Europe fighting back

[agent00f]

The proper response is to hold EVERYONE to the same standard and rules when it comes to free speech, women's rights, gay rights, separation of religion from state, and all the other liberal policies the west is known for,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6hZLZpfuyQ

you don't cover up, apologize for, and excuse primitive backwards behaviors of one religion while openly criticizing those similar beliefs of other similar religions because of some political correct feel good bullshit which actually emboldens the right wing parties instead of negating them.

The way some of our supposed liberals on these forums defend and apologize for the actions and beliefs of the religious right of the middle east makes them no different than the Trumpettes defending and apologizing for their dear leader's gaffes and blunders that even a child can see through.

liberals: we shouldn't be bigoted toward brown people

1prophet: liberals defend and apologize for them browns

LOL

 

[FelixDeCat]

no

 

[MajinCry]

What is your obsession with the color of people's skin? If you are trying to make a point you need to state it directly, not make up pretend statements based on your assumptions.

Anybody can do what you are doing. Assume what people are saying, repeat people's skin color in every assumption and make up pretend statements based on your assumptions.

There's this thing called "political correctness". Racists can't just call black people awesome people anymore, at least not without some outcry from the morally inclined, so instead use soft language and allusions.

If you think people cannot discern your genuine opinions from errant drivel, you ought to get a bit of work done on the ol' noggin.

 

[agent00f]

What is your obsession with the color of people's skin? If you are trying to make a point you need to state it directly, not make up pretend statements based on your assumptions.

Anybody can do what you are doing. Assume what people are saying, repeat people's skin color in every assumption and make up pretend statements based on your assumptions.

Must be a coincidence that the right wing platform is inevitably based on riling up white nationalism over some lower status browns. Hell, the nazis had to make jews darker skinned in their propaganda.

What would you say is worse: doing that out of "principled" hate or just to get some votes?

 

[UglyCasanova]

Still waiting for xenophobic Japan to rev up those gas chambers. Should happen any day now, it's the only logical conclusion of isolationism.

Japan is literally Hitler. Literally

 

[agent00f]

Japan is literally Hitler. Literally

Japan was aligned with the Nazis and had their share of subjugating the less "races". At least half of us learn of this in grade school, but for conservatives that'll probably never happen.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Japan was aligned with the Nazis and had their share of subjugating the less "races". At least half of us learn of this in grade school, but for conservatives that'll probably never happen.

Compared to Russia, the UK, and America, all of which were 100% free of racial discrimination. Everyone knows this.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Some examples?

Defending the hijab is the first thing that comes to mind. The entire idea of the hijab/veil is the antithesis of progressive feminist ideals yet many on here readily abandon those as they rush to defend any and all things Islam. If Christian men were demanding women wear something to cover their faces there'd rightly be outrage, not nuts arguments that the women want to wear them etc.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Defending the hijab is the first thing that comes to mind. The entire idea of the hijab/veil is the antithesis of progressive feminist ideals yet many on here readily abandon those as they rush to defend any and all things Islam. If Christian men were demanding women wear something to cover their faces there'd rightly be outrage, not nuts arguments that the women want to wear them etc.

Forced *anything* is wrong. When a woman chooses it for themself, what's the issue?

 

[UglyCasanova]

Forced *anything* is wrong. When a woman chooses it for themself, what's the issue?

You have power discrepancies between men and women, and this is a global problem but particularly accute in the conservative/religious culture of Islam. Given that I'd question just how much choice the woman truly has, even if on the surface it appears she's for it. Fear of retaliation both there and then again behind closed doors, cultural pressure, embarrassment from standing out, fear of shaming ones family, etc.

Same underlying reason in the case of a male boss and female employee (which becomes more the case the greater the distance between the two positions) having sex and why it can be considered rape in many cases, when such a power distance exists it's hard for the woman to say no. A yes isn't always a yes, and the perception of choice doesn't mean one actually exists. The cute picture of a fencer doesn't change this.

 

[justoh]

Regressive leftist: " don't judge islam based on the actions of terrorists, bigots. Judge islam based on Khan, my nominally muslim orthodontist in Toronto. Definitely don't base any criticism of Islam on islam, racists!"

It's why they'll lose again in 2020. As we well know, conservatism is the new counter-culture.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Regressive leftist: " don't judge islam based on the actions of terrorists, bigots. Judge islam based on Khan, my nominally muslim orthodontist in Toronto. Definitely don't base any criticism of Islam on islam, racists!"

It's why they'll lose again in 2020. As we well know, conservatism is the new counter-culture.

Don't drown yourself in all that straw bunky.

 

[FelixDeCat]

Regressive leftist: " don't judge islam based on the actions of terrorists, bigots. Judge islam based on Khan, my nominally muslim orthodontist in Toronto. Definitely don't base any criticism of Islam on islam, racists!"

It's why they'll lose again in 2020. As we well know, conservatism is the new counter-culture.

There is good and bad to everything and everyone.

 

[DarthKyrie]

You have power discrepancies between men and women, and this is a global problem but particularly accute in the conservative/religious culture of Islam. Given that I'd question just how much choice the woman truly has, even if on the surface it appears she's for it. Fear of retaliation both there and then again behind closed doors, cultural pressure, embarrassment from standing out, fear of shaming ones family, etc.

Same underlying reason in the case of a male boss and female employee (which becomes more the case the greater the distance between the two positions) having sex and why it can be considered rape in many cases, when such a power distance exists it's hard for the woman to say no. A yes isn't always a yes, and the perception of choice doesn't mean one actually exists. The cute picture of a fencer doesn't change this.

Do you also have issues with Catholic women that choose to wear a habit or Jewish women who choose to wear a headscarf? I bet you hate seeing pictures of Jewish women in Israel wearing the exact same thing as the woman in the picture. All 3 of the Abrahamic religions have modesty rules that the people follow, as well as the fact that the Middle East is hot as hell and wearing a head scarf helps keep your head cool, which is why the men also wear them. Do you have issues with anyone that chooses to have their head covered with a hat as well?

Edited for grammar issues.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Do you also have issues with Catholic women that choose to wear a habit or Jewish women who choose to wear a headscarf? I bet you hate seeing pictures of Jewish women in Israel wearing the exact same thing as the woman in the picture. All 3 of the Abrahamic religions have modesty rules that the people follow, as well as the fact that the Middle East is hot as hell and wearing a head scarf helps keep your head cool, which is why the men also wear them. Do you have issues with anyone that chooses to have their head covered with a hat as well?

Edited for grammar issues.

This seems to be the immediate defense that goes up when talking about Islam, instead of admitting there's a problem an equivalence with Christianity is attempted to be made for some reason.

My position wouldn't change no matter the religion, if a woman is compelled to cover her face there's something wrong with that situation. It doesn't matter if they're Jews, Christians, Muslims, or aethiest. A woman should never feel she has to do anything a man wouldn't.

Feeling compelled to cover ones face strips away their dignity and humanity, and as I mentioned before is the exact opposite what a progressive feminist would normally be a proponent of. It's Islam though so for some reason it gets a slide.

 

[DarthKyrie]

This seems to be the immediate defense that goes up when talking about Islam, instead of admitting there's a problem an equivalence with Christianity is attempted to be made for some reason.

My position wouldn't change no matter the religion, if a woman is compelled to cover her face there's something wrong with that situation. It doesn't matter if they're Jews, Christians, Muslims, or aethiest. A woman should never feel she has to do anything a man wouldn't.

Feeling compelled to cover ones face strips away their dignity and humanity, and as I mentioned before is the exact opposite what a progressive feminist would normally be a proponent of. It's Islam though so for some reason it gets a slide.

Where did I say anything about veils? My entire comment was about head coverings and nothing else. Seeing as you hate that people are compelled to cover their face I am sure you hate seeing a motorcyclist wearing a helmet that has a face shield, or a skier wearing a neoprene mask or helmet with a tinted face shield, or an umpire and a catcher wearing masks during a baseball game because they are all compelled to wear those things because of rules.

 

[UglyCasanova]

Where did I say anything about veils? My entire comment was about head coverings and nothing else. Seeing as you hate that people are compelled to cover their face I am sure you hate seeing a motorcyclist wearing a helmet that has a face shield, or a skier wearing a neoprene mask or helmet with a tinted face shield, or an umpire and a catcher wearing masks during a baseball game because they are all compelled to wear those things because of rules.

A veil is a head covering, and yeah it's just like motorcycle helmets. I can tell you've got a firm grasp of the topic..

 

[DarthKyrie]

A veil is a head covering, and yeah it's just like motorcycle helmets. I can tell you've got a firm grasp of the topic..

I was using those as examples of other head coverings that the people who choose to do those things are compelled to wear. You're right I have no grasp of the topic because I don't hate Muslims only because they do something the other 2 religions that go together with it advise their people to do. All 3 religions tell their followers to kill the people who refuse to convert unless you're going to deny that the Inquisition was about the same thing as the Islamic Jihad. I hate all religions and think their followers are delusional, but as a follower of the US Constitution, I refuse to discriminate based on a person's delusional choice to follow religion.

 

[mikeymikec]

nvm

 

[justoh]

That's right. They choose to wear the hijab. It's merely a coincidence that they've also been commanded to for hundreds of years by men.

 

[agent00f]

Compared to Russia, the UK, and America, all of which were 100% free of racial discrimination. Everyone knows this.

Some people like to relive the past more than others. There's a word for this called conservatism.

 

[WelshBloke]

A woman should never feel she has to do anything a man wouldn't.

Apart from decide what she wants to wear if what she wants to wear isnt what you want her to wear?

Do you actually know any women in the West that wear a head covering and have you talked to them about it?

 

[agent00f]

This seems to be the immediate defense that goes up when talking about Islam, instead of admitting there's a problem an equivalence with Christianity is attempted to be made for some reason.

My position wouldn't change no matter the religion, if a woman is compelled to cover her face there's something wrong with that situation. It doesn't matter if they're Jews, Christians, Muslims, or aethiest. A woman should never feel she has to do anything a man wouldn't.

Feeling compelled to cover ones face strips away their dignity and humanity, and as I mentioned before is the exact opposite what a progressive feminist would normally be a proponent of. It's Islam though so for some reason it gets a slide.

Let's not pretend conservatives aren't too busy castigating whichever lower status browns to actually care about them. "Those women are so terrible to wear a headscarf, let's pay off the good ol boys to test if sand glows in the dark" --american GOP literally.

Regressive leftist: " don't judge islam based on the actions of terrorists, bigots. Judge islam based on Khan, my nominally muslim orthodontist in Toronto. Definitely don't base any criticism of Islam on islam, racists!"

It's why they'll lose again in 2020. As we well know, conservatism is the new counter-culture.

Or boasting about the dark ages like this guy, same as all his conservative muslim counterparts.

 

[snarfbot]

nothing compares to the righteous thrill one gets when asserting another to be a bigot.

let us all now bow before the altar of political correctness and reflect on our pious pieties.

 

[desura]

The veil thing...eh...doesn't actually bother me that much. I mean, yeah, there is social pressure to wear it, but there is also social pressure the opposite direction for women to wear immodest clothing in Western societies.

On an aesthetic level, women's hair is a big natural aspect of beauty and so Islam covering women really is not appealing or free or whatever. It isn't really attractive or interesting like an Indian Sari or the Polynesian bikini. But the Islamic veil definitely robs women of personality.

The full body coverings are fairly disgusting because I imagine them to be very uncomfortable to wear on a daily basis and the men don't have to do anything remotely similar. They are simply a security risk and should be banned.

Bigger issue is that the veil is effectively like the Army head covering. Politically it signals a competing allegiance, and competing allegiance and loyalties is what drives murderous terrorism.