EPA Strikes Back! - Regulates How You Can Paint Your House

[Jhhnn]

Prior to 1960, almost all paint had lead as part of the pigmentation. The biggest health hazard is from toddlers chewing on flaking paint or anything painted with lead based paint. The next biggest health hazard is for renovators who remove the stuff for a living, day in, day out, for years. It's the same as with asbestos workers.

Guys who scrape paint for a living aren't necessarily well educated or informed, so the new regs protect them more than anything else. I can't imagine that the price of renovations will skyrocket, at all, just because of the requirement for simple particle respirators and plastic on the floor...

This only applies in 11 states, anyway, those not having their own programs...

 

[Danube]

The lead scare is bureaucratic hype meant to justify their existence and take on new powers. The serum levels of lead particles allowed have been lowered and lowered over the years so that now a person with just a few trace particles over normal is considered "poisoned". The limit is 10 µg/dL when the average person can test 6 or 7 easy. People working with lead in 90's were considered safe if the had levels of 25 µg/dL. In the 80's it was 40 µg/dL.

The gov already caused one fiasco over lead in toys and even ended up affecting snow mobile parts that had trace elements of lead in them. They killed many jobs swatting a fly with a sledge hammer.

The crap cereal kids eat every day does much more damage than trace levels of lead.

 

[Turin39789]

The lead scare is bureaucratic hype meant to justify their existence and take on new powers. The serum levels of lead particles allowed have been lowered and lowered over the years so that now a person with just a few trace particles over normal is considered "poisoned". The limit is 10 µg/dL when the average person can test 6 or 7 easy. People working with lead in 90's were considered safe if the had levels of 25 µg/dL. In the 80's it was 40 µg/dL.

The gov already caused one fiasco over lead in toys and even ended up affecting snow mobile parts that had trace elements of lead in them. They killed many jobs swatting a fly with a sledge hammer.

The crap cereal kids eat every day does much more damage than trace levels of lead.

fail

 

[ShawnD1]

The crap cereal kids eat every day does much more damage than trace levels of lead.

I can drink alcohol to the point of almost dying and be perfectly healthy a few days later. I can't do the same thing with lead. Heavy metals are cumulative and there's no way to purge them from our bodies (yet), so we try to eliminate them completely.

Metals are often hardcore bad because they form fat-soluble compounds when combined with something organic. A metal like lead is very insoluble in water, so it can't be removed the way alcohol or caffeine are removed from the body. Fat-soluble heavy metal compounds like to stay in your fat for very long periods of time, so this means the rate of heavy metal leaving your body is incredibly slow. Your brain happens to be made of fat, so those fat-soluble heavy metals often end up in your brain and completely screw everything up. If it's stored outside of your brain and you start burning fat for energy due to exercise, that heavy metal might move around in your body and get stuck in your brain, so you can still get brain damage long after exposure even though you haven't been exposed to any new heavy metals.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Sheesh!!! Yet another piece of disingenuous bullshit from Patyouranus.

You realize that the problem is that the paint to cover 20 square feet contains toxic components, and the act of manufacturing the paint it takes to cover your 20 square feet, in as many colors as they make, by as many manufacturers as care to engage in the business of making all those colors of all that paint, amounts to a metric shitload of toxic laden paint.

You realize that all of those manufacturers, manufacturing all of that paint, releas those toxins into the environement, and all of their customers, painting all of their 20 square feet of surface area release yet more of those toxins into the environment.

Of course, you probably don't give a hairy rat's ass that all of those toxins only cause cancer, birth defects, and other horrible diseases, as well as doing physical, neurological and intellectual damaging to children.

Why do you hate children? Why do you hate Americans who only want to maintain and improve their homes and property? :\

Why do you hate the truth?

How much lead paint did you eat as a child that makes you believe Obama isn't a TRAITOR? :thumbsdown: :thumbsdown:

 

[Lemon law]

Be its resolved, Petranus, as OP on this thread, is very probably suffering from acute lead paint poisoning, and thus has an unresolved grievance against the GWB EPA.

But that is the other symptom of lead paint poisoning, namely mental retardation, which some what excuses Petranus's 2 year delayed response and subsequent total confusion regarding the author of his miseries.

