Engineering samples?

[slightlyhuman]

Wanting a quad core for my laptop. The engineering samples are about $80 cheaper than a regular CPU.

Anything to be cautious about?

 

[chimaxi83]

Probably just that it's illegal to sell them... but that's about it.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Stolen property cheaper than legit items? You don't say...

 

[Gillbot]

Not to mention there can be uncorrected errata in an ES cpu as well. They go through the ES process, those are like "beta" and as bugs are found and updated, they go through stepping changes.

 

[Magic Carpet]

It's a hit or miss, really. The ES chips I used, have been fine

Worst case scenario, you pay return shipping.

 

[Ferzerp]

You will also have 0 warranty and are knowingly buying stolen goods (no one with legal access to these has the authorization to resell them), so..... There is that as well.

 

[Gillbot]

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2065033

 

[RavenSEAL]

Do it at your own risk, and as everyone already said, remember its illegal

 

[soccerballtux]

they only go after the sellers

 

[Bman123]

Good luck with that, most ES chips get beat to shit by reviewers overclocking the hell out of them with high volts to see what they can top off at. I personally would rather spend the extra $80 and get a new cpu with a warranty

 

[taltamir]

Intel Engineering samples belong to intel which either uses them internally or lends (not gift) them to companies for development. They are potentially buggy early designs and by company policy are all destroyed when the design is finalized.

Sometimes intel employees or those intel lends the samples to (lend, not gift) steal them and sell them online. The idiot thieves label them engineering samples which is outright admitting they are stolen. Were they more intelligent they would have lied and claimed they are new (although the buyer would be able to see the ES designation and know better and report them to the police).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Possession_of_stolen_goods

In the United States, Receipt of stolen property is a federal crime under 18 U.S.C. § 2315, defined as knowingly receiving, concealing, or disposing of stolen property with a value of at least $5,000 that also constitutes interstate commerce (i.e., has been transported across state lines).

Although... I wonder if someone could use the defense that they didn't steal them from their employer, but collected them out of a trashbin, where the employee did not properly dispose of them and throw them in the trash.

 

[Kalessian]

How can Intel prove it was stolen? How do we know for sure? We just take intel's word? How do we know intel isn't selling them on the side in some foreign country to make cash and then suing people to recover them and then doing it again? How do we know that Intel didn't just forget to pay a tax in Cambodia so the gov't there repossessed some shipments and sold them off instead of bother going after a company that makes way more money than their entire gdp. Can I write "my permanent property: illegal to sell under any circumstances" on my house and not bother to pay my mortgage? The bank can't foreclose, it's permanently mine, I told everyone in town, too. Everyone is so quick to take intel's word for this when we know companies lie any chance they get and the rules aren't even the same in every country so no one has to play fair. Are ES still illegal if intel goes under? note - i have no interest in ES, and i have had lots of my stuff stolen and no doubt resold on ebay or pawn shops (house and cars broken into, gee the law really helped me in those cases, the police basically laughed at me and so did the pawn shops), just posing a question to those who seem to think these companies are saintly or something. call my overly cynical and jealous that a company can FOREVER "own" a piece of the world no matter what anyone thinks

 

[chimaxi83]

How can Intel prove it was stolen? How do we know for sure? We just take intel's word? How do we know intel isn't selling them on the side in some foreign country to make cash and then suing people to recover them and then doing it again? How do we know that Intel didn't just forget to pay a tax in Cambodia so the gov't there repossessed some shipments and sold them off instead of bother going after a company that makes way more money than their entire gdp. Can I write "my permanent property: illegal to sell under any circumstances" on my house and not bother to pay my mortgage? The bank can't foreclose, it's permanently mine, I told everyone in town, too. Everyone is so quick to take intel's word for this when we know companies lie any chance they get and the rules aren't even the same in every country so no one has to play fair. Are ES still illegal if intel goes under? note - i have no interest in ES, and i have had lots of my stuff stolen and no doubt resold on ebay or pawn shops (house and cars broken into, gee the law really helped me in those cases, the police basically laughed at me and so did the pawn shops), just posing a question to those who seem to think these companies are saintly or something. call my overly cynical and jealous that a company can FOREVER "own" a piece of the world no matter what anyone thinks

Serious?

I'm pretty sure a company that moves product with the volume that Intel does, doesn't need to sell testing chips on the side to make (what is comparably) a few bucks.

 

[Puppies04]

How can Intel prove it was stolen? How do we know for sure? We just take intel's word? How do we know intel isn't selling them on the side in some foreign country to make cash and then suing people to recover them and then doing it again? How do we know that Intel didn't just forget to pay a tax in Cambodia so the gov't there repossessed some shipments and sold them off instead of bother going after a company that makes way more money than their entire gdp. Can I write "my permanent property: illegal to sell under any circumstances" on my house and not bother to pay my mortgage? The bank can't foreclose, it's permanently mine, I told everyone in town, too. Everyone is so quick to take intel's word for this when we know companies lie any chance they get and the rules aren't even the same in every country so no one has to play fair. Are ES still illegal if intel goes under? note - i have no interest in ES, and i have had lots of my stuff stolen and no doubt resold on ebay or pawn shops (house and cars broken into, gee the law really helped me in those cases, the police basically laughed at me and so did the pawn shops), just posing a question to those who seem to think these companies are saintly or something. call my overly cynical and jealous that a company can FOREVER "own" a piece of the world no matter what anyone thinks

I'm pretty sure intel can track every single chip it makes, right down to the last one. On that basis they could easily prove in a court room exactly where each ES sample went and that they were not "sold on the side" as you put it. Doesn't really matter to be honest, even if they were in the wrong with the amount of $ they have laying around they could bring a legal team to the table that could squash you like a bug .

