 to 45 per cent?want to see their own countries donating cash to the new Iraq. That suggests there?s more room for lobbying at the United Nations, and more work to be done in European capitals. And it might just mean campaigning on different grounds. Instead of asking for money for reconstruction, call it humanitarian aid. A vast majority?82 per cent?of Europeans support an increase in such aid to Iraq.
This is not an argument for pandering to the Europeans. In fact, Europeans should be roundly condemned for allowing anti-American and anti-Israeli prejudice to take root. (Why on earth is the E.U. drawing up a poll that names the United States and Israel alongside Iraq and North Korea?)
Europe is not a lost cause, but it could become one if we allow transatlantic relations to continue to fall off a cliff. Washington still needs to work with its European allies to push its agenda forward?whether it?s raising cash for Iraq and pressuring Iran to give up its nukes. And that means doing a better job of explaining U.S. policy to them, and thinking creatively about other policies that our allies can support. It?s called diplomacy, and as the European poll shows, both sides of the Atlantic are failing miserably at it.


Article
 

privatebreyer

Member
Nov 28, 2002
195
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0
With the Cold War over, and the Clinton honeymoon over, this was inevitable. We get to start the 20th century over again.
 

glenn1

Lifer
Sep 6, 2000
25,383
1,013
126
Europe needs to grow the f*ck up and stop acting like a bratty toddler. When they grow some balls and an army they can come sit at the grownups table.

Hey Europe, we need friends at our side when you think we're wrong, not just when you think we're right. You're pissing away your shot at having a meaningful impact on U.S. policy if you continue this foolishness and outright bigotry. Israel ahead of North Korea? You need to pull your head out of your ass.
 

freegeeks

Diamond Member
May 7, 2001
5,460
1
81
Originally posted by: glenn1
Europe needs to grow the f*ck up and stop acting like a bratty toddler. When they grow some balls and an army they can come sit at the grownups table.

Hey Europe, we need friends at our side when you think we're wrong, not just when you think we're right. You're pissing away your shot at having a meaningful impact on U.S. policy if you continue this foolishness and outright bigotry. Israel ahead of North Korea? You need to pull your head out of your ass.

arrogant asshat

BLOW ME

 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
Originally posted by: glenn1
Europe needs to grow the f*ck up and stop acting like a bratty toddler. When they grow some balls and an army they can come sit at the grownups table.

Hey Europe, we need friends at our side when you think we're wrong, not just when you think we're right. You're pissing away your shot at having a meaningful impact on U.S. policy if you continue this foolishness and outright bigotry. Israel ahead of North Korea? You need to pull your head out of your ass.
the world does not revolve around the US, when you understand remove head from ass
 

VioletAura

Banned
Aug 28, 2003
302
0
0
Originally posted by: glenn1
Europe needs to grow the f*ck up and stop acting like a bratty toddler. When they grow some balls and an army they can come sit at the grownups table.

Hey Europe, we need friends at our side when you think we're wrong, not just when you think we're right. You're pissing away your shot at having a meaningful impact on U.S. policy if you continue this foolishness and outright bigotry. Israel ahead of North Korea? You need to pull your head out of your ass.

Pompous asses like this is why the US and Israel are at the top of that list.
You hate them so they hate you. Get a clue.
 

glenn1

Lifer
Sep 6, 2000
25,383
1,013
126
arrogant asshat

BLOW ME

I see my statements hit a bit close to home. Good.

the world does not revolve around the US, when you understand remove head from ass

Then why the high level of concern from your continental fellows?

Pompous asses like this is why the US and Israel are at the top of that list.
You hate them so they hate you. Get a clue.

I don't particularly give a sh!t about what Europe thinks, i simply think they're being childish twits. However, Europe seems to care a great deal about us.
 

CanOWorms

Lifer
Jul 3, 2001
12,404
2
0
Originally posted by: Czar
Originally posted by: glenn1
Europe needs to grow the f*ck up and stop acting like a bratty toddler. When they grow some balls and an army they can come sit at the grownups table.

Hey Europe, we need friends at our side when you think we're wrong, not just when you think we're right. You're pissing away your shot at having a meaningful impact on U.S. policy if you continue this foolishness and outright bigotry. Israel ahead of North Korea? You need to pull your head out of your ass.
the world does not revolve around the US, when you understand remove head from ass

I wouldn't say that the world revolves around the US, but the US is much more important than Europe. When Arnie winning the election in CA makes frontpage news in other countries, you know they revolve around the US :)

Europe has lost any military, economic, even cultural superiority in the world that they once thought they had. They try to think that they're morally superior now even though the thought of them thinking that they are morally superior is ridiculous.

Sure, Americans seem ignorant to Europeans... I think the average American is an isolationist even though the government isn't.
 

privatebreyer

Member
Nov 28, 2002
195
0
0
Actually, as long as Europe continues to day dream of the old imperial days, anyone else infringing on "there territory" is going to be seen as an enemy.

Untill they drop this holier then thou attitude of if we can't do neither can you, there never going to realize that were on the same side.

The Brits have figured this out. So have the Poles. I guess thats a start.
 

hagbard

Banned
Nov 30, 2000
2,775
0
0
The Europeans are correct, beyond a doubt. They're learning what most of the world already accepted as true years ago.
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0
this thread is just awful, flame from begining to the end
the forum should have a higher standard, but no one cares it seems
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,877
6,415
126
Has N Korea or Iran invaded anyone recently? Who vowed to keep fighting while their main opposition unilateraly declared a ceasefire?

 

ReiAyanami

Diamond Member
Sep 24, 2002
4,466
0
0
let a german tanks roll thru paris and poland for the 3rd time in a century before they come crying back to our fatty fat doughboys for protection

Has N Korea or Iran invaded anyone recently?

no, but they don't need to anymore, they have nukes. once they get ICBM technology, they can reach out and touch someone....
 

VioletAura

Banned
Aug 28, 2003
302
0
0
Originally posted by: ReiAyanami
let a german tanks roll thru paris and poland for the 3rd time in a century before they come crying back to our fatty fat doughboys for protection

Has N Korea or Iran invaded anyone recently?

no, but they don't need to anymore, they have nukes. once they get ICBM technology, they can reach out and touch someone....

3rd time? Did I miss something?
German tanks only rolled into Paris once during WW2, the Germans didn't have tanks during WW1 and didn't even reach Paris.

I doubt that N Korea and Iran would aim their weapons at Europe, since it is bush that is threatening them and they know if they vaporize the trailer parks in the US, bush will be voted out of power.
 

JoeBaD

Banned
May 24, 2000
822
0
0
LIBERAL MORONS !!!

yes, caps on for emphasis.

The day your momma stops wiping your arse come back and comment.

 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
17,515
0
0
Europe is pissed about being second or third in world afairs, both political and economical. No one really cares what they do or say anymore, they are no longer the focus of world events and they are pissed. Why do you think they are making a huge stink about something that doesn't involve them at all? And why do you think the EU came into being? Yeah, I know a lot of Europeans will get pissed, but if you urge us Americans to think about ourselves and how we really are, I urge you to do the same.
 

wirelessenabled

Platinum Member
Feb 5, 2001
2,192
44
91
Originally posted by: privatebreyer
Actually, as long as Europe continues to day dream of the old imperial days, anyone else infringing on "there territory" is going to be seen as an enemy.

Untill they drop this holier then thou attitude of if we can't do neither can you, there never going to realize that were on the same side.

The Brits have figured this out. So have the Poles. I guess thats a start.


Wait until Europe/Japan decides that the Euro is a better store of value than the US dollar. How is the US going to refinance the $6.8 trillion debt without help from overseas? Going up at better than $400 billion/yr thanks to the tax cuts.

The world doesn't revolve only on military expenditures.
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: wirelessenabled
Originally posted by: privatebreyer
Actually, as long as Europe continues to day dream of the old imperial days, anyone else infringing on "there territory" is going to be seen as an enemy.

Untill they drop this holier then thou attitude of if we can't do neither can you, there never going to realize that were on the same side.

The Brits have figured this out. So have the Poles. I guess thats a start.


Wait until Europe/Japan decides that the Euro is a better store of value than the US dollar. How is the US going to refinance the $6.8 trillion debt without help from overseas? Going up at better than $400 billion/yr thanks to the tax cuts.

The world doesn't revolve only on military expenditures.


As long as the US continues to have to world largest economy with greatest chance of getting high returns, the US will not have a problem finding investors.
 

tennisflip

Golden Member
Sep 25, 2003
1,845
0
0
Sorry, I couldn't resist...

Yeah, uh! Get up, now! Ow! Knock out this!

Super highways, coast to coast,
easy to get anywhere
On the transcontinental overload,
just slide behind the wheel
How does it feel

When there's no destination - that's too far
And somewhere on the way,
you might find out who you are

Chorus:
Living in America - eye to eye, station to station
Living in America - hand to hand, across the nation
Living in America - got to have a celebration

Rock my soul

Smokestack, fatback,
many miles of railroad track
All night radio, keep on runnin'
through your rock 'n' roll soul
All night diners keep you awake,
hey, on black coffee and a hard roll

You might have to walk the fine line,
you might take the hard line
But everybody's working overtime

(chorus)

I live in America, help me out,
but I live in America,
wait a minute

You might not be looking for the promised land,
but you might find it anyway
Under one of those old familiar names
Like New Orleans (New Orleans),
Detroit City (Detroit City), Dallas (Dallas)
Pittsburg P.A. (Pittsburg P.A.),
New York City (New York City)
Kansas City (Kansas City),
Atlanta (Atlanta), Chicago and L.A.

Living in America - hit me
Living in America - yeah,
I walk in and out
Living in America

I live in America - state lines,
gonna make the prime, that
I live in America - hey,
I know what it means, I

Living in America - Eddie Murphy, eat your heart out
Living in America - hit me, I said now, eye to eye,
station to station
Living in America - so nice, with your bare self
Living in America - I feel good!
 

dirtcheapII

Member
Jul 4, 2003
39
0
0
Originally posted by: sMiLeYz
You know that Iraqi war made us pretty popular, I dare say.
Yes you are 100% right @sshole
Iraqi war only made USA popular for beating a defenless country only. but dare to attack any die hard country or country that able to defend themself



 

LilBlinbBlahIce

Golden Member
Dec 31, 2001
1,837
0
0
Originally posted by: VioletAura
Originally posted by: ReiAyanami
let a german tanks roll thru paris and poland for the 3rd time in a century before they come crying back to our fatty fat doughboys for protection

Has N Korea or Iran invaded anyone recently?

no, but they don't need to anymore, they have nukes. once they get ICBM technology, they can reach out and touch someone....

3rd time? Did I miss something?
German tanks only rolled into Paris once during WW2, the Germans didn't have tanks during WW1 and didn't even reach Paris.

I doubt that N Korea and Iran would aim their weapons at Europe, since it is bush that is threatening them and they know if they vaporize the trailer parks in the US, bush will be voted out of power.

Rei has no concept of history. If my memory serves me correctly, I think he's the one who still thinks the League of Nations still exists. And then we wonder why the world thinks we are ignorant.