 

[Harvey]

How much lead paint did you eat as a child that makes you believe Obama isn't a TRAITOR? :thumbsdown: :thumbsdown:

You're accusing Obama of the serious crime of treason. Prove that Obama is a traitor, or YOU are committing the crime of libel. Please provide links to credible sources providing a legal definition of the crime, and please specify any acts Obama has committed or any statements he has made and how those acts and/or statements conform to a legal definition of the crime.

If you can't, in addition to being off topic, you're a lying, malicious POS. :thumbsdown:

---

ObamaBigAssMistakeAmerika

Fulminating Egotistical Anal Retentive Nutjob Obviously Entirely Void In Logic

 

[Danube]

I can drink alcohol to the point of almost dying and be perfectly healthy a few days later. I can't do the same thing with lead. Heavy metals are cumulative and there's no way to purge them from our bodies (yet), so we try to eliminate them completely.

Metals are often hardcore bad because they form fat-soluble compounds when combined with something organic. A metal like lead is very insoluble in water, so it can't be removed the way alcohol or caffeine are removed from the body. Fat-soluble heavy metal compounds like to stay in your fat for very long periods of time, so this means the rate of heavy metal leaving your body is incredibly slow. Your brain happens to be made of fat, so those fat-soluble heavy metals often end up in your brain and completely screw everything up. If it's stored outside of your brain and you start burning fat for energy due to exercise, that heavy metal might move around in your body and get stuck in your brain, so you can still get brain damage long after exposure even though you haven't been exposed to any new heavy metals.

I understand lead can be toxic but actual cases of serious lead poisoning are extremely rare. The vast majority of paint jobs are not a health risk at all even when some lead is present. If people were grinding the paint off a 100 year old house (a third of the residue can be lead) and had a small child in the house there is reason to take precautions. Even then the child will no doubt survive just fine.

Meanwhile sugar/carb consumption has many more kids becoming diabetic (while young or as adults) than kids who are becoming lead poisoned. Bureaucrats and trial lawyers made lead a cottage industry just like they did with asbestos (it could be dangerous to people who worked with it a lot but it's been exaggerated with regard to risk of general public)

 

[Fear No Evil]

You're accusing Obama of the serious crime of treason. Prove that Obama is a traitor, or YOU are committing the crime of libel. Please provide links to credible sources providing a legal definition of the crime, and please specify any acts Obama has committed or any statements he has made and how those acts and/or statements conform to a legal definition of the crime.

If you can't, in addition to being off topic, you're a lying, malicious POS. :thumbsdown:

---


Fulminating Egotistical Anal Retentive Nutjob Obviously Entirely Void In Logic

I've already given you proof. His refusal to persue charges against GWB. Its absolutely pathetic you continue to support this traitor-in-chief.

 

[BoberFett]

Sheesh!!! Yet another piece of disingenuous bullshit from Patyouranus.

You realize that the problem is that the paint to cover 20 square feet contains toxic components, and the act of manufacturing the paint it takes to cover your 20 square feet, in as many colors as they make, by as many manufacturers as care to engage in the business of making all those colors of all that paint, amounts to a metric shitload of toxic laden paint.

You realize that all of those manufacturers, manufacturing all of that paint, releas those toxins into the environement, and all of their customers, painting all of their 20 square feet of surface area release yet more of those toxins into the environment.

Of course, you probably don't give a hairy rat's ass that all of those toxins only cause cancer, birth defects, and other horrible diseases, as well as doing physical, neurological and intellectual damaging to children.

Why do you hate children? Why do you hate Americans who only want to maintain and improve their homes and property? :\

Why do you hate the truth?

Oh look, Harvey says something stupid again. Surprise, surprise.

This isn't about painting 20 sqft of something. This is about projects which "disturb" painted areas. Which is almost any kind of construction, and when applied to all older houses means that the people who live in them, typically lower middle class people who are already having a tough time making ends meet, need to do anything to their home they will get to spend a hell of a lot more money to have it done because following these guidelines will increase remodeling prices significantly.

So why do you hate middle Americans and want them to live in trashy houses that they can't afford to fix up?

You're a waste of space.

 

[halik]

The lead scare is bureaucratic hype meant to justify their existence and take on new powers. The serum levels of lead particles allowed have been lowered and lowered over the years so that now a person with just a few trace particles over normal is considered "poisoned". The limit is 10 µg/dL when the average person can test 6 or 7 easy. People working with lead in 90's were considered safe if the had levels of 25 µg/dL. In the 80's it was 40 µg/dL.

The gov already caused one fiasco over lead in toys and even ended up affecting snow mobile parts that had trace elements of lead in them. They killed many jobs swatting a fly with a sledge hammer.

The crap cereal kids eat every day does much more damage than trace levels of lead.

During grad school I was briefly part of a study that was looking into the same issue for NHTSA. Apparently this is a common thing in gov't agencies - in order to get promoted and gain influence, you need more regulation and more staff.

 

[ShawnD1]

I understand lead can be toxic but actual cases of serious lead poisoning are extremely rare. The vast majority of paint jobs are not a health risk at all even when some lead is present.

The difference is that jobs involving paint often involve masks as well. My friend does color matching for a paint company and he's required to wear a mask all day while doing it. I don't think I've seen house painters wear a mask when using roll on paint, but I know I've seen people wear masks when spraying paint with a paint gun. You probably won't get sick from just touching paint (I'm not sure) but I think the government is under the assumption that people will eat the paint. This sort of goes back to the joke about people eating paint as a kid and that's why they act like they have brain damage. House painters don't eat paint, so they can be exposed, but kids actually do eat random things like dirt, paint, bugs, antifreeze, etc.

The biggest problem with heavy metals is that you don't know there's a problem until it's too late. You won't even know that your kid was eating it until they start acting really messed up. By that point, there's absolutely nothing you can do. The damage has already been done and it cannot be undone. This would be in contrast to a poison like Vodka where you know you're drunk long before any serious brain damage happens.

 

[piasabird]

This just makes it easier to ignore the lead and paint over the top of it. This means instead of cleaning up older houses, the problem is chaeper to cover up. This actually prolongs the problem and makes older houses more dangerous. In reality all contractors need to know how to deal with things like asbestos and lead. Typically a contractor may not take a job if they find either one of these items in a house.

It still does not mean all older houses have lead paint. However, many old bridges have lead paint.

I find it interesting to watch the house hunter shows when they go to some country like spain or elsewhere and you see all these houses that are around 100-300 years old. I wonder if some countries just ignore these problems.

 

[kage69]

If only we had the Bush-era EPA still around... life is so much easier when the foxes are watching the hen house.


Wish I knew why the corporatist right has a problem with lead contamination, when they seemed to not give 2 shits about arsenic, atrazine, and perchlorate.

 

[Greenman]

Sheesh!!! Yet another piece of disingenuous bullshit from Patyouranus.

You realize that the problem is that the paint to cover 20 square feet contains toxic components, and the act of manufacturing the paint it takes to cover your 20 square feet, in as many colors as they make, by as many manufacturers as care to engage in the business of making all those colors of all that paint, amounts to a metric shitload of toxic laden paint.

You realize that all of those manufacturers, manufacturing all of that paint, releas those toxins into the environement, and all of their customers, painting all of their 20 square feet of surface area release yet more of those toxins into the environment.

Of course, you probably don't give a hairy rat's ass that all of those toxins only cause cancer, birth defects, and other horrible diseases, as well as doing physical, neurological and intellectual damaging to children.

Why do you hate children? Why do you hate Americans who only want to maintain and improve their homes and property? :\

Why do you hate the truth?

Crazy idea, try reading the post before over reacting to it. This has nothing to do with painting.

While I agree lead is a bad thing, and education on how to handle it is a good thing, having to pay $550 to the EPA for my piece of paper that proves I know about lead shows the rule for what it really is, a profit center.

 

[Zstream]

This just makes it easier to ignore the lead and paint over the top of it. This means instead of cleaning up older houses, the problem is chaeper to cover up. This actually prolongs the problem and makes older houses more dangerous. In reality all contractors need to know how to deal with things like asbestos and lead. Typically a contractor may not take a job if they find either one of these items in a house.

It still does not mean all older houses have lead paint. However, many old bridges have lead paint.

I find it interesting to watch the house hunter shows when they go to some country like spain or elsewhere and you see all these houses that are around 100-300 years old. I wonder if some countries just ignore these problems.

Yep, we have a 120 year old house and just cover most of the it up. They're plenty of worse things to worry about. To whomever stated it does not drive up cost lacks the understanding of an economy.

Now, lead is bad and issues like this should be handled carefully. I disagree with Federal Government control, it should be state regulated.