On a side not, isn't it about time intel start asking for these ES chips back once a product hits the market. Seems to me it would be quite easy for them to do this and it would immediatly show who is stealing and selling them (or at least which company they work for).

 

[Rvenger]

I'm pretty sure intel can track every single chip it makes, right down to the last one. On that basis they could easily prove in a court room exactly where each ES sample went and that they were not "sold on the side" as you put it. Doesn't really matter to be honest, even if they were in the wrong with the amount of $ they have laying around they could bring a legal team to the table that could squash you like a bug .

On a side not, isn't it about time intel start asking for these ES chips back once a product hits the market. Seems to me it would be quite easy for them to do this and it would immediatly show who is stealing and selling them (or at least which company they work for).

Since recently they have been busting employees selling them, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if that happened.

 

[taltamir]

How can Intel prove it was stolen?

It has a serial number, and the model number says ES which are all NOT FOR SALE and must be stolen.

How do we know intel isn't selling them on the side in some foreign country to make cash and then suing people to recover them and then doing it again?

Intel does not report them stolen, intel believed them recycled because that is what the employees who steal them are supposed to do with them. (unless they are stupid enough to leave tracks, in which case intel would report them stolen)

Selling a good to then report it stolen is multiple crimes (at least fraud, probably contempt of court, obstruction of justice, conspiracy to falsely implicate another in a crime, framing, tampering, etc) and will collectively get you so many years in prison it might as well be for life. Intel is not a person, it is a corporation full of people and as such it is entirely possible for one employee to report something stolen while another employee is the thief. And when conspiring to commit a crime it has to be the top managers, not the company as a whole.

When a sale of an obviously stolen processor is reported to the police they investigate. They check with ebay and find out who sold the item and arrest and question (where did you get it?) that person (based on questioning they decide on whether to press charges or not). Eventually they get to either an intel employee or an employee of a developer that works with intel. The employee stole the property of their employer and as such goes to prison (there was a recent bust of 2 intel engineers with 80k of stolen processors in their homes)

On the EXTREMELY UNLIKELY possibility that it was all a conspiracy by intel then when the intel employee is arrested he avoids prison by blowing the whistle on his boss's scheme, who then goes to prison for all these crimes. However I don't think there has ever been such a case in a major corporation since there are too many people scrutinizing the books (who would notice such errant income and investigate) and nobody retarded enough to come up with such a scheme would ever make CEO (they are smart enough to stick to crimes which get them a slap on the wrist not years in prison).

 

[slightlyhuman]

Oh wow, great red fellas. Had no idea they were illegal. Saw them on ebay and was curious.

Knowledge is power.

:beer;

 

[Zap]

Knowledge is power.

Yeah. I used to be in the dark about this too.

 

[Idontcare]

On the EXTREMELY UNLIKELY possibility that it was all a conspiracy by intel then when the intel employee is arrested he avoids prison by blowing the whistle on his boss's scheme, who then goes to prison for all these crimes. However I don't think there has ever been such a case in a major corporation since there are too many people scrutinizing the books (who would notice such errant income and investigate) and nobody retarded enough to come up with such a scheme would ever make CEO (they are smart enough to stick to crimes which get them a slap on the wrist not years in prison).

Its also extremely unlikely because all it takes is for on employee who is in the loop who happens to have moral/ethical issues with the supposed fraud, or one disgruntled employee (possibly laid off, fired, skipped over for promotion, bonus wasn't to their expectations, etc), and you've got a person who is going to go to the feds, the press, anyone who will listen (Charlie D).

 

[exar333]

How is the user agreement usually written for the ESs? Is it explicit that you must retain posession of the CPUs, or are you free to share, with the expectation that when Intel wants them back you muct comply? Curious.

OP - definitely do not buy these. Even though it is unlikely (as a buyer) that you would get in legal trouble, as others pointed out, the support and quality isn't there compared a normal retail processor. At worst, you are knowingly accepting stolen property.

 

[IntelEnthusiast]

Best advise with ES processors is just don't do it. While we may not come after you if you buy one; we won't offer any support what so ever with one. http://www.intel.com/support/processors/sb/CS-030747.htm

 

[Magic Carpet]

Best advise with ES processors is just don't do it. While we may not come after you if you buy one; we won't offer any support what so ever with one. http://www.intel.com/support/processors/sb/CS-030747.htm

I don't remember a single occasion when I actually needed a "support ticket" on Intel/AMD product. I just never had the need for it. Maybe because I haven't had a processor fail on me?

If I know, I won't need the warranty, why pay for it.

 

[Meaker10]

Good luck with that, most ES chips get beat to shit by reviewers overclocking the hell out of them with high volts to see what they can top off at. I personally would rather spend the extra $80 and get a new cpu with a warranty

Holy **** that's impressive considering these chips are locked notebook CPUs that wont have been overclocked..... If these are sandy bridge CPUs.

But reviewers wont have OCed notebook CPUs either.... so really.

Why did you bother typing anything again?

 

[slightlyhuman]

Won't be buying. Why does fleabay allow them to be listed?

It was for a q9200. non-ES is over $200=[

 

[Meaker10]

No such thing as a non ES Q9200 (it was a model never released).

Great little CPUs (I still have mine.. not got around to shifting it yet) which were the same stepping as retail so had no downsides (If you got to the right QAVR stepping).

2.66ghz at 1.05v (the minimum quads allow) or 3.06ghz at 1.125v

Unlocked and raring to